bottle feeding from the word go! Anyone else decided not to bf

[sunglasses]

Am due to have 2nd baby in May. Will probably have planned c.s as had ecs with first dd. First time around found it really difficult to establish breastfeeding. There was just nothing there for days! Had numerous midwives etc squeezing at my breasts and either advising me to breastfeed continuously for next 24 hours!!- was in agony with nipple pain being even worse than cs recovery so didnt take too kindly to that suggestion or had 1 midwife ask if she could give some formula to baby who had been screaming with hunger for hours to allow me to get some much needed rest. I agreed and was made to feel like I had poisoned my baby by breast feeding counciller!!!
Have horrible memories of first few weeks at home, screaming and crying every time I had to feed as it was so painful. Did get better but found it very restricting and exhausting, especially as I had post partum Thyroid problems also.
Anyway this time round am seriously considering formula feeding from the start but know I will be 'advised or pursuaded' by well meaning midwives to give breastfeeding a go.
How do I go about formula feeding after giving birth? At what point do I give the first feed? is it with anormal size bottle? or those little jar things they have in hospitals? How do I get the support of staff who seem v anti formula imo.
Anyone done it recently. Really need advise so I can stick to my guns. Have a very energetic toddler to look after and it is really important for me that dh and inlaws etc can help with feeding so that I can still give time to her and make a good recovery from cs.
Please help.

have no experience of this although I did bottle feed when breastfeeding didn't work out for me, but a friend bottlefed both her babies and didn't have any issues with hospital at all. I would just make it very clear to your mw during labour that that's what you want to do, and they will provide the milk for you in hospital.

It is absolutely your decision, and if you feel you can't or don't want to breastfeed again then be assertive and don't let anyone make you feel guilty.

You are doing what is best for you and your child, as a stressed mummy isn't going to make a happy baby.

good luck xxx

You should not get a lecture by anyone if you make it clear that you will bottlefeed and that is your informed choice.
Depending on the hospital you either have to bring your own formula and bottle or they will give you the first bottle. You will feed your baby as soon as your baby is interested in feeding... it depends on the birth. Sometimes with elective sections babies are sleepy... you'll have to wait and see.
It is probably easiest to bring a carton of milk rather than powder which you have to mix.
Do ask your midwife she must answer your question.

You can still do skin-to-skin... actually you should do skin-to-skin as it is very reassuring for the baby. S-t-S is for at least 1 hour if you can manage it. Benefits are :

• Helps to calm the baby (babies are less stressed and cry less)
• Keeps the baby warm
• Steadies the baby?s breathing and heart rate
• Gives both mother and baby a chance to bond
• Helps contract the womb and minimise bleeding

Last point... do consider giving colostrum to your baby even if you decide to bottlefeed. It is packed with good stuff. Colostrum is for the first 3 days or so.
The first day you only get a tiny bit, it is far more concentrated than formula so you would give far less in quantity.

sunglasses, if you decide to ff from the start, get it written into your notes and make it clear this is not up for discussion any more. One option would be to start bf, and then see what happens...and you can get that in your notes as well.

You can give first feed straight away after the birth if you want - and there is no reason for your baby to miss out on skin to skin contact and cuddles, even if you have a section - no need to wrap the baby up in loads of covers, just get them to hand him to you after minimal wiping

If your thyroid problems were not well treated, then this might have impacted on your milk supply

Tell me more about the breastfeeding counsellor making you feel you had poisoned your baby? was this a counsellor from one of the voluntary organisations or another midwife? What did they say? No breastfeeding counsellor should make a mother feel this way.

Good midwives should be able to support you, but you cannot expect anyone to say formula feeding is the same as breastfeeding, or to pretend how you feed your baby doesn't matter...that should not prevent anyone from treating you with respect and accepting you are a grown up and can make up your own mind, even so

sunglasses. i had a CS - they took DS to be cleaned up etc, then given to my DH whilst i was being stitched up. Then given straight to me.

Taken to ward and was offered a huge range of formula - i wanted my DS on SMA - so they they got one of the jar with a teat and off we went. All of the people i met were great.

Thanks for advice. It was the first few days that were particularly hard. My dd,s latch was very strong!! and she just didnt let go. If any colostrum was coming out it certainly wasnt enough to satisfy her so thats what I was worried about second time round.
If I dont breastfeed what do I do should my milk come in re sore boobs etc?

pads and a brave face... it'll come and go...

sorry i dont mean to be quite so short today...

I bottle fed from birth. Dh gave dd her first bottle whilst I ws being stitched up. Hospital provided formula of choice.
Good luck

Just to say something about skin to skin...I had in my notes that , incase of C-section, I wanted dh to do the first skin to skin as soon as possible...and that is what happened when it came to it!
Quite funny for dh to have to strip down still in the theaterI know my dh found it a really nice experience, dispite the circumstances

tiktok-the breastfeeding councillor was very nice and well meaning but she did say it was as though i had given my baby morphine when i declared how relieved i was that the baby and myself had finally slept for 3 hours!
I do feel guilty for not giving breastfeeding another go but this time around I was trying to look at creating the best scenario for the whole family- i.e less pressure on myself, more involvement from other family members and help my first child feel she is still getting enough attention as well as looking after a new baby in a complete way that takes the focus off a purely 'feeding' basis.
Skin to skin advice is very useful and I would definately like to do this
re thyroid problem -it is something that has been a problem for me off and on for past 6-7 years, exascerpated by pregnancy and flaring up again post partum- no one ever mentioned it may impact on milk supply but it definately makes sense. I just felt completely drained for months and breastfeeding always took around an hour. My baby never latched off naturally- I always had to break the latch or she fell asleep and I never had leaking breasts. Also tried to express and this also never gave me much so I think supply was always an issue for me. I envied friends who could pop their baby on one breast for 15 mins and then settle them to sleep for 3 hours. I would give it another go if I thought it would be like this but am put off by first time.

Aw, sunglasses, what a thing for the bfc to say. It's related to the fact that cows milk proteins have been shown to stimulate the body's own opiates (I haven't checked this, so I hope I have got it right) which is why babies sometimes sleep a long time on formula....but one would not tell a new mother this in terms of 'giving your baby morphine'

Can you tell me if she was from one of the voluntary organisations or was she a midwife?

Wd it be possible for you to speak to a doc about getting thyroid levels checked and possibly treated?

The mothers who feed their babies for 15 mins and then have 3 hrs sleep from their babies are vanishingly rare - this is a highly unusual pattern. Don't feel that is a standard to which many people can aspire

I hope you don't mind me butting in here sunglasses, but I did just want to say that it is possible to breastfeed and give other children plenty of attention - I breastfed my dd after a section with two older children to look after and I don't think they missed out at all. If your partner is going to be around to help out with feeding then they can help in other ways like holding the baby after a feed so you can spend time with your older child, take the baby and give you an hour or two's extra sleep and after the first few weeks you can always express and get him to give a bottle. In some ways breastfeeding is easier because you have a spare arm to hold a book for the toddler, wipe a bottom, use the remote control etc. With bottles you need both hands (I always thought there was a market for some sort of device that straps on to your head and holds the bottle for you )

By all means choose formula if that's what you actually want, but it would be a shame to do it because you think you wouldn't manage otherwise

Thanks for that tiktoc and daisymoo. I will give it a lot of consideration before finally deciding. The breast feeding councillor was at the hospital but I think independant. I do think it is a shame that you are meant to feel so awful for not breast feeding, after all neither myself or husband were breastfed and we are both perfectly ok healthwise and intelligence wise etc. My daughter on the other hand who I b.f for 4 months has had almost continuous ear and chest infections and has now been referred to a specialist.
As for doing other things with a spare hand whilst b.f !! I had such a wriggly baby I felt like I was wrestling her with my whole body to try and keep her in place. She would fall off and I would try and hold her little head in position whilst scooping at my boob with the other hand to try and get the two together!! Made breast feeding in public v. difficult.
Anyway perhaps I had a particularly difficult first time ( however I am proud I persevered for 4 months) and I am just seeking a different experience this time around.
Will let you all know how I get on.

Sunglassses - every pregnancy, every birth and every breastfeeding experience is different... it may go better or worse...

A mum I supported - who is also a mumsnetter - never managed to BF her first and god did we try hard!!!... her 2nd... not a problem!
Another mum I saw this AM wither 1 week old sais to me how so different her 2 babies were and "this one latched on so easily!"
I also know mums who found the 2nd or 3rd baby much harder work... they're all different.

hi. i thought you'd like to read my story :-) when i had my first baby i was determined to breastfeed. anyway to cut a long story short, she was permanenetly glued to my flat nipples which eventually became shredded into pieces and fell off, i cried and screamed and yelled and wanted to kill her during every feed, i was admitted to a&e for a breast abscess the size of an orange, was stuck in hospital for 2 weeks where they stuck needles in my lumps without anaesthetic to drain the pus out, i was screaming in pain ,eventually had an operation put to sleep, woke up to find 4 tubes sticking out of my breast to drain the abscess, and was left with a little hole in my breast and am now permanently scarred, for life, by breastfeeding. when i became pregnant a year later i had nightmares about my new baby biting my nipples off. i put it in my notes that i wouldnt want to breastfeed and i bit anyones head off if they dared suggst i try it. i couldnt forget the pain and the agony and the emotional trauma. when my little girl was born 10 weeks ago i gave her a first feed because she literally jumped onto my nipple and latched on like a little expert. no sore nipples!!! no latch problems!! no long feeds- just 5 minutes feeds every two hours, a contented baby and healthy nipples. I never thought i'd breastfeed again, neer mind LOVE breastfeeding. all i am saying is, you never know how EASY this might be, i hope i havent offended you or upset you in anyway.. just thought i'd share my story.

I have no experiance with bottlefeeding but don't let those midwives bully you. Do what you think is best for you and your baby

oh yes and i have a toddler who is turning two soon and is really hyperactive (you know the kind who destory everything they touch and needs watching 24/7 )

sorry to add more my first ws born by elective section which i hated then i gave birth naturally to my second which i hated by the way i was induced and went 3 weeks over my due date coz i didnt want anyone to bully me into another c section or indcution although i wish i had just had another section sometimes as labour was horrendous... GOOD LUCK!!!

rainbow, what a great story....seems your baby made the decision for you

Bless!

yep, disgusting habit imo, I bottlefed all my kids

Are you a troll from putney, peeved?

Only a quick post but if you want to FF then do so - and don't let MW, HV or the BFing mafia persuade you otherwise.

ahere's my answers to your specific questions;

How do I go about formula feeding after giving birth?
Tell MW you want to FF, but take in a premade up pack of formula and a couple of sterlised bottles in case they are arsy/militantly BF.
Make sure you and DH know how to pour milk into bottle and rescrew lid - sounds daft i know but i got it wrong first time around.
do trial runs with sterlising equipment before going into hospital.

At what point do I give the first feed? as soon as you can and do it skin to skin, I'd recomend a 4oz bottle to start with.
The little jar things wiht screw on teats are great if you have them in your hospital.

How do I get the support of staff who seem v anti formula imo.
you may have to accept that you need to work it out yourself. Try and have a sitdown talk with your MW, but if she is very blinkered and patronising then dont' feel guilty about lying to her and just do your own thing when baby arrives.

Insist on being left alone with DH to feed and then they can't 'tut tut' at you.

hospital bag:
4 cartons of premade formula in your chosen brand.
4 4oz bottles presterlised
milton sterlising tablets just in case
2 spare teats sterlised and kept in travel case (avent teats often come with a case to keep them in)

At home
more premade formula, if you get 9oz cartons you can do 2 4-5oz bottles at a time and the second bottle will keep for 24 hrs in the fridge.

you'll need about 8 bottles in total, i'd go for 6 4oz ones and a couple of larger 9oz ones to start with.

Sterlising equipment - I'd recomend a steam steriliser, but failing that boiling things in a pan for 5 minutes is fine.

powdered formula

new clean jug, whisk and spoon for bottlemaking.

bottle warmer
coolbox

I found the cool box invaluable as it functioned as a mini fridge keeping premade milk fresh for 8hrs overnight,

btw i love the fact that people have STILL tried to lecture you on why you should at least 'try' BFing! ignore them! you've made your decision and its very patronising of them to offer unasked for advice and instructions.

If you want any tips or hints or just to ask stuff I've successfully FF for 2 yrs now and DS and me, DS and DH, and DS and GP have lovely quiet bonding feed times

• CAT me or email [email protected]

sunnyjim - I'm responded on your other thread...I think your info here for the OP is very good, but please don't use the term breastfeeding 'mafia'. It has caused a lot of distress in the past (see archives).