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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

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Original poster

Does "no food or drink" mean "no breastfeeding"?

54 replies

eggnut · 15/07/2012 13:50

Hello everyone, a question for you. My husband and I went to a museum in central London yesterday with our 4 month old baby. In our usual fashion it took us ages to get there, so I wanted to sit and feed DD in the gallery somewhere soon after our arrival. I paid for my entry ticket and then asked a member of staff if there was anywhere to sit down in the exhibit. She said there were benches, but that I was not allowed to feed the baby in the exhibit. I hadn't even thought to ask about whether bf was allowed, but I was clutching the baby in my arms when I spoke with her so I guess that gave it away!

I was quite surprised by this and specified that I was breastfeeding and she was quite firm that the "no food or drink" policy of the gallery applied to breastfeeding as well. Is this typical? I'm a big rule-follower and I definitely sympathize with the plights of museums trying to protect their collections (and not make exceptions for every member of the public who demands it), but it hadn't even occurred to me that quiet and discreet bf on a bench fell into the same category as walking around with a Coke in my hands or scattering biscuit crumbs on the Kandinskys!

I'm still not sure what all the bf etiquette is as it's still quite new for me. The gallery didn't have anything specific posted about bf and I can't find anything about it on their website.

OP posts:

LurkingAndLearningForNow · 15/07/2012 13:51

Breastfeeding is classes as food or drink in our museum too.

RancerDoo · 15/07/2012 13:53

That's mental - and possibly not legal ( tho i am not up to date on this stuff).

Personally i breastfed anywhere nd everywhere and no one said a word.

Longdistance · 15/07/2012 13:58

I don't think it's legal to not let you feed your baby milk.

wem · 15/07/2012 13:58

it sounds bonkers but I imagine it's to stop a chain of people saying well, how is bottle feeding different to breastfeeding, how is sitting with a sippy cup different to bottlefeeding, how is a can of coke different to a sippy cup... Incrementally different but hard to make each argument. Easier to have the blanket ban.

missmakesstuff · 15/07/2012 14:01

I think that is pretty off - I mean, I guess there are cafes, but it could take time to find one, get a seat etc - as if you are going to be spraying the stuff all over the walls? When DD needed feeding, she needed feeding, I couldn't have waited or tried to find somewhere else without pissing off pretty much everyone in earshot - 4months is still little too, most can't wait much at that age.

Anyway, if you do it discreetly no-one is even going to realise!

Could be performance art if you did start squirting it about though....

CoronationWigeon · 15/07/2012 14:02

As I understand it, the law says that you can breastfeed in public. More information here; it's contained in the Equality Act 2010. I would write to the museum to complain and link them to this fact sheet.

CoronationWigeon · 15/07/2012 14:05

Here is more from UNICEF, confirming that you should have been allowed to feed your baby in the museum and that the law prevents them from discriminating against you.

Declutterbug · 15/07/2012 14:06

She is engaging in sex discrimination (related to maternity) by treating you in this way. As your baby is under 6 months this is very clear. See above link to Equality Act.

Write and complain to save anyone else the same experience .

wasabipeanut · 15/07/2012 14:17

Whilst I see Wems point I think that a babe in arms, whether being breast or bottle fed is fundamentally different from a toddler wielding a sippy cup or carton of Ribena and should be treated differently. The employee of the museum was, I suspect, being a tad over zealous.

Like the others I think it's illegal to try to prevent you from feeding an under 6 month old wherever you require.

hazchem · 15/07/2012 14:20

Just wanted to add there is no time limit.
You can feed anywhere you and your baby are allowed to go. Eg can't feed in a night club because baby isn't over 18 but can feed in a pub with a licence to have children on premise.

Oh and if it were me I'd name and shame the gallery but I'm a bit of a stirrer.

whatinthewhatnow · 15/07/2012 14:30

Were they breaking the law though if they provided a cafe or restaurant to sit and feed the baby in? As long as the OP was not prevented from breastfeeding in a place where people could bottle feed or eat whatever, then surely there's no discrimination. Her treatment was no different to a bottlefeeding mum or indeed any eating person, so surely there was no discrimination, which is what the law is in place to prevent. If they had tried to stop her feeding in a cafe or somewhere where other food and drink was allowed, then that's something else.

obviously it is bonkers, but I'm not entirely sure it was illegal.

I never asked, personally, so nobody ever knew.

BertieBotts · 15/07/2012 14:35

I think they are obliged to provide somewhere you can go, but I also think it's justified not to allow it near the exhibits.

Last time I went to a gallery I had DS with me and if he wanted a drink or snack I didn't find it a problem to take him out into a corridor to give it to him. I don't think there were chairs, which would have been a bit short sighted, but a better suggestion perhaps than saying it should just be allowed everywhere.

CoronationWigeon · 15/07/2012 14:37

As I understand it, the discrimination is that the mother is being discriminated against by being asked to leave the gallery solely on the basis that she is breastfeeding, and this isn't a relevant factor in whether she can stay in the gallery or not. Being asked to leave because she was spraying graffiti on the artwork wouldn't be discrimination. But being asked to leave because she wanted to breastfeed is, in the same way that being asked to leave because you are a red head, or because you have tattoos.

The point is that she doesn't have the same access to the services provided by the museum (ie viewing art) as a non-breastfeeding person. The law is to prevent breastfeeding mothers being denied access to goods and services, as it's a form of sex discrimination (according to the fact sheet I linked to above), presumably because this category of people - breastfeeders - are entirely female.

And it's different to "any other eating person" because small babies can't just wait for their food, unlike children or adults.

I am not entirely sure about the law and bottle fed small babies. Does anyone know?

CoronationWigeon · 15/07/2012 14:41

Bertie - why is it justified not to allow BF near the exhibits? This is completely different to not allowing a toddler to eat drinks or snacks in the exhibition parts of museums.

CoronationWigeon · 15/07/2012 14:42

I actually can't think of a single good reason why not to allow BF in a museum. Setting aside the fact that the law allows it anyway.

ChunkyPickle · 15/07/2012 14:43

I think they were breaking the law, and I'm torn about how I feel - on the one hand, I totally understand why they say no food and drink - and feel that BF should be counted in that, and that you're not being discriminated against really, but on the other hand, a boob is attached - it's not like you can wander up to the painting and spill it. On the third hand, it's perfectly possible to squirt by mistake, so on the fourth hand, I don't know.

On the whole, I think your big mistake was asking ;) - Definitely better to ask forgiveness than permission.

CoronationWigeon · 15/07/2012 14:43

eggnut - would you mind saying which museum it was?

whatinthewhatnow · 15/07/2012 14:54

but she does have the same acces - if someone was feeding their child any sort of food or drink they would have been asked to leave. In fact, BF was being treated exactly the same as all other foodstuffs. So there was no discrimination.

whatinthewhatnow · 15/07/2012 14:54

access.

Viviennemary · 15/07/2012 14:57

I can't see that it was illegal if there was a cafe or restaurant in the museum where you could feed the baby. And it would seem a bit unfair if breast feeding was allowed but not bottle feeding for a tiny baby.

Declutterbug · 15/07/2012 15:28

On bottlefeeding babies, I'm not sure it would be illegal to prevent it in England. In Scotland the law applies equally to breast and bottlefeeding -I think up to the age of 2 years (from memory, though, so could be wrong). It was brought in earlier there than elsewhere in the UK.

Declutterbug · 15/07/2012 15:31

"Are there some places where I cannot breastfeed in public?

Yes, it is not against the law to prevent a woman breastfeeding in a service which is a single sex service for men. This single sex service must be justified, for example, where only one sex needs it or one sex needs the service more than the other. Voluntary groups or charities set up specifically to benefit one sex may be acting lawfully if they exclude women. Religious organisations may offer services to one sex if it is in line with the doctrines of that religion. In some cases, where single sex services are justified, it would be reasonable to object to members of the opposite sex being there.

It is not against the law to prevent a woman breastfeeding where there are legitimate health and safety risks, for example, near to certain chemicals or radiation."

From the factsheet linked to above, the circumstances in which it is permitted to stop someone breastfeeding are v limited. I cannot see how these can be applied to an art gallery. So yes, asking her to go to a cafe would be discrimination and illegal. It's asking her to move that's the issue.

Declutterbug · 15/07/2012 15:32

Scotland

JulesJules · 15/07/2012 15:40

I think it is perfectly clear that they have acted illegally.

Original poster

eggnut · 15/07/2012 16:45

Thanks for your thoughts, everyone, and sorry for the delay in responding--I had to do some emergency ant vacuuming and then run to the shop for milk before it closed!

I can see how this is a tricky one legally, and so difficult for museums as they do need to protect their collections. Especially difficult for them I suppose when they are exhibiting items on loan from institutions in other countries that may have their own stipulations about protecting the work.

It does seem very logical that they could point me elsewhere in the building but I do feel that means I have less access to the exhibition than my husband (or anyone else who is not breastfeeding a baby). But I'd be very curious to know more about how other museums have handled this. If it is legal for them to make this limitation it would be nice if it were specified and posted somewhere perhaps (especially before I pay 12 quid to see the exhibition and then find out I have to go back out in the lobby to feed for 30 minutes...).

I actually hadn't even asked specifically about feeding as it hadn't occurred to me that it might be a problem--I just asked if there was anywhere to sit down in the exhibition, and was then told that there was seating, but I would not be allowed to breastfeed in the exhibition. When I did manage to enter later, I was amused to see that the benches were quite a long distance from the artwork and there's no way anyone's letdown could have resulted in a squirting incident from them!

It was at the Barbican's art gallery; we went to see the Bauhaus exhibition. The cafe and other public areas there were really crowded and noisy so I had counted on being able to feed (discreetly and tidily) on a quiet bench where I could look around and see some of the exhibition while I fed. We're going to write them a polite letter and see what they say.

thanks all

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