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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

4 day old baby - need experienced mum advice!

31 replies

Drmum83 · 15/01/2015 18:46

TIA for any help you can offer!
I'm trying to breast feed my 4 day old daughter. She's sleepy as expected at this age (bilirubin normal yesterday and 7% weight loss only so not worried re jaundice ) and we're doing the stripping/tickling feet etc to try to keep her awake.
My milk has come in in last 24 hours. I have been expressing to try to build up supply and today I'm getting 20mls off total every 3 hours. We are cup feeding this and topping up with formula.
She will latch but this is a bit of a game and she gets upset very quickly and pulls off. I'm not even sure her efforts are giving her much milk at all.
I'm worried we're gonna be stuck in expressed/cup/poor latch cycle forever...
Also, she hasn't pooed for 24 hours, lots of farting though and wetting nappies.
She has been checked for tongue tie.
Are my concerns normal, is this a case of just needing to persevere?
Please help!! Thank you!

OP posts:
Bippidee · 15/01/2015 18:51

Congratulations on your newborn!

Hang on in there. It gets a lot easier.

I had 3 weeks of terrible latching, so we used ebm through feeding tube taped to my finger. Once the ebm had finished and she'd burped, I'd offer boob, and she got the hang of it eventually.

Don't forget, it's a skill you BOTH have to learn,it is not innate.

Good luck, and it sounds like you are doing all the right things.

Lagoonablue · 15/01/2015 18:51

They don't take much at this age. Just keep offering the breast. Lots of skin to skin to encourage her. If she is not losing weight and weeing then not sure you should offer a cup.

Wouldn't bother expressing either. It's a pain and you don't need to whole your supply is settling down IMO.

Maybe ring a helpline to get more expert advice.

BFing is great but can take a while to crack.

squizita · 15/01/2015 20:52

Their tummies are very small at this stage- thimble sized! So don't worry if she hardly takes any.
Big rock hard boobs can be hard to latch to - did the mw tell you to express? Because it could be making them bigger/harder/rounder iyswim. My mw told me just to feed little and often to boost supply and only express for comfort or if they were too hard to latch. This way my supply was enough for a tiny baby.

NickyEds · 15/01/2015 20:53

I'd give your mw a call if no poo has emerged by the morning or give one of the helplines a call. A bf baby should poo at least once a day for the first few days then 3/4 times a day from around 4 ish days. The spreading out of poos comes a bit later.

squizita · 15/01/2015 20:56

Re the poo - mine didn't poo for a day early on. The mw was only bothered if it got to 2 days as she had previously done a yellow poo and was weeing enough.
Also why are you topping up and cup feeding? Is there a feeding problem? Sorry just I was told NOT to do anything but boob if there wasn't a need to.

Thatsnotmypiglet · 15/01/2015 20:59

Flowers Congratulations!

It gets easier!!! Hang on in there. At this age they are virtually parked on your boobs. Feed, feed, feed to build supply.

Speak to mw about your concerns.

Keep posting, there's great support on here x

callamia · 15/01/2015 21:07

You're doing a lot! Why are you topping up? Are you sure that you need to? I think spending a lot of time getting used to feeding is ok right now.

Don't worry about expressing (unless they are too hard to latch on to), just get yourself cosy and feed as often as you can. The best advice I was given was to feed everytime the baby wakes up, or seems even slightly interested or crotchety.

Snuggle in, get a lot of water on hand and a decent portion of cake and get the pair of you used to what you're doing. If it really hurts you, or there's still no poo soon, then do contact your HV or mw. Breastfeeding cafes are also an absolute help when you're feeling unsure and anxious.

annielewis · 15/01/2015 21:13

OP congratulations! Breastfeeding can be a bugger to get the hang of!

Just a thought but has anyone checked your baby for tongue tie? It can make it very hard for them to latch, both of mine were tongue tied and I had immense struggles breastfeeding first time round!

Ask your MW, maybe give them a ring if they're not visiting you tomorrow. If there's no one on your team who can assess baby they should be able to point you in the right direction!

Good luck.

AliceInHinterland · 15/01/2015 21:16

I agree that time spent expressing is time that you could be snuggling the baby encouraging them to feed, the baby should be more successful at getting milk than a pump. You need rest, lots to drink & eat (oats!) in order to breastfeed successfully. I didn't use it, but perhaps this article on suck training is worth a try here. Congratulations, I'm sure you're doing an amazing job!

Hakluyt · 15/01/2015 21:24

Why are you topping up? Honestly, you don't need to. Just relax and feed-you both need to practise. You'll get the hang of it, I promise, but she needs to feed loads to build up supply. Make yourself a nest with drinks, snacks, books, phone and TV remote and just cuddle and feed and doze.

DillyDallyDaydreamer · 15/01/2015 21:24

Your doing great.i. Sure you already know this but a bit of sunlight really helps jaundice (if you can find any in January). Feeding I'd be tempted to have a bath or shower before a feed and hand express a little bit of milk to make it easier to latch on. Ummmm trying to think of anymore advice lots of skin to skin you should be watching telly and eating and drinking it's an early breast feeding requirement.

DillyDallyDaydreamer · 15/01/2015 21:25

Oh and for most people it gets so much easier this is the hardest part.

BertieBotts · 15/01/2015 21:28

At 4 days you should still be under care of midwives - please do request a home visit ASAP to help with the latch. Even if you can only get it working in one position it's worth it.

Who checked her for tongue tie and how did they check?

BertieBotts · 15/01/2015 21:30

And yep. First days are tricky. She's learning and so are you. If you didn't have a section, look up "biological nurturing" or "laid back latching" to help her find a natural latch - it's quite amazing to see. (It can be uncomfortable after a c-section as the baby can kick you in the incision area).

rootypig · 15/01/2015 21:32

Agree - quit expressing (who told you you needed to? four days is too early to have an opinion on supply), concentrate on your baby, get on the phone to your community midwife team and arrange a home visit from someone who is knowledgeable about breastfeeding.

rootypig · 15/01/2015 21:36

And congrats on your LO Flowers

tobytoes · 15/01/2015 21:41

My dd fed every hour when she was a newborn, I just sat on the sofa all day feeding, she never had much either. Just relax and enjoy the time with your newborn,don't think so much. Good luck

MoJangled · 15/01/2015 21:44

Agree re getting a second view on the tongue tie. DS was checked at birth and I was told he had a mild one but it wouldn't be a problem. Major major problem which I won't give you the scary details about but 3 weeks later I was told by a breastfeeding specialist (the 3rd I'd seen) that it was a serious tie and referred for a snip, which was over in seconds and we never looked back. I think TT is quite hard to diagnose accurately on tiny babies so worth getting someone to double check.

But as PP have said, hopefully nothing to do with this at all and it will all click soon. You're doing absolutely the right thing to check early. Enjoy your beautiful baby!

Purpleflamingos · 15/01/2015 21:50

Take a breath and relax. Find a bf position that works for both of you. I didn't alter mine for 3weeks, by which time we both felt a bit more confident. I liked lying in bed on my side, propped up slightly by my arm or a pillow. I kept the mantra, 'tummy facing tummy, nose to nipple' at every feed. Being in bed meant we could do skin to skin contact too, and once dc was latched on I could watch tv or doze. Talk to your midwife too.

RedToothBrush · 15/01/2015 22:08

Don't give up!!! Well give it a few more days if you can hang in there.

Day 4, I went to pieces for similar reasons. It was a particular hard day as its when your hormones really kick in and its difficult to be rational about anything. It got better.

She hardly needs any milk at this stage. I wouldn't say to top up with formula, if you are managing to feed her because if you do, what will happen is her stomach will expand and you'll find it very difficult to satisfy her with breast milk alone. Formula and breast milk are very different consistencies.

I would disagree with everyone saying 'don't express' for a few reasons. Firstly at day 4, I was massively engorged and it made it even harder to get DS to latch. I had a lot of problems getting him to latch and he made me sore in the process. Expressing using an electric pump helped relieve that problem slightly. It also gave me a bit of a break when he'd mauled me and it became too painful to try and get him to latch. It depends on your individual circumstances, but it worked for me.

Unfortunately I didn't manage to get him to breastfeed straight away. I never did properly get to the bottom of it, though a HV and doctor said he had very slight tongue tie - but only after two midwives and a paediatrician said he didn't. He also has a high palate which I believe makes it more difficult. My point being that tongue tie can be hard to spot, so if you continue to have problem seek a second (or indeed third) opinion as to why you are having problems.

In my case, DS's latch remained poor, and I ended up expressing long term. Then at 16 weeks something clicked. He started being able to feed without giving me pain. I'm led to believe that whilst this is unusual its not unique. He simply learnt and the physical problems he had seemed to resolve themselves as he grew.

I appreciate this is the extreme end of the scale, but it does illustrate the point about it not being straight forward and easy as you'd think and that perseverance can pay off.

Where you are now, I'm sure your emotions are all over the place and you are suffering from lack of sleep and it may well seem impossible. Hang in there if you can. But if you can't, whilst your emotions might tell you differently now, its not the end of the world if it doesn't work out for you. Be kind to yourself, and good luck.

dylanthedragon · 15/01/2015 22:18

Agree with others - if you are giving ebm and formula, she might just be full up so has no need to try to latch.

Have you tried different positions? I found the 'rugby ball' position worked best for us in the early days. DC on a pillow at my side sort of snuggled in along the length of my forearm with her head resting in my hand. I'm not describing it very well but if you Google you can see pictures of it.

isittheweekendyet · 15/01/2015 22:27

Congratulations - it's very early days, relax and just get baby on the breast as often as possible.

I'd not express - it's too early. Your body will produce the milk your baby demands so expressing may at this stage just be increasing your enforcement. This will ease in a few days as you and baby get into more of a (loosely described) routine!

It may feel that all you are doing is feeding at this stage but that's very normal. Don't worry too much about the poo - wet nappies are what's crucial at the moment. Good luck.

isittheweekendyet · 15/01/2015 22:27

*engorgement. Thanks autocorrect!!

AliceInHinterland · 15/01/2015 22:29

And yes it does get easier this graph showing that over time BF is the easier option kept me going through many a dark hour in those first few weeks!

squizita · 15/01/2015 22:44

Alice how do they measure "effort". Because surely few parents are down to 1 hour of breastfeeding a day that soon?
It is easier than making bottles but BF babies still feed either many times or for long stretches especially during growth or development leaps. I wouldn't put it at 1 or 2 hours a day till after weaning.