totally conflicting advice by mw and hv re carrying on or stopping bf in 13 day old baby. any help appreciated

[gigglinggoblin]

i have been given the following advice by mw and hv. i dont know if either of them have had much training in bf and i dont know what to believe or do. ds is 13 days old, was 9lb11 at birth, is now 8lb 15.5. was 8lb12 on day 6, 8lb13.5 2 days ago so he is now putting on weight but i dont know when this started. we have no routine, he wants to snack/sleep all day and even tho this is baby no 4 i am completely lost. any help from anyone who knows anything? i dont really want to stop bf but i dont want to starve my baby either. tia

if i exclusively bf i will make enough milk

i am not making enough milk

dont worry about him not being back to birth weight by 2 weeks

he needs to be back to birth weight by 2 weeks

i can carry on exclusively bf

i can either top up with formula after 20 minutes on each boob or i can just give formula

sma and aptimal are the best formula

bf can take a while to establish after cs

general anaesthetic has messed up bf completely

You need tik tok
calling tik tok where are you???????????
inmho though she sounds like she doesnt have a clue your health visitor, have you tried a breast feeding help line? they normally give you phone numbers when you come out of hospital,if not phone your mat ward and ask them for numbers.hth good luck

gigglinggoblin first of congrats on you baby! You are still in early days in bf and you are doing good so far. Both my DC lost weight for the first 6 days, then started putting on weight. Looking at the weights you listed it looks about the same for you. Milk takes time to come in.

You say he is putting on weight now, how are the nappies? If you let him feed as much as he wants, when he wants and really want to continue, then keep going.

I'm not an expert (I'm sure on will be along) but fed my 2 DC for over a year, so sounds to me as if you are doing good.

f i exclusively bf i will make enough milk
Almost always true.

i am not making enough milk
Probably not true, and if it currently is, bf on demand will help establish supply reliably.

dont worry about him not being back to birth weight by 2 weeks

he needs to be back to birth weight by 2 weeks
Usually it is a good sign if a baby is, but there are some cases in which this might not be a bad sign (please correct me if wrong, anyone - same goes for any of my answers)

i can carry on exclusively bf
Yes! I don't see why not, atm.

i can either top up with formula after 20 minutes on each boob or i can just give formula
Avoid if you want bf to work.

sma and aptimal are the best formula
They probably just have the best marketing to health professionals.

bf can take a while to establish after cs
yes - as after epidural, a long labour and various other situations. It can be done, though!

general anaesthetic has messed up bf completely
It might not have helped, but it doesn't have to be the end.

It is absolutely normal for a baby of this age to be feeding more or less constantly! Please don't try to think of routines yet.

I am not an expert, so it would be a very good idea to contact a bf counsellor (and/or bump this until tiktok comes along).

Good luck!

it only a couple of weeks, you need to keep going.
if dc is gaining weight you are doing everything right. to establish a good supply you need to feed when the baby wants it.
ds2 was stuck to me 24/7 to start with.

i have found hv don't want the bother of helping.

Oh, and your ds was big, so I'd be less worried about his weight situation than if my ds (6lb 2 at birth) had not regained his birthweight by 2 weeks.
Are the nappies properly wet (heavy)? Lots of yellowy poos? Theseare important signs in a newborn.

thinking back i think it was a few weeks before my milk came in properly cos i can remember somedays felt like ds was never off me at all.You are doing well though stick with it i will go and search for tik tok for you.

I've heard really good things about the support available from La Leche League. I only wish I'd known about them when I was struggling to bf dd. I'll look for a link for you.

La Lache League

Both my babies lost weight after birth and didn't start gaining again until after 2 weeks. If you're demand feeding, you'll be making enough milk.

How does he seem in himself? If he's having periods of wakefullness and wet nappies / poos, and seems ok in himself, then it sounds like he's doing fine, and that your milk it absolutely doing the job.

Who is it saying to supplement? Why? is it just the weight thing? Because he is putting wieght back on, so it's not a failure to thrive, and he's a good size still.

I had a hv who told me to supplement feed my newborn as she was little, and i'm so glad i ignored her!

If you need reassurance, you could call the NCT breastfeeding helpline or LLL. (sorry don't have the numbers but you could google them). A bf counsellor might be able to give you a bit more confidence about it all and give you some advice.

It's so hard being given conflicting advice and just wanting to do what's best, but in my opinion, it would be a shame to stop bf, if its going well and you're keen to keep feeding him yourself. Good luck x

It sounds like he's probably fine, and bf is going well. Is he making lots of pooey and wet nappies? Does he seem fine, to you?

Did you BF your previous children?

If you want to carry on breastfeeding, I'd carry on as you are. Babies do want to snack and sleep all the time. It's what they do.

thanks for replies.

not so many dirty nappies, but definately wet enough. he is very alert and seems well apart from being rather windy (prob due to lack of dirty nappies). mw said there are no rules about how much weight they should put on, but the 2oz in last 2 days appears to not be enough as she is the one saying to give formula. hv is coming on monday, am wondering if i should keep bf and see how weight is then.

did not know about helplines, will give them a try, thanks

What about ringing a LLL for advice ?
www.laleche.org.uk/pages/about/helpline.htm
Call 0845 120 2918

Here is the link for Kellymom website with loads of information on breastfeeding
www.kellymom.com/bf/supply/enough-milk.html#enough

from the Kelly site...
Baby should regain birth weight by 10 days to 2 weeks. If your baby lost a good bit of weight in the early days, or if your baby is sick or premature, it may take longer to regain birth weight. If baby does not regain birth weight by two weeks, this is a sign that the breastfeeding needs to be evaluated.

Always figure weight gain from the lowest point rather than from baby's birth weight.

Baby needs to be weighed on the same scale with the same amount of clothing (preferably naked) each time to get an accurate picture of weight gain. Different scales can give very different readings (I've personally seen a difference of a pound in two different scales);

My ds didn't regain his birth weight until he was 4 weeks old and I had c-section and had no problem establishing bf (was lucky to have great support though). He also fed like a demon - an hour at time, every 2 hours.

LLL website is excellent, they say 4 - 7oz per week gain, which would make 2oz in 2 days fine by my calculations

different scales have been used each time so i suppose that could make a difference.

thank you for all replies, i am thinking maybe the advice i have been given today isnt great. hv was the more optimistic one so will wait til i see her on monday before changing what i am doing. is reassuring to know mine isnt the only one who doesnt tick all their little boxes

My dd didn't regain her birthweight until at least 3 weeks.

I think it's a good idea to wait until you see the HV again. The LLL telephone helpdesk is also supposed to be excellent.

at the conflicting advice, GG.

If your baby has not been weighed properly ie on calibrated digital scales then we have no clue what his weight is or what it's been doing. Such small differences - the 1.5 oz you have noted in 2 days - are not monitorable with poor weighing or poor scales.

You will only make enough milk if the baby feeds frequently and removes the milk effectively - and time of reaching birthweight is less important than effective feeding and some weight gain.

Your GS will not have messed up your bf but it may have made things a bit slower to get going.

A baby shows he is transferring milk effectively by producing plenty of wet nappies, and several soft yellow poos a day, plus some weight gain. If there's concern about your baby's intake, then he may need to feed more often and he may need amendments to the way he positions and attaches on the breast, and someone who knows what they are looking for needs to observe a feed from start to finish to assess this.....contact one of the helplines, but remember they are volunteers and may not be able to do this obs immediately, and you can also contact your midwife and ask her how you can get this sort of assessment (bf support group, bf clinic, a colleague....).

Good luck with this.

my worry is that he isnt removing milk too well as he tends to fall asleep fairly quickly. however i do notice a big difference in my breasts after he has had a feed, so i think he is removing a fair amount when i keep waking him up.

he didnt have a dirty nappy for quite a while after he was born, which has been put down to him emptying his bowel before birth (there was a lot came out!). its only in the last few days he has really started producing anything.

i will ask about a bf support group and get someone to watch before i decide to give formula, thanks for the advice

Hi, I just wanted to say that I had a similar thing with my DS who lost loads of his birth weight within the first 2/3 weeks of breastfeeding. I was really really worried and initially felt under a lot of pressure from health visitor and even DH to give up bf and use formula (which I really didn't want to do).

As DS' nappies were always nice and wet and he was otherwise a happy contented baby I decided to stick with it..and am happy to say that we continued to bf until he was 12 mths (when he decided to wean himself off breastmilk).

Despite his heavier than average birth weight he has always been on the lower end of the weight scale but I'm not convinced these are an accurate reflection of weight for breastfed babies anyway.

Many hospitals have a bf support group. Phone your hospital and ask to speak to the lactaction adviser/infant feeding co-ordinator and see if they can help.

BTW my DS didn't reach his birth weight until he was around 6-8 weeks old from what I can remember

Is it only these comments that have caused you to question you bf capabilities? Were you happy enough before the advice

It seems that you and baby are doing absolutely fine. He is gaining weight, peeing and happy enough.

If you are happy with how things are going, ignore their advice and if you are worried get real advice from people you really know about bf (nct and la leche for eg)

thanks for all the backup, it really helps to know people dont think im starving my child! am a bit paranoid now as i was really stubborn about not having a hospital birth and then i ended up with emergency cs, if i hadnt been so stubborn we prob would have known there were problems before it got to that point. so now i have a lot less confidence

i was fairly sure we were doing ok, we are a bit tired atm (obviously) which isnt helping but the mw today was so certain he needed formula it has made me question myself. dh had to go out before she left, but we have talked and he said she seemed quite old fashioned and he wasnt worried about ds so i feel better for his support too! i only saw the hv on mon so she must have known he wouldnt get back to birth weight in 4 days and she didnt recommend formula so im sticking with her advise and the advise from here.

am quite surprised that so many people dont fit the text book 'rules' and they are still insisting they are correct. i feel very sorry for mums who dont have support other than that offered by mw

gigglinggoblin I just wanted to say that I think you are doing tremendously well. I had a CS and ended up feeding dd1 for years . your baby sounds completely normal, neither of mine ever had any sort of routine and still don't tbh

GG - are there any Baby Cafes near you ?

Try also your local LLL group. They WILL know what they are talking about.

Best wishes, you sound like you are doing absolutely fine, bf whenever your baby wants to including at night, latch him often, etc. You have ENOUGH milk even for a huge baby or triplets, no problems at all !

If he falls asleep ALL the time, it is important to wake him, let him have a full feed on both breasts if poss. Sometimes they do fine on just one breast at a time, but if really hungry my ds would take both.

GG I totally agree about the advice being given out that doesn't bear much relevance to what really happens. It confuses you in a time when you have far too much to think about and worry about. I think I stopped avidly reading the books and leaflets when ds was about 4/5 weeks old because I realised they never give you the answer you are searching for. Gut instinct counts for a lot.