DD put on soy formula - your experiences please

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DD, 4 months, has just put on soy formula with a suspected milk sensitivity. Testing is still being done so there's no definite diagnosis yet.

I've just started my research and would appreciate any MN info, advice from others who have used soy. It seems to be making DD constipated and I've been told that it has higher sugar content so I need to take special care of any teeth that she has. I've also heard that it's not as complete as regular formula but I have no idea if I can supplement in some way.

She's on SMA WySoy.

DD1 has a rare genetic disorder which means she cannot have any dairy. So she was exclusively reared on Wysoy. But generally this isn't necessary, it may be possible to use another fomula, there are some potential issues with soya formula. It contains a chemical very like oestrogen; jury is out whether the body will recognise it as a hormone or ignore it: I believe the way the soya is processed means it should not but there is ongoing research into this in the US at the moment. It's an issue because the potential level of hormone is something like equivalent to 15 contraceptive pills daily! Also I had heard that high levels of magnesium had been found in Soya formula. Generally speaking, long term it is advised to be on a non-soya formula. Though neither of these scares are proved and there should be no problem short term anyway. So, don't panic, but if it's appropriate you might like to consider other options.

Your alternatives depend on what the problem is.

If you've got lactose intolerence (generally you get D&V but no other probs) then you could look at lactose free formula - SMA LF, for instance.

If you've got cows' milk protein allergy then you could look at a goats' milk alternative (though if your child is allergic to stuff generally they could become allergic to the goats' milk eventually) or a low-allergen formula like neutramigen, though I think you have to get this on prescription. Talking of prescriptions, you should be able to get any of the above on prescription if it's medical need. Funny formula costs a lot more and if it's for a medical reason you are entitled to get it on prescription though some GPs are a bit funny about this.

To answer your specific questions:

• about constipation - quite possibly down to the soya though it may be a changeover thing. Certainally DD didn't have this for any length of time. You'll find the poo smells a lot more "adult" too .
• sugar content - you are lucky to have been told this, your doc knows his/her stuff. The sugar content isn't actually higher, but it's a different type of sugar which the bacteria in the mouth like more. I know of people whose children have black teeth because they were not warned about this problem. The trick is to only have formula in the mouth when actively feeding, as the saliva produced will wash it away. Once she's finished the bottle, take it away from her, don't let her play with it in her mouth after the feed. Also, don't give her a dummy straight after a feed - the remains of the formula in her mouth will stick in the pores in the teat and then get ground into the emerging teeth. If you do give a dummy, give a little drink of water between the two. As soon as she has teeth, clean religiously twice a day and see a dentist.

Re: completeness - never heard that, and have been in regular contact with the dieticians at Great Ormond Street about DDs diet, so I think it may be bad info. However, when she is older there are some issues with non-formula soya milk, if you need to stay on the soya track.

Sorry, bit of a brain dump. If I think of anything more, I'll add it!

My DD had SMA Wysoy from 7 months.

I discovered she had a cows milk protein allergy when i tried to wean her off breastmilk.

I didnt find it constipated her tbh (although all formulas tend to produce more solid stools than b/milk so maybe i assumed that this was the case).

I would imagine that a formula would need to have all the required nutrients in it in order for it to be marketed for babies so i wouldnt worry about completeness. It does have more sugar, but i really wouldnt worry too much about that in the scheme of things. Just make sure you start brushing teeth as and when they come through.

HTH

Ds1 has cow's milk protein intolerance and we started him on soya formula when he went to nursery, then he developed an intolerance to soya as well (which is tbh much worse than his milk intolerance). So I am very very wary of soya now. A high proportion of children with milk intolerances have soya intolerance too, imho it shouldn't be given to kids who are suspected of food sensitivities, although I acknowledge that some seem to do okay on it (as with the kids of the previous two posters)

when archive searching is back on I'll point you to an older thread discussing soya, but in the meantime here's some info from the FSA
\link{http://www.eatwell.gov.uk/healthissues/foodintolerance/foodintolerancetypes/milkallergy/\milk allergy and intolerance}

AllergyUk also does some factsheets which they can e-mail to you.

Be aware that if your dd has a milk intolerance as opposed to an allergy, the tests won't necessarily show up anything. It doesn't mean that she's not sensitive - although depending on how well-informed the doctors are they may or may not dismiss you at that point.

there are probably some relevant discussions in the Allergies section on mumsnet

Thanks so much for the info.

r3dh3d, I wondered if the constipation could be a changeover reaction. It's quite bad though and will definitely bring it up when I see the doc again. Poor DD, she's really straining and in obvious discomfort. Thanks so much for the tip about not putting a dummy in right after a soy bottle. I've been doing this at night but will now offer some water in between. As for the completeness, DD was on Aptamil before and it had extra beneficial things like the prebiotics which don't seem to be added to the soy formulas. I'll have a good look at the vitamin and mineral content and compare.

Mummypig, it's still early days (day four now) but the soy seems to have helped DD's symptoms - runny poos, blood in nappy, obvious discomfort and interrupted sleep, shocking wind. We're due to see the pediatrician this week and will hopefully get some more answers and a clearer idea of the problems. From what I've read it all sounds so vague. Apparently there's no test that can be done for milk sensitivity? And it's basically trial and error? Was that you're experience?

My dd was on Wysoy, after she went bright red when she had her first bottle of formula at 4 months! She was absolutely fine with it and had it (along with breastmilk) till she was about 14 months when she grew out of her allergy...
Never had any probs with her teeth or her gut....

department of health distributed circular to all GPs that soyabsed formula isn't the first choice . PDF file so can't copy it but similar stuff on the arlier mentioned website if searched for soya

btw, the worry of soya is its effects on reproductive system so will take a while to find out if any problems.

As MP said, i have looked after 4 milk allergic babies, 2 girls did ok ish on soya, but the tests showed no problems but there were plenty of signs, we now wish we had pushed for nutramigen as both went on to have soya reactions.

1 girl was straight away put on nutramigen and did very well.

The other child being a boy, was put onto SMA LF- a clinically lactose free formula that can be used forever and cooked with and he thrived going back to having whole bottles and sleeping at night again.

And all are prescribable by the GP so please don't be fobbed off, if you buy it privately then i have found less support and further down the line is harder to get help when needed.

nutramigen is foul though!!

I'm glad the wysoy seems to be making a difference. I would wait and see what the consultant has to say. It's possible that the change of formula has made her constipated but also, quite often after bugs, your tummy does a sort of reverse move so if it was a nasty bug it could be that she is constipated after having had the runs for so long!

Hope she continues to improve.

R3dh3d - what a great post! I was going to post the same but so much less knowledgeably and informatively! DD was put on soy formula at 5 months due to quite bad eczema. The risks we were told were exactly those you outline - the risks to teeth and the oestrogen "mimicking" effects. I may be wrong but I thought the oestrogen thing - unproven in any event - was worse for boys than girls

We did not notice any real difference re constipation or similar. DD switched from formula soy to carton soy (with added calcium) at about 15 months. We cooked with goats milk and goats cheese (you can get a great hard cheddar-style one), which she could tolerate a lot better that cow's based dairy. Apparently its just a matter of trial and error whether children can tolerate goat's milk and also, unfortunately, whether they become allergic to soy. We were very lucky both ways.

DD is now 2.5 and her eczema needs little more than a daily moisturise and the odd dab of hydrocortison.

hi there, certainly sounds like there was something in the Aptamil that your dd was reacting to.

You can add probiotics to your dd's formula yourself, a good healthfood shop should have someone to advise which one to buy.

Re the milk intolerance, to a certain extent it's vague because the doctors can't do a definite test and say yes, there's a reaction here. BUT with ds1 it was very clear, he was reacting to traces of cow's milk protein from my breastmilk. When I went off cow's milk for about 10 days he got better, when I started again he was clearly worse within 24 hours or me eating anything. By worse, I mean screaming in terrible pain, not being able to go to sleep. We tried to reintroduce at various points and had the same result. He also gets a rash on his face and diarrhoea but they are sometimes delayed.

With the soya formula, he tolerated it for a while but then after a few months started throwing up the whole bottle, and then after that even a trace of soya would make him throw up.

He also had a rash appear on his face minutes after eating peas (which are related to soya) so we had to avoid those for a while but he's fine with them now.

If you want to find out more about food sensitivities my 'bible' is The Complete Guide to Food Allergies and Intolerances by Jonathan Brostoff and Linda Gamlyn.

and here are some previous threads which might be useful
\link{http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk?topicid=1364&threadid=45934\is soya milk okay for 1 yr old?}
\link{http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk?topicid=29&threadid=135216\getting 4 mo off soya milk}

Havent read all of the thread but was reading that wioth soy milk you have to look after their teeth before they come through so start brushing now with muslim square.

my ds1 was on Wysoy from 5 months through 1 year old due to suspected lactose intolerance. I never heard any of the hormone mimicking stuff - this was 4 years ago so maybe this is something new? In any case he did fine on it and then went on to normal cows milk and normal SMA formula at 1 year. the constipation is probably due to the changeover. I can't say on the hormonal thing other than he seems completely fine and normal.

everyone is right about the teeth thing though, it is due to the different sugars they add to soy formula. my son stated getting teeth at 5 months and had nearly a full head of them in by the time he was 1, and his teeth are fine, so don't get the idea that soy formula is that bad - you just have to take a bit more care with teeth, is all. we are now considering using it for DS2, age 5 months, who has been vomiting up regular formula sadly...