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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

"30 years of breastmilk research" by Aptamil

42 replies

jaggythistle · 12/06/2012 21:29

wouldn't you just love to know what they've 'discovered'?

just saw the above bold statement in a shield on some advert and kind of thought wtf? seems a bit meaningless.

Blush sorry for pointless pondering, spending way too much time on here sitting feeding my 8 week old!

OP posts:
MoaningMajestyReignsAgain · 13/06/2012 10:09

Totally meaningless.

30 years of research and it is still nothing like breastmilk.

I have spent 35 years doing chocolate research. I still couldn't make potatoes into chocolate, no matter how long I research it forGrin

maisie215 · 13/06/2012 10:11

Here you go...my first Biscuit

MoaningMajestyReignsAgain · 13/06/2012 10:13

Bored, maisie ?

EauRouge · 13/06/2012 10:25

Can't believe you've got a biscuit already Hmm

Yes, it's meaningless marketing blurb. Probably against the WHO code to say something like this but not sure about the law.

Chubfuddler · 13/06/2012 10:30

30 years of desperately trying to manufacture actual breast milk so they can flog it to us. That's whet it means.

Spiritedwolf · 13/06/2012 11:06

I saw that ad again last night and my poor DH had to listen to me rant at the TV again.

I believe Aptimil have previously gone with a 'closest to breastmilk' slogan which they weren't allowed, so the repeated mentions of breastmilk are an attempt to continue this tactic to appear a premium product to parents who understand the benefits of breastmilk, but are unable/have choosen not to breastfeed. When in all probability, it is little different from other breastmilk substitutes.

The bit that annoys me most is the small print 'not a breastmilk substitute'. I realise that they put that there to wriggle around the marketing regulations, but its blatently untrue. At six months, what other part of a baby's diet is it replacing? Its not like they can claim its instead of cows milk, because babies can't have that till 12 months. The product is used as a breastmilk substitute and therefore it breaks marketing guidelines, sticking a 'this is not a breastmilk substitute' text on it doesn't solve the problem.

Spiritedwolf · 13/06/2012 11:11

Out of interest... I'm kind of surprised that no company seems to have set up a commercial breastmilk bank - effectively using screened expressed milk instead of wet nursing. You'd have thought there would be a market for affluent families wanting their child to have breastmilk but unable/unwilling to breastfeed.

I suppose that they would need to pay women more than they pay cows though...

Do they pay women for the breastmilk they use in their research? I guess they must, but probably not what its worth?

24HourPARDyPerson · 13/06/2012 11:17

It's what I would expect from an infant formula manufacturer, tbh.
They don't just throw white powder in a tin and slap a price tag on.
Of course they analyse bm and try to replicate the blend of nutrients. Though i imagine they have less success with the immunological benefits.

And of course it's a breastmilk substitute.
it's for babies who aren't breastfed. What else would you give them?

Am a bf'er myself but totally delighted to live in a world with a safe adequate alternative.

maisie215 · 13/06/2012 11:51

I'm a bit bored of sanctimonious bf-ers to be honest. Totally agree with 24hrpardyperson. As someone who has nearly given herself a nervous breakdown successfully attempting to bf two children but faced with the challenges of IGT I am really glad that they are researching these things. I am happy for these companies to be profit making if that pushes forward better alternatives for those of us who can't breastfeed no matter how much we try. Thank goodness the only alternative is not condensed milk like my great aunt had to use.

YoulllaughAboutItOneDay · 13/06/2012 12:05

Yes, it is meaningless. Formula manufacturers should of course research and develop their products. And what else are they going to base their research on. What annoys me is that it implies things that aren't true - that there have been great leaps forward in formula composition and that aptimil (ie bloody expensive formula) is somehow incredibly superior.

Formula is a life saving product, which is why i get so annoyed by misleading marketing.

TruthSweet · 13/06/2012 12:08

Spirited - there is a company in the US (Prolacta) which turns DONATIONS of BM into human breastmilk fortifier for premature babies which they charge hospitals for Shock The mothers are donating thinking it's going direct to prem/ill babies for free/cost of handling only and not realising it's being turned into a commercial product, some have even been told it's being shipped abroad to HIV+/AIDS mothers so their babies can have breast milk (25% of donations are shipped abroad vs 75% that go to make the HMF). They used milk banks as a front Angry.

They appear to have gone public with the for profit bit now though so at least mothers may be aware they are donating BM (which can sell for $3 an ounce in the US) to a company.

More details here.

Tangointhenight · 13/06/2012 12:22

If you are successfully breastfeeding why get so annoyed about formula? It's a genuine question I honestly don't understand why people care so much about the choices other mums make. What has it got to do with you?

I honestly don't mean that as confrontational, I breastfed until 6 weeks when my milk dried up due to PND/not eating myself. I was gutted for me and my baby but my friend, who gave up at 2 days, I couldnt really say I really cared whether she did it or not, bfeeding was important to me, but not everyone looks at it like that, even people who are well educated in the benefits.

So try not to let these things get to you, formula will always be there as an alternative and in my case thank God it was, and formula companies will never stop advertising and competing for ff mums to choose them.

EauRouge · 13/06/2012 12:46

Thing is, they are not just competing for FF mothers to choose them, they are competing for all mothers to choose them. That's what private companies do, they are trying to make a profit so it's in their best interests for women not to breastfeed.

Some of the adverts can be very misleading- adverts are not a reliable source of unbiased information.

Nobody wants mothers not to have a choice. Nobody wants formula banned. Nobody thinks it is poison or that mothers who choose to/have to FF are bad mothers. But we all deserve the chance to make a choice based on facts, not on marketing or old wives tales.

midori1999 · 13/06/2012 12:51

"I am happy for these companies to be profit making if that pushes forward better alternatives for those of us who can't breastfeed no matter how much we try."

maisie ar eyou also happy for them to make a profit even though thousands of babies die every single day in their efforts to make as much profit as possible?

As to why people care what other people feed their babies, well generally, I don't. However, not breastfeeding does cost the NHS money (hence the NHS are so keen on promoting breastfeeding) and there are environmental factors too, packaging, transportation etc, none of which apply to breastmilk if a mother is feeding her own baby.

I am glad that there is an alternative to breastmilk/breastfeeding for Mothers who can't or simply don't want to breastfeed. However, that doesn't mean I can't think the companies that produce it are absolute and utter shites that will do anything they can to make money.

Tangointhenight · 13/06/2012 12:55

I have to be honest and say that not once has a formula advert swayed me away from wanting to breastfeed, breastfeeding is very much pushed down your throat during pregnancy and after birth, maybe HCP need to change their tactics, instead of putting women under so much pressure they should look at ways of encouraging them. There are so many women out there who probably would bfeed but don't not because they saw an advert on the telly but because the pressure to do it is either overwhelming or it just plain pisses them off...a lot of people don't like being told what to do.

I will be feeding my next baby, and I will do all I can to make sure the same doesn't happen to me as what happened last time, but the question I asked was why does it matter do so many people what other mums are doing?

midori1999 · 13/06/2012 13:08

Surely formula milks are 'pushed down your throat' every time you turn your telly on too, if that's what you think BF promotion is?

Advertising does work, that is a fact and it is why companies spend so much money on it. It might not make an individual see an advert and say 'oh, I'll FF instead of BF then', but they are all about normalising formula and making it seem like formula is virtually the same as breastmilk anyway (which some/lots of people believe) so that when women are finding getting breastfeeding established difficult or experiencing problems, they think actually, they'll just use formula instead as it will be easier/better and it's not that different anyway.

EauRouge · 13/06/2012 13:10

If the advertising didn't work then companies wouldn't spend hundreds of thousands of pounds on it.

You are right though, simply telling parents why breastfeeding is better is not enough to help- proper support from staff that are trained in breastfeeding management would go a long way but sadly it would cost and it seems that the government thinks it isn't worth it. Luckily we have NCT, LLL, ABM, BFN etc.

maisie215 · 13/06/2012 13:16

Many more babies would die if they just filled a tin with white powder and flogged it. Thank goodness for research (which is what the original topic was IIRC)

EauRouge · 13/06/2012 13:28

I think the point of the OP was that the 'research' label on the packaging was misleading.

Yes, many more babies would die if we went back to mixing carnation, sugar and water- no one is saying that we should do that. Formula companies need stricter guidelines because very young babies are vulnerable and need feeding properly (with breastmilk or formula) to prevent them from getting very ill.

maisie215 · 13/06/2012 13:35

Why is it misleading? They have been researching breastmilk for 30 years and attempting to replicate it. They sure as hell haven't managed it but they have been basing their formula on research- not just putting a whole load of crap in a tin and giving it a big stir. Surely that is what they are saying and that is what they have been doing... don't see why it is misleading.

How could their guidelines be stricter to ensure young babies are fed properly (not being inflammatory- genuinely wondering. I know there are a lot of folk on here who know lots about this and wonder what they would advise/prefer.)

Spiritedwolf · 13/06/2012 14:04

Its odd that some women seem to find breastfeeding is pushed down their throats, whilst other women have HCP who tell them that there are no benefits to breastfeeding after 6 months, or who tell them that they will need to top up with formula because (pick one) 1. their baby is too small 2. their baby is too big etc.

I am pregnant with my first baby (so no, I'm not happily breastfeeding yet, and I do worry about how difficult I might find it) and I certainly haven't had breastfeeding pushed down my throat.

As part of a pack of antenatal stuff early on I recieved a booklet on breastfeeding with a dvd (amongst other information like healthy eating in pregnancy, what classes the MU run, stuff about a managed versus physiological 3rd stage etc). After that, I was told at one antenatal appointment about the benefits of breastfeeding (this seemed to be a tick box exercise).

I've attended two antenatal parent education classes so far, and feeding the baby has barely been mentioned. The odd '... give you the opportunity for skin to skin. For mums who are breast feeding, it is a good time to put the baby to your breast as he/she begins to root around'. Nothing has been assumed or lectured at all. We have been invited to an 'infant feeding class' - I would imagine that given they have gone with this name, that breast feeding and formula feeding will be talked about and we'll be shown how to do both. I might be wrong, maybe they will tell us what horrid mothers we'll be if we don't breastfeed, but given the tone of things so far, I doubt it.

And I'm recieving my antenatal care from a small 'baby friendly' low-risk MLU that has 70% of their births in the pool. So I can't imagine how naturalistic a unit would need to be in order to push breastfeeding to the exclusion of all else.

These threads seem to go in circles. As I have said on other threads, this is about the unethical marketing techniques of companies that are trying to increase artificial feeding rates as well as promote brand loyalty. It is not about the individual circumstances of mothers who find themselves unable to breastfeed or who are unwilling to do so for whatever reason.

Aptimil is trying to piggy-back off of the 'breast is best' message to suggest that their powdered milk product is closer to breastfeeding and therefore superior to other (extremely similar) powdered milks. Some of which are owned by the same company.

Its like washing up powders, do you really know the difference between different powders (other than the scent which you can make your own judgement on)? Or are they all very similar products, branded to appeal to different segments of the market at different price points? This is the lack of real factual information that advertising provides, and what a baby eats is much more important than which washing powder you use.

I have not seen a breast feeding activist claim that there is no place for formula milk or that it is not a lifesaving development. Of course its good to have alternatives for mothers who cannot or will not breastfeed. The problem is that the marketing tactics of artifical milk manufacturers undermine women's confidence in their ability to breastfeed, their desire to do so and the support available to those who do want to breastfeed (where women are told on day 2 that they don't have enough milk, or that they must feed to a schedule that damages their milk production).

Past tactics have included formula companies offering a free design service to maternity units in America. They designed the facilities delibrately to seperate mother and baby so that breastfeeding was as inconvient for the staff as possible, and tried to stop new mums from establishing their supply. They wanted a bigger market for their products, so they created it. Commercial companies are driven forward by one motive, profit. It is the job of people to set ethical boundaries with regulation and ensure they stick to them.

Of course if I find that my baby and I are unable to breastfeed then we will use artificial milk and be grateful that it exists. That doesn't mean that everything that the companies that make them do is ethical.

Seriously if you haven't read 'The Politics of Breastfeeding' and you do genuinely want to understand why people feel strongly about the marketing tactics of artificial milk companies. Its not because they hate women or want to make them feel awful about struggling with breastfeeding or them making a choice that its not for them. Its certainly not because they are smug about breastfeeding. They just want women given every support possible to breastfeed because of the risks associated with not breastfeeding.

We're talking about this issue at the level of society, not passing judgement on the choices or struggles of individuals.

Tangointhenight · 13/06/2012 14:08

Spirited, it wasn't pushed down my neck until DD was born, by midwives, doctors and my HV.

It's not the same everywhere and I appreciate that, I hope you have a good experience when your baby is born :)

ag123 · 13/06/2012 14:23

Spirited, I've been really enjoying reading your wonderfully informed posts recently. When are you due? I so hope everything goes well for you. :)

Spiritedwolf · 13/06/2012 14:50

EDD 25th July - so, err... a few weeks either side of then? Thanks for the lovely compliments, I do apologise for the length of my posts though as I seem to be incapable of making my thoughts condense themselves into internet-friendly snippets.

Its entirely selfish btw, I am certain that I'll be relying on encouragement and advice from you all before the summer is over. Grin

Tango sorry that your HCP were judgemental rather than supportive. Being a new mum is tough. I hope mine stick to the supportive side of things once baby is here too.

maisie215 · 13/06/2012 14:56

I totally agree that the knowledge level if HCP is very poor (I say that as one so I've seen it from both sides). However, I think the knowledge and support within the nhs needs to be improved and that this is far more of a concern and a far more pressing problem than formula companies' advertising strategies. I think poor knowledge and support for those who do want to breastfeed is much more to blame for low bf rates than formula companies.

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