Did your area offer formula support?

[Bellyjaby]

DD was meant to be breastfed but got whisked to NICU and formula fed in a majorly understaffed hospital and I never established my milk supply to meet her demands (couldn't get out of bed for 24hrs as catheter in place, had to nag to be shown where the pump was and how to use it for another 24hr until someone finally did, etc etc). The only advice I got was stop giving her formula and bring your supply up that way. My baby was just out of NICU, it felt wrong to play with her life that way.

As I'm preparing for the birth of DC2 I'm getting more and more angry that I got no help or basic info, even when I begged health visitors. Recently I found myself on two threads that ended up turning into breastfeeding/formula debates. I was shocked by how many people were saying they were badly advised to go onto formula feeding with the suggestion they were supported through that, purely because where I am is the total opposite. There's no support round here (unless you're lucky to get someone who goes against the grain) for people who formula feed.

I had breastfeeding info coming out of my ears, but didn't even know why the water had to be a certain temperature for formula. Did you get basic info at least or any help in your area if you formula fed?

I meant to add - the reason I'm asking is that in my hormonal state I'm finding myself rallying against the system yet MN threads are making me think it's not the system that's at fault, it's certain areas.

Your HV should be trained in the safe preparation of formula and if needs be should be able to come to your home and show you they should also have the NHS leaflets on how to prepare formula and it should be in the birth to five book.

If you didn't get this support when you needed it then you should complain.

For what its worth I also think you should have been given support on how to relate and breastfed your baby but you didn't get that either so a failing on both parts really.

relactate that is

Belly, I was in exactly the same situation as you - baby in NICU, advised to give her formula as she had issues with blood sugar, potassium and sodium (was actually tube fed) and no one even mentioned to me that I could start expressing. We thought once the decision to f-feed had been made there was no going back.

I also had absolutely no help or support whatsoever. For the first few days DD was fed with hospital formula, those pre-made bottles, but the last few days in hospital I had to make the formula myself. It took about four hours to find someone to show me how to wash the bottles and use the Milton solution. Then there was no one to talk through preparing bottles from powder once I was at home and moved off the cartons.

I think breast-feeding is pushed so much that hospitals and health visitors just don't offer any advice at all on formula - it's all a little bit too far pro-breast-feeding IMHO. Obviously bf is best, but if you do end up ff then I feel you are just left to your own devices.

What struck me was that the NCT couldn't talk about it either! We all asked in our class how to make up bottles and how much formula to offer, simply because we all wanted to be prepared should bf not happen for one reason or another, and our tutor said they 'weren't allowed' to talk about it!

....and just staying stop giving her formula to bring up your supply is poor advice, if not dangerous. If your supply is very low, you would need to gradually reduce the formula whilst doing something to up your supply.

It really does sound like you have reason to complain- at the very least so they can get some further training and do things better next time. Is this a Babyfriendly hospital?

Regarding formula feeding- in our hospital, they are not allowed to do group instruction to show how to make a bottle up. The mother/parents must be shown on a one to one basis when they are in the hospital.

Nelly, sorry to hear your story :( Of course mothers who need info about how to prepare and offer formula properly should have it.

This is the correct info about NCT: NCT subscribes to the UNICEF Baby Friendly antenatal guidance about ff info. We don't give class instruction about ff preparation for two reasons: i) it is undermining to breastfeeding in what is, always, a breastfeeding class ii) (more important, IMO) this is not an effective or safe way of instructing - info given in a class scenario, with anything from 8 to 16 people watching/listening about sometimes very important stuff (like temperature and safety) is likely to be misremembered or forgotten months or weeks later. Imagine a child being taught road safety in a class, weeks or months before they are faced with crossing a busy road...would that be safe? Or being given a driving lesson, in a classroom, and then weeks later being put in a car and invited to start it?

NCT can certainly share info about ff - look at the website, there is loads of stuff, and breastfeeding counsellors can talk to you individually about formula.

If people need info beyond the instructions on the pack (and at least formula has printed instructions on the container, unlike breasts :) ) the right context for personal instruction on how to prepare safely is in your own kitchen, with someone watching you and guiding you, while you do it, at a time when the info can be put into place with the baby already there.

Not sitting with a dozen other people months beforehand....

Miggril - I had no idea there were nhs leaflets about it. Lack of those was one of the things that made me angry. I did just go check the birth to five book. It is in there. I think the problem was it was given after dd's birth and I was thrown into the situation of dealing with it. I'm pretty sure looking back that it was reading the info was what made me realise where I was going wrong. Maybe I should be posting in AIBU!!!

Nelly - its awful isn't it. I'm sorry you've been through it too. A friend didn't have c sections covered in her classes for the same reasons. Though my classes covered them slightly. I sent her my material. I get what Tiktok is saying but my classes didn't cover everything and sometimes gave us leaflets - I've found NCT stuff more helpful and succinct than nhs. I've double checked and there's nothing in my pack.

I get why they push breastfeeding, I really do. But if you find yourself in this position some help in basics would help. Even if it was just the person who'd given you the birth to five book saying something like "preparing formula is very important, please make sure you read those pages/this leaflet". What I got was them having a go as I didn't realise those bottles could only be open an hour etc.

Crikey - my thoughts exactly hence whyi didn't just stop feeding the baby who had struggled to establish feeding! My hospital gave out those little formula bottles so they totally washed their hands of it - it was just "give them a premade bottle". Though they've now stopped that so it may be different now.

When I was in hospital they brought all he new mums together and did a demonstration on how to prepare formula. I was breastfeeding and the group coincided with two absolutely useless breastfeeding councillors who wanted to talk to me (I was the only person breastfeeding in a ward of 15 women!!)

It was good that the hospital offered the. I breastfed until 6 weeks, then introduced formula for various reasons and I used the cartons until DD wa about 12 weeks then powder but my HV was great and showed me what to do and gave me the leaflet.

OP just be a bit more pushy with HCP, I definately will be next time because I would like to breastfeed alot longer, we seem to have the opposite problem Here, my HV actually advised me not to go to breastfeeding groups until my PND got under control because basically they were a pack of wolves :o

Sorry you had a bad experience but I can't help thinking- how much support do you need for ff? Surely you just make up the bottles as per the instructions, whereas when bf you need to know about positioning, attachment, cluster feeding, nipple confusion, avoiding mastitis, thrush, expressing etc etc. the vast vast majority of people in this country ff so I am a bit puzzled as to what 'support' is needed, unless it is emotional support with coming to terms with not bf which is a different thing.

Tango - glad you were offered it though you didn't need it. It still blows my mind that some places seem to be complete opposites!

Loulou - there's a lot of basics that aren't explained. Sure you get told how to do these things but not why or the importance of doing them correctly. There's a ton of questions on here and other sites for basic things such as "can you just add the powder to cooled boiled water?". Sterilising is another big one, we all know we should do it, but a lot of people don't realise that opening and electric steriliser exposes the contents so they aren't sterile if left, bottles with holes in the lids don't stay sterile for up to 24 hours if put together. That's just two things that jump immediately to mind. Then there's potential problems with milks to consider. If baby isn't thriving then surely a mum who formula feeds is entitled to the same level of support as a mum who breast feeds? Because there's a lot of mums who've been thrust into formula feeding out there who are suddenly left to their own devices not knowing or understanding what they're doing and not being given help when their child doesn't thrive.

Sorry, should say:
Sure you get told how to do these things on packets

I agree Belly- you only have to look at the number of threads on here to see that there is a lot of confusion about how to make up formula feeds. If people are formula feeding after a break of some years, then guidelines have changed and you shouldn't be making up 24 hours worth of bottles and sticking them in the fridge like before.

Hopefully your experience with DC1 hasn't put you off with DC2 belly?

The only thing its really put me off is health visitors!!! I shall spend as much time as possible avoiding them

That does make sense, tiktok. I think it would be helpful if NCT tutors could explain that is the reason, though. Lou, I know bf comes with more problems, but with the risk of making up formula incorrectly or not sterilising well, some support would be helpful to. A HV going through it with you at home for 5 minutes would be great.

Shocked at hearing a BF support group was like a 'pack of wolves' - my local group has been so good & I definitely would have given up on BF without it.

We did get help with making up a bottle in hospital when DD was first given formula, but a lot of confusion the first time we tried to use the sterilising tablets at about 3am (I was meant to be trying to express every 3 or 4 hours, including at night, was using the pump for the first time but none of the staff on duty knew how to use it themselves, so we messed up the sterilising...)

I know marshmallow it totally put me off going but hopefully by the time I have my next baby I will be living in a different area!

I had formula feeding explained to me post-natally by both my midwife, and a specialist who came onto the ward.

As it was my second, I got a more 'compact' version from the specialist, but the young girl next to me got the full speech, and had all of her questions asked easily.

I was given the leaflet by the midwife before I left hospital and when the community midwife came out for the first visit - morning after I was discharged, she went through the leaflet with me and asked me to verbally go through making up the bottle with her ie water first. The health visitor on her first visit also went through the same questions. This has happened with each of my 3 children.

Well I'm a breastfeeding peer supporter 'unofficially' helping a friend of a friend and when I told my supervisor that this lady hadn't been given breastfeeding support or advice on how to make formula I was told that she should have been given a leaflet with info on how to make formula safely and I am being sent some in case I come across similar again where Mums are mixed feeding.

So it seems women can't get help or advice however they feed their baby in some hospitals even though it should be happening.

"Did you get basic info at least or any help in your area if you formula fed?"

It didn't feel like it, but I guess I did receive basic help.

I left hospital after 4 days after an EMCS with a baby that couldn't / wouldn't latch. I was told I had to give formula as she was low birth weight. I expressed pitiful amounts of colostrum that was fed using a syringe, and then she had formula that was fed using a cup or syringe. I left for home with a cup, syringes and instructed my mum to get some cartons in for me as I had nothing at home, because, you know, I had planned to breastfeed, hadn't I?

I didn't have a clue. We got through the night with the cup and the carton, and I remember asking the midwife the next day what was I going to do? She advised getting bottles etc in to make things a little easier for me, and I was already in a routine of trying to BF - crying - bottle - expressing.

I remember being in floods of tears, sending my sister out to get a tin and bottles, steriliser etc, and she gave me a step by step guide on how to prepare formula, as this is something she has to tell young mums in her day job.

I was given a leaflet on formula at some point (at the start?), and she also told me that it was possible to make it up in advance, provided I made it up properly with hot water then cooled it rapidly, before stocking in the fridge and using within 24 hours, for example. I think she could see how upset and stressed I was.

But I wasn't given a demonstration, if you like. And I felt like I had to press her when I asked what type of bottles to get ("because there's so many, how on earth are you supposed to know? sob sob").

@louloutheshamed - you do need support. Simple things like how best to position the baby are important (I've seen so many mums in cafes lying the babies horizontal, or with it propped in their mouths). Also, it's not just a case of 'as per the instructions' on the pack. The amount that a baby requires is determined by their weight, not their age, so even though the chart on the back states weight and age, it's not clear that its weight that you should follow. There's a formula that's a good guideline - I can't remember it now! But it's something like 2.5 times their weight in pounds, for the day. Don't hold me to that - it's been a while. Also, the instructions can be misunderstood - when it says 'cooled boiled water', many think this means water that was previously boiled and is now cold, but it needs to be above 70c to kill any bacteria that may be lurking.

Should perhaps add - it was the BFing clinic that I went to that told me about the weight/amount formula.

Also, DD had a tongue tie that wasn't fixed until 8 weeks. I had pnd by this point, and stopped the cycle of bf/top up/express and reduced it to BFing twice a day, followed by formula the rest of the time. I ended up doing this for about 6 months.

This was suggested by the doctor and health visitor at our 8 week check. So, there wasn't a pressure to carry on BFing, and I suppose that was support, in a way, to FF. Perhaps that was when they gave me the leaflet.

theborrower sounds like a very similar story to me - I really struggled to get colostrum into DD in hospital & was given donor milk, then formula to take home.

I'd already bought a pump and bottles as I'd assumed I would be expressing anyway, so didn't have to panic buy...turned out to be a good decision.

Expressing definitely helped me keep going with BFing, but with DD aged just over 4 months I am getting bored of pumping...similarly to you, DD usually gets at least 2 big BFs a day, plus an expressed bottle, plus formula...and I'd love to drop the expressing, but to cut back on the amount of breast milk she's getting per day at this stage doesn't seem fair, I ought to keep going until 6 months at least.

This is what is annoying about the NHS pushing breast is best though. If they really meant it then Borrow you're babies TT would have been spotted at birth snip on day one and you would have seen a lactation consultant to get poisoning right to get you both of to the best possible start.

By the way this is what used to happen midwives would devided TT at birth, that was until formula feeding became popular and birth moved into hospital then this practice died out.

I know not always the first place yous think to go for help but breastfeeding councilors are trained in the safe peroration of formula and quill help you stop breastfeeding if that is the right choice for you.

Thanks everyone who posted. It's good to know I wasn't alone but also very good to know there is support out there. I just got rotten luck with my area it seems.