I really want to give up BF but feel soooo guilty and a crap mum

[Twinsplusonesurprise]

I've got twin girls, 2.5 years old and 8.5 week old baby boy. The twins are challenging, strong willed, defiant, disobedient, like normal toddlers I guess.
They have a fairly strong routine - up at 7ish, breakfast 8ish, lunch 12ish, nap 1ish til 2.30ish, tea around 5, bath around 6, bedtime around 7.
They are pretty good and fairly predictable.
The fly in the ointment - so to speak is the baby.
He has no routine, he gets up anytime, will probably have about an hours nap mid morning and probably have a couple of hours around lunchtime. Day times I can cope with - just. But night times a different story. Sometimes he'll go to bed at 7, sometimes 10, sometimes 6. I had started waking him at 10pm for a nappy change and feed in the hope it'd lead to a routine. But if he's not settled asleep til 8 I can't bring my self to wake him 2 hours later.
The twins were initially express breast fed and then on formula. By this age they were sleeping through from 10pm til 6am. This was only possible because they had fairly strict feed times which led to nap times. Feeding on demand doesn't work like that I know, this BF business has completely thrown me! Any advice, tips, encouragement please?!

This wont be helpful .... cough :) ... but I formula fed both of mine. One was a textbook 7-7 sleeper from 6 weeks ish and the other was a bloody nightmare, up every two hours wanting bottles for many, many months!

Just worth considering that regardless of feeding all babies are different.

Having said that, formula feeding worked for me. It also meant I could hand them over to dh easily!

You've got your hands full and need to do whatever makes your life easier. If I was you, that'd mean FF, so I could share feeds with dh / friends / relatives. I bf dc1, but ff dc2 and dc3 from 4 weeks because I found the older ones were running wild missing out on time with me. For me, ff also was the only way to get the routine I needed for my sanity. Don't feel guilty! What's best for kids is having a happy mum, whatever that takes.

Could you mix feed bottle at bed time bf in the day?

It's entirely up to you what you do, however I do think its worth remembering that all babies are different so what works for some might not work for others. If it's any consolation my first dd was bf and was in a very predictable routine by two weeks old and was only waking once on the night between 6pm and 7am but at 4 1/2 months it all went tits up and she started waking 3 times a night and that went on for about 4 months, it nearly killed me!!

I am currently bf dd2 who is 15 weeks old and up until about a month ago her bedtimes were really erratic but now she goes to bed bang on 6.30 and wakes once between going to bed and 6 in the morning.

It is hard work bf a baby when you have one toddler never mind 2 so you've done well so far, there are times when I think I should give up bf but then I remember I'm too lazy to sterilise etc and at the end of the day the really hard bit doesn't last forever and I'm glad I've ridden it out as dd2 has settled down nicely now.

For me it was forgetting the routine that worked. 1 and 2 were ff by that age so it was like starting again with bf ds3. I found that by keeping his Moses basket downstairs he slept or he didn't and I just brought him up when I went and he always slept really well if I fed him to sleep and left him in the bed/cot beside me. Eventually within maybe 3 months he got his own routine going.

Can you bf on a schedule?

As pp have said, formula doesn't make them sleep through, you were maybe just lucky with your twins.

Formula could give you more help as you can spread the load a bit.

Thanks everyone. It's great to hear supportive messages even if opinions are different. My DH tells me to chill out and DS will find his own way. He does feed really well and is piling on weight. DH says only reason I crave routine is for myself but that's not true. It's mostly so that I can have more sleep, more patience, calmer mealtimes and bedtimes without me constantly telling the twins off and generally feeling like a miserable old nag. Oh and we've got chicken pox too now! Joy!

Whats wrong with craving routine for yourself anyway? I'm not happy unless I can have a tea in peace during the day at some point. We're all only human. :)

Not read all so ignore if you wish but what about timed bf like ff? They are babies not world rulers,

Thanks fairylea. I think DH feels that BF is best for baby, health wise, and free. But it's so tiring and almost 8 weeks of average 3hrs sleep a night plus hangover sleepless nights from pregnancy combined with crazy busy job and energetic toddlers (not to mention I am no spring chicken) is really taking its toll now. I wonder if FF would really give me the energy and increased patience levels I think it would? Otherwise there's no point giving up BF.

Well, he's not the one doing it is he? It's very easy to have opinions when you are not going to be affected.

Does he ever get up for the baby, or is he sleeping through, almost entirely undisturbed?

Ha Jux you are right. He gets up if twins wake. Otherwise sleeps uninterrupted apart from his recent development of late night telly addict. But he says he is breadwinner now and that's the way it has to be. He has his job I have mine. He's supportive really, but it feels like he has fab lovely playtime with twins - zoo, swimming, and I'm stuck with baby, cooking, cleaning, laundry. Boring side of life that is apparently my new career.
Ouch that sounds more venomous written out than it does in my head!

My ds was formula fed in the main and was awake every three hours or less.... Given I was also tryng to bf first then express after I nearly went crazy with tiredness. Dd was bf with a bit of ff supplement in the day cos of poor weight gain and slept really well. Can I ask if it's possible to stop whatever your work is for a while? Eight week old baby and twins with a job on top seems like a nightmare! You need to cut yourself some slack I think. I also found not having to get out of bed at night to sort bottles with dd so much easier too. If your ds is feeding well it seems a shame to change it. Also, IMO 2.5 year olds don't need baths every night unless it really helps settle them. How much help are you getting from your dh? Hope it all calms down for you whatever you decide to do. Have a [tea] too.

It's still really early days and 8/9 weeks is really early to be in a routine IMO. It will get easier, I remember sobbing my heart out when my dc2 was about this age as I was exhausted but I knew it would be worth it all in the end so I kept going and I'm so glad I did. I'm not saying you should continue breastfeeding, that's a decision only you can make but maybe try combine feeding before making the desicion to switch completly. Maybe a bit of a break will give you the strength you need to carry on until you feel ready to make the switch without the guilt?

Someone else has made a good point in that it's much more effort making up bottles at 12, 3, 4, 6am then just rolling over and latching the baby on and from what you've said it sounds like your DH won't be sharing the night feeds regardless so this might just add to the exhaustion.

Well all things considered I think I'll try to carry on the way we are til Christmas and then if he's not fallen into some sort of routine I'll consider giving up again. He'll have had 12 weeks of BF which makes me feel better about it. Thanks for all posts!

I found bf easier in the night as pp have said, roll over, latch on, doze off after. What helped my mental health was to stop the whole 'she woke at this time, then went off at that time' etc, so I didn't really know how sleep deprived I was (or wasn't)

Do whatever will make your life easier, it isn't a failure to make a change that's right for you. I've had 5 DC and some were BF and some FF, I started BF with each but they all had different needs so things changed accordingly. They're all fine and happy, no one remembers whether they BF for 4 weeks or a year.

Your DH thinks the bread winner doesn't have to deal with offspring issues then does he? If my DH took that attitude he'd have his ball sack superglued to his toes... If he doesn't want to share the load then he should keep his face hole closed when you are deciding what you do with your boobs.

Where does the baby sleep? To minimize disruption to your sleep the easiest thing would be to have him by your bed so you don't have to get up when he wakes. Just pick up, put on boob, close your eyes. Don't look at the clock, don't think, do nothing other than feed and close your eyes. Don't switch to bottles: it might not help and then your sleep will be 100 times worse because you need to wake up fully to sort them out...

look at it this way.

read your op as if I wrote it. what would your advice be?
something along the lines of don't be daft, you are doing the best you can and perhaps FF at night is a good idea?

now take your own advice and stop feelling guilty!
and yes, it's that simple.

DS4 was a C-section and was jaundiced at 5 days old. he wouldn't bf so had to be given formula.
the first 8 weeks were horrendous, I had 2 bouts of mastitis, DS3 had chicken pox, then a vomiting bug went through DS1, DS2 & me then DH and finally my mum.

DS1 was in year 1, the other two (aged 3.5 & 2) at playgroup so 3 school runs a day (playgroup pick up at noon)
I honestly don't know how I survived it even though DH was home for the very first 3 weeks (inc Christmas holidays) then my mum came to stay and help for 6 weeks.
DH stayed home after that for a another week.
thats 10 weeks. I was mix feeding DS4 for this time, then I reduced bf to just evenings and when he was 3 months old I stopped bf altogether.

I wish I didn't have to stop, but I have no regrets. I did the best I could based on circumstances.

so please don't beat yourself up. feeling guilty is a waste of energy. just do what you can to cope best, if that means you stop bf then so be it!

Congratulations on new baby!

I meant DS4 wouldn't bf while being jaundice while in hospital - less than 24 hours.

I could bf after that.

Feeling sorry for you as you have a lot on your plate and now chicken pox too....aaaaahhhh! It sounds like you're surviving so far though so well done. After my DD3 was born just before the summer hols my 2yr old got chicken pox and passed it on to the baby who developed cellulitis and ended up in hospital for 4 nights. I feel your pain.....

I was like you and was desperate for routine in the early days especially with older children but annoyingly babies, and definitely second and third, aren't that bothered! I think it's the old Mumsnet favourite of 'this too will pass'. I personally think your husband's right and your DS (congrats by the way) will sete into his own pattern. Once he reaches the stage where he goes down at 7 every night I think you'll feel much better.

Do you really think changing to FF will help? Realistically how many feeds would your DH do? Are you wanting to FF as you think you can then feed to a schedule? It doesn't always work like that though.

I personally think of you can muddle through the next few weeks then it will get loads easier.

Hope the chicken pox is mild and the order if routine soon develops!

I have a toddler of similar age and a now 6mo baby so understand some of the pressure although respect for twins!!

I am bf on demand and the thought of extra time making and cleaning bottles gives me the shakes. Realistically how often is someone else there now when you feed as if you are on your own bf now then you'll be in the same position but with the extra faff of bottles.

I find it so much easier to just stick baby on a boob when needed too.and have a routine the same timing as yours but mine has dropped the nap

My way of looking at it is I have toddler and am on mat leave so my "job" currently is childcare and making sure they are fed clean and have clothes to wear. Washing up done after bedtime and anything else split 50/50with dh when he is home.

If I had to do general cleaning etc too id break down. And I'm on 5/6 hours of broken sleep each night.

His job is 9 'til 5 with lunch breaks, evenings and weekends off. Smething like that?

He can't function at work if he doesn't sleep.

He seems to think that giving birth means you've suddenly become super-human and can do a 24/7 job with only a couple of hours sleep and no proper breaks.

Write out a list of all the things you do and the hours. Laundry, shopping, childcare, cooking, cleaning, etc. Work out how much it would cost to employ people to do it, so you work the same sort of hours that he does. Sounds ridiculous but that is how he is looking at things, and he may see how ridiculous he is being if you present it to him like this.

The would help here as he seems to have jumped back to the 1950s and expects you to be the Stepford Wife.

Nip it in the bud, as that sort of attitude can evolve into something very unpleasant if allowed to carry on.

Actually in DH defense he is self employed and works from home. DS bedroom was DH office. DH now tries to work between refereeing children and often at night in wee hours.
I don't expect FF to give me more time as such - I wonder if it would free my body from making milk so make me less tired plus bottle feeding allows you to understand each feed more as you can see what baby has. Once my twins were sleeping from 11-6 I remember I felt a whole lot better.
I'll try to keep BF til holiday season and if he's not found more of a pattern I'll switch.
Oh ps the pox x 2 is horrid!