Is it worth carrying on trying?

[NineUnlikelyTales]

Hi
This is my first post on mumsnet and I would be really grateful for your support.
My DS (11 weeks today)would not latch on after the birth because of a traumatic delivery and really awful care at the hospital where they upset us both and put DS off my breasts completely. I have been really lucky in that I can express more than enough for him to be exclusively breastmilk fed, but it is such hard work and we are missing out on the other benefits of breastfeeding. I am desperate for him to feed from the breast!

I have been in contact with the most wonderful BF counseller from the LLL and she has helped us to get to the stage where my DS will sometimes latch on and feed. 3 weeks ago he was taking one feed a day from the breast, which was fantastic except that I had thrush so it was agony. I have now cured the thrush but took a break for a week from feeding, and now I am finding that he will either latch on but only for a few minutes, or worse, can't seem to latch on at all. The situation is getting worse every day.

I have tried all of the LLL suggestions and believe me, this kind lady has gone out of her way to find ways to help us. I am now getting to the stage where I feel - he is 11 weeks old, is this ever going to work? If I could just see some light at the end of the tunnel I would gladly carry on trying, but at this moment in time I can't see that light.

I know from reading these boards for a few days that you are a fantastic supportive bunch and I would be grateful for your honest opinions and your support.
Many thanks,

Nine

No help, but respect!! Expresing is bloody hard work and 11 weeks solid is brilliant.

Hi Nine sorry I dont have an answer for you but I didnt want this to go unanswered. I would keep trying with your DS but dont beat yourself up over it if it doesnt work. You are doing AMAZINGLY well to be expressing that much to begin with so you have given your little one a wonderful start in life. Well done!

Gosh you've had a hard time.

I would say persevere, is the LLL lady still giving you hands on help IYSWIM?

I had one to one help from La Leche as well and it took a good few months befoe I could say I had cracked feeding dd2. I 'only' bf dd1 for 10 weeks and she was mixed fed - so I was determined to bf dd2 more successfully - dd2 is nearly 10 months.

What do you think is the problem with the latch? Flat nipples, engorgemnet of breasts, lo not openeing wide enough etc ?

Hopefully, more helpful mners will come along and give help - I've found La Leche very helpful.

Hope it works out for you - don't give up yet - it becomes a joy (and dead easy) honest!

Hello Nine, and another shedload of awe coming your way - you have done so well to keep going. As for the 'is it worth it' question, I'm sorry to cop out but only you can decide. If you want, I will be the 'YES YES YES' cheerleader.

The answer is YES because you know how fantastic your milk is for your baby and I bet your LLL bf counsellor can get the feeding going again. My guess is that without the whole miserable thrush epsiode, you would have been up and running by now, but from the sound of it she (LLL lady) is a good egg and will be only too pleased to help you again. If you can make one more big push to get totally breastfeeding (without the expressing/sterilising I mean) then the whole thing becomes easy and natural instead of this huge effortful hurdle. You don't have to plan in advance, you can feed anywhere with no preparation and save yourself a small fortune too. I'm going to post this before I manage to delete it (my party trick).

just an example

If you google breastfeeding and advantages, or similar, there is a ton of info reminding you why you are doing this.

If you can possibly afford it I would somehow scrape together the money to hire a lactation consultant. They can work miracles and the money you spend will hopefully save the amount you could end up spending on formula or expressing equipment.

I also have great admiration for you for what you have managed so far. If you try everything possible and get no further, you have given your baby the best possible start by giving him your milk for this period.

How are you doing, Nine?

Hi

Sorry for not responding earlier, it's been a mad couple of days.

Thanks so much everyone for your kind words. I am pretty stunned myself that I have managed to keep expressing for so long. Like I said, I am lucky with my milk supply. I only have to express 6 times a day and there is far more than my DS can possibly eat. Sometimes I feel like changing my name to Daisy

I think the problem with the latch is flat-ish nipples, DS not opening his mouth wide enough and having nipple confusion. Plus my breasts go really soft and floppy as soon as any milk is taken, and my nipples and areola(sp?)are quite soft and floppy in texture.

I am feeling more positive about BF happening today. I am going to try really hard this week and devote as much of my time as possible to it.

Thanks again everyone!
Nine

ps How do I go about finding a lactation consultant for hire, and what do they do?

...forgot to add, that I would carry on expressing indefinitely even if the BF never worked out. My DS had to have formula in hospital when he wouldn't latch on, and I hated it with a passion. As I am able to express, I would definitely carry on. It's just that it would make my life so much easier to feed direct from the breast, and we would have all the extra benefits of the bonding, etc.

I do feel like such a failure for not managing to BF yet I never expected to have any problems, how naive I was!

Nine

I think if tiktok were here she would probably suggest lots of skin to skin contact, cuddling up in bed and trying to relax. If she's around then she'll be able to give really good advice- might be worth bumping this tomorrow. Good luck, sounds like you're doing brilliantly

I had similar problems with my DS - sleepy after the birth, poor latch, very rough handling from the mws intro of formula & bottle at 1 day & 3 days respectively. So by the time we got home at 4 days after the birth he was physically afraid of and totally confused by my boobs and refused to feed from them at all. I had to express & feed ebm for about a month before he would take milk from me direct. I ended up using nipple shields for about 3 months to achieve this as he had got so used to the feel of silicon (we joked at the time that he would grow up to love Jordan )& wouldnt feed from me otherwise. It was a hard battle but very very worth it & he is still feeding loads now at 29 months.

I would definately go back to the LLL lady & ask for more help if she has been of help & you got on with her before. If she cant offer you any help then call someone else & keep calling (all the orgs - LLL, NCT, ABM, BfN) until you find someone to help. There are a couple of thousand bfcs in the country so there are plenty of people who can help you!

I owe my bfing to the help a LLL leader gave me (as well as the support DH gave me & a lot of determination on my part!), but it did take quite a few looong sessions on the phone with her for us to try everything - she always gave me a few things to try each time so as not to overwelm us. I also went along to my local LLL meetings for support & encouragement, which gave me the kick up the backside I needed to keep trying.

Well done you for getting this far - keep going - it is soooo worth it!

Nine, I have nothing to add

I am pretty sure the LLL person would say the same as me.

Direct bf can happen, even this far on....I have seen it happen with dedicated, motivated mothers.

Get back in touch with LLL if you need to, but otherwise, carry on doing what you are doing with lots of togetherness, co-bathing, cuddling, co-sleeping.....

Just to say that I have been there too with ds1. We had a difficult birth and then he was sleepy and jaundiced and had to be bottle fed at hospital to stop dehydration. It was awful because one minute the midwives were encouraging us to give a bottle and the next the bf cousellor saying how bad it was to give any bottles in the early days....like you I hadn't contemplated not being able to bf and we didn't even own a sterilliser or any bottles at that stage.

Then we got home and ds wouldn't latch on very often, preferring the bottles. I expressed for around 10 weeks with mixed feeds of formula and breast milk and after that had to go fully to formula as was getting too tired with the regime.

You are doing a fantastic job expressing - it's such a big commitment. Good luck with your attempts at bf this week. Just to add, I now have a dd who is nearly 3 weeks and things have been different this time. I had a straightforward, quick birth and she bf quickly after the birth and we've managed to continue since then without too many problems (touch wood). Just seems to me now that bf success in the early days is so much linked to the birth and post birth experience and so it's not fair that so many women (including me the first time round) feel that they've completely failed when bf is more difficult.

LexB and Terramum, I think you are both right - a difficult birth and the rubbish treatment that mums sometimes get in hospital does make it 100% harder to BF. IF (and it is a big if) I ever have any more children, it is reassuring to know that it can work better second time round.

The LLLLL (lovely LLL lady) came round this morning and we worked out some of the reasons why the latch has deteriorated recently, which is good because at least we can work on that. Plus she was able to reassure me that there is still a good chance we can BF. As I said before, I can carry on if I see a glimmer of hope, and I can see one now so that is okay.

So, it's back to lots of skin to skin, co-sleeping (we do that anyway, couldn't think of doing anything else!) and all the other things. We'll keep plugging away at it and hopefully we will make some progress this week. Fingers crossed...and if anyone feels like remembering us in their prayers, that would be fantastic.

Thanks again everyone, will let you know how we get on.

Nine

Just wanted to let everyone know that my DS is making progress - tonight he latched on and fed for 10 minutes really well, without any fussing.

I'm so glad I persevered - thanks again for your support! I am going to Oxford to a breastfeeding clinic after Christamas, where apparently they have a lot of success in cases like ours.

Happy Christmas!

Nine