Frequency of feeds

[aliphil]

My 6 wk old DD will often feed for 45 minutes to an hour on one side and then 20-30 minutes on the other. Then she'll go anything from 2-4 hours without a feed. Is this normal? My ante-natal group met up yesterday and everyone else's babies seem to feed for shorter periods but more often.

Also, in the last couple of days she has started sucking really really hard, and it often hurts. Is this normal, or does it mean I'm not producing enough or something? She latches on well - I've got people to check that - but I keep being told it shouldn't hurt by now.

Waiting to hear back from my mother, but looking in the mirror the membrane under my tongue seems pretty big. We aren't very near Huddersfield but there seem to be doctors at several hospitals not too far away that do the procedure, if we can just persuade the GP to refer us.

Julie, thanks for the ray of hope. At the moment the thought of those pincer-like gums (and later teeth - argh!) clamping on to my nipples for that long is horrifying, but perhaps if we can get to a point where I'm not in tears at every feed I might change my mind.

My mother says I never had a tongue tie - but then she didn't know I'd had a lip tie! I suspect when she was trained TT wasn't recognised or wasn't considered important; she said all she knew about it was that a lot of people used to come to the surgery with children who were said to be tongue tied but weren't - ???!!!

Health visitor didn't seem entirely convinced this morning, which may not be surprising as DD helpfully stuck her tongue out further than I've ever seen her do before! Initially she said that as DD is gaining weight she's clearly feeding well and so it's not something we need to worry about unless it causes speech problems later, but when I emphasised the pain it's causing me she agreed to refer us for assessment. No vacancies for two weeks though.

Sorry to hear that there are no vacancies for two weeks, is this something you could consider paying privately for?

Come to think of it I had a gap in my front teeth too. Had major dental work done for another medical reason at 17 and no longer have the gap, but its there on all my childhood photos. I was ff though so DM wouldn't have suffered the pain you are experiencing.

Aaaaargh at your HV. She clearly doesn't understand about TT.

As JJJ mentions, paying for it privately is an alternative option. You would also get to choose who does it. Milk Matters (who I linked to earlier) would be able to advise you of knowledgeable people in your area, or as I said earlier, there is the Huddersfield option.

He uses laser and will also do an upper lip tie if there is one. He was trained by Dr Kotlow, so will do a good job.

DS1 had his revised earlier this year locally. We paid £2k (needed a general anaesthetic) and it wasn't done properly. We had it done again in Huddersfield at the cost of £250 + £50 for the osteopath (recommended) and the difference is amazing!

If I could turn the clock back, I know I would have travelled to get ds1's done as a baby. If only I knew then what I know now

Don't feel bad about it mawbroon, it's taken me 8 years to even realise what was up with my DS.

Money is a bit tight as I'm not working and wasn't entitled to any maternity pay/allowance, so we'd rather not go private if it's avoidable. The HV could only refer us to the local assessment place, so when we see the GP on Friday I'm going to assert our right to be referred wherever we choose (might need DH's help with that ) and see if we can get anything sooner.

I was bf, but I don't know how long for; my mother went back to work unusually early (for the 1970s). I suppose if I did have tt it could have been one that didn't cause problems, or she could just have put up with the pain.

Hope all goes well on Friday then.

Yes, perfectly possible to be tt but feed well. DS2 is living proof of that. He fed like a dream from the off.

HV phoned while we were away this week to say she couldn't get us an appointment and we should talk to the GP. GP today was very nice, lovely with DD's routine checks (all fine) and my stitches issue, but clearly not convinced about any tt. She's referring us, but had no idea how long it would take as she'd only heard about the place recently and had never referred anyone there before. I think it's the same place HV tried so probably at least two weeks. Don't know how to cope.

Really feel for you aliphil, how is she feeding now? Do you think that talking to a BFC about how you are feeling might help?

I'm a bit hesitant about that because when I went to the local breastfeeding cafe session I ended up feeling a really bad mum for not enjoying feeding DD much and not wanting her to be permanently attached. She feeds well, in that she's putting on weight and producing an appropriate number of wet and dirty nappies. It's just that she feeds for a long time (just finished a 90 minute session) and it really, really hurts.

So sorry that you ended up feeling like that. You are not a bad Mum, sounds like you have an as yet undiagnosed feeding issue and if you are in pain, you need support.

Is there a different bfing support group you could go to or a La Leche League Leader nearby? All BFC aren't the same, the last time I needed help I rang the National Bfing Helpline and the BFC was really helpful and lovely. Hope you get a nice one too.

This was a La Leche League Leader. I might try ringing the NCT one, or the National helpline as you suggest - thank you.

So, so sorry about that. I've only had to ring them twice, one I rang the NCT Line and my problem was sorted in one call and the second time I called the National Bfing line and again, they were great.

Hope you get the same luck.

I tried the local NCT counsellor but got no reply, so tried the national NCT helpline. The woman there was quite helpful and suggested a few things that apparently hadn't occurred to the HV or GP - like try nipple shields to help with the pain, and get checked for thrush. I was in tears feeding this evening, and DH said some very rude things about the local health services and then announced he wanted to fix the problem now! That might be a bit optimistic, but he went out and bought nipple shields. He has announced that we are going back to the doctor on Monday to get DD and me checked for thrush and if it's not that to kick up a big fuss about not getting a faster referral; BF-ing counsellor said most areas will do a very quick referral.

So, so glad that you've got some good suggestions this time and that your DH is being so supportive. Keep taking the painkillers and I hope all goes well tomorrow at the GPs.

The nipple shields aren't an unqualified success; they seem much too big fir my nipples and DD doesn't like them at all. Plus on one side they made me really itchy! But I've been using one on the more painful (non-itchy) side for the beginning of the feed and then taking it off once she's calmed down a bit. It doesn't do much for the pain of her gums digging in though.

This GP was slightly better than the other. She took swabs from DD and me to check for thrush, though she said it didn't look like we had it. She also didn't seem convinced about tongue tie but agreed to see if we could be referred anywhere faster. What helped most though was not being fobbed off with the idea that everything must be OK because DD is gaining weight and/or the suggestion that I could "just" express or use formula.

The secretary phoned just now to say she can get us an appointment at a hospital a couple of hours away. I am now terrified that they will say I'm wasting their time, she doesn't have tt and if it hurts it must be that I'm doing it wrong. To make matters worse my MiL will be with us as she's visiting that day.

Sorry haven't replied earlier, haven't really been near MN this week. Have you had your appointment yet? So glad too that you didn't get fobbed off at the GPs.

As for the nipple shields, haven't got any experience, maybe you could start another thread asking for advice on those or call the helpline again?

Appointment's tomorrow - fingers crossed! Having my MiL in tow won't help but the only appointment we could get was on a day when she'd already booked her train ticket to visit.

The consultant said it was a very mild tongue tie but they would snip it anyway to see if it helped - so they did. But she also said that because at 8.5 weeks DD is rather older than the majority of their cases, it's possible that she's already established her feeding habits and it will still be painful. Damn the paediatrician who said she didn't have one!

Now I have to find out how to teach DD to latch on properly, not with her gums - if that's even possible. I think a visit to the breastfeeding cafe is called for.

Really hope you get the help of a good BFC.