Getting my youngsters to drink more at a feed? Or routines for snackers?

[beyoglu]

Hi, I have 10 week old twins who're formula fed and I have a couple of questions.

First, can I make them eat more at a feed, as they take small feeds?
I'm not sure if I need to really, as they're healthy (10lb 1oz and 10lb 5oz at 10 week weigh in, and looking well and happy) and they are slowly thinking about dropping a feed or two - they've stretched out the time on their night feeds so I feed at 11, 3 and half 6 now with 4 day feeds making 7 in total, and during the day they look like there's a 3.30pm feed that they might soon lose as they only take about 50ml, and that will take us down to 6 feeds a day. They're only taking about 90 - 100ml per feed on average at the moment, it's drifting up very slowly.
I'm chuffed that they're starting to look like they'll drop feeds but I'm concerned that they won't get enough to drink, as they're taking a hell of a lot less in a feed than it says they should in the health visitor's big book of tables (120-150ml for babies their size). And I'm also a bit selfishly wondering how on earth I can get them to sleep through the night if they won't up their feeds.

Second, anyone got suggestions for non fear inducing routines (i.e. not GF) for babies coming off 8 feeds onto 7 or 6? Used to be easy, it was every 3 hours , but now they can go for longer and counterintuitively they seem to need a 4 hour gap between the early and late evening feeds so as to be hungry enough to take a big feed in the late evening and sleep through the night. They're not able to go 4 hours between every feed (I know, I tried, they yelled, I capitulated pretty fast) but there is a window now where they'll be hungry but not p'd off so I wondered if anyone had any pointers on when to feed early and when to wait?

Hi, watching this with interest as my DS is an on-off snacker (he is also 10 weeks, when weighed last Tuesday he was 5,56 kg = 12lb 3oz) and every now and again I am getting terribly worried as there are days, like today, when he will certainly fall short of the chart figures. He is being fed EBM and topped up with Aptamil. He looks great, has got an appetite, is alert, no signs that anything is wrong with him, his weight is good, too.

He can take quite big feeds in a row (140-200ml) but then slips into a snacky mode (taking anything between 50-80ml). Is this how they self-regulate? I tried shoving milk down him but all it did was upset him - lots of screaming - (and his stomach) terribly. For this reason we still haven't dropped night feeds (2) as these seem to be important in upping his food intake in any given 24 hour-period.

balkanscot, how do you actually get the milk down him? My two drink as much as they want and then shriek and thrash when you put the bottle anywhere near them. I couldn't force them even if I wanted to which I sometimes do at 11pm, because I know from seldom-repeated experience that the jokers will sleep 5 hours if they drink 150ml

I kind of just preserve with shoving the teat into his mouth until he eventually starts kind of sucking again (as opposed to just gnawing at the teat as he tends to do when he has had enough - the other sign is just plainly pursing his lips and promptly falling asleep) but it is never a good idea as he then starts fidgeting with his hands and is pushing the bottle left, right and centre, and then all hell breaks loose.

Then I realise until next time that their stomachs are still only quite small and that it must be really painful for the little guy to keep tanking him up against his will.

When he is really hungry he does guzzle but when he is in, what I call, snacka mood, he starts off well but then soon stops.

Argh!

perservere, not perserve!!!

i think what you've written here is key:

"I'm not sure if I need to really, as they're healthy (10lb 1oz and 10lb 5oz at 10 week weigh in, and looking well and happy) "

why change something that works? it's normal for small babies to feed little and often
your baby hasn't read the side of a formula tin, or any of the books. they will take what they need. babies will naturally regulate their own appetite if you allow them to.
imagine if you were breastfeeding, you'd have no idea how much thehy were taking and would have to go on things like weight gain, output (wee and poo) etc etc... and your babies are just fine!

the reason formula fed babies are at higher risk of being obese in later life is because it's easy for parents to over-feed them or try and make them take more than they want in order to finish a bottle.
you end up over-riding their ability to regulate their hunger, you stretch their tummies and they just keep eating because you make them.

balkan.. i don't want to upset you, but that sounds really really horrible. force feeding a baby is not a good thing

oh and your second question about routine, you may well find that they do this by themselves if they are naturally dropping a nap

i would feed on ddemand though, it's tough while you're going through it, especially with twins i'd imagine! but you look back and it's really such a short period of time. they'll be spacing out the feeds more as they get bigger and it will get a bit easier

I know, I feel terrible afterwards. :( I have traumas from my own childhood when it would be woe and betide if a feed wasn't finished.

:( maybe you could try tomorrow to let him just have what he wants?
perhaps if he always leaves a certain amount then you would know to make slightly less which would mean less waste?

it must be upsetting for both of you, which is really quite sad.

I am feeding him mainly EBM, with Aptamil as a top up when/if needed. He actually took a good amount an hour ago (was really guzzling it), after having a snack at 5 pm, so yes, they do regulate their intake very well.

I suppose it is just like us: sometimes we feel like a feast, sometimes we just want a nibble.

My HV also got me slightly twitchy with worry last week when she said he should be having 750ml or more a day. Hence ever since I have been going mad with worry.

Basically as long as he is gaining weight as normal and is producing wet/dirty nappies, and is feeling OK, it really should be OK.

absolutely!
HV's I think sometimes just want to find something to worry you about, some of them seem to hate when everything is just going ok and will pick up on anything they can find.

he'll eat what he needs I am sure

"babies will naturally regulate their own appetite if you allow them to"

unfortunately that's difficult with twins. they don't get hungry at precisely the same time so unless you're willing to feed every hour you end up feeding one when the other is hungry - so they are often fed before they are really hungry. as you say, they self regulate, so the one who wasn't so hungry will take less and then get hungry first the next time. But they don't have the experience of totally emptying and filling their stomachs that singletons have, so it's not surprising if they continue to eat small feeds. Any painless method of getting them to eat more (eg GF recommends letting them fully wake before the late evening feed) would be welcome.