Low weight baby, breast feeding, formula and weaning early - whats the best solution?

[Wills]

Hi,

Unfortunately my dd2 is currently sitting on the 0.5 percentile and is very likely to have fallen off the chart within the next fortnight. Apart from a low weight in every other way she looks perfectly healthy and the health visiters are being reasonably relaxed about this (thank goodness). However given that she's now 3 and half months they think they are going to recommend that I wean early i.e. at 4 months. Since dd2 is also showing distinct signs of allergic rhinitus I was told by my gp to not wean for as long as possible and definitely not to introduce formula - to stick to soley breast feeding as long as possible. She's recently recinded this statement and now feels that I could possibly feed with ordinary formula just not soya.

All in all I've had an awful lot of messages. DD2 is a healthy looking baby just not very chubby. DD1 was similar although never fell off the scale. I'm starting to feel that my milk is not good enough.

What should I do - I'm tempted with weaning at four and half months but going very slowly. Would be grateful for other people's thoughts and experiences.

well you said thanks to pupuce and ignored messages from me and lizs.

I think the most useful thing I found about expressing was seeing the milk go in. Could also be good to stem the 'why don't you try formula' suggestions. However, it really doesn't sound like your dd has a problem getting enough milk.

Do you think it could be because she is very sicky? Ds was also very sicky - could not go anywhere without 3 or 4 muslin cloths. When she's sick, is she posseting, or is it more like vomiting? I'd have thought being sick a lot must affect weight gain a bit as well as amount of milk taken in.

Green nappies mean too much foremilk don't they? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but maybe you need to get more hind milk - in which case, could you express a bit before you feed her, to increase the fat content of the milk? Also, spreading the feeds out a bit might help.

I think in my dds case, my babies are just designed to be thin - she is about 75th centile in length, but under 25th in weight, and ds is 25th in both. He is 2 and a half, and only about 27 pounds. Having had one already go through this (he was 9lb12 when born) I think they cut me a bit more slack when dd started to go the same way!

i don't know if it is relavent but a friends baby was getting green poo and only going 2 hrs day and night.( I know yours is going longer and is sleeping) but she was helped to slightly ajust feeding position and it was explained to her( better than i can explain) but the guist was too much fore milk filled her up and she diddn't hang around for richer hind milk. this was causing green poo and is also digested quicker and hasn't same high calouries as richer hind milk. her latch wasn't stimulating the hind milk. the adjustment did make a difference.

as I said I am not feeding expert this was from a friends experience. I am sure you have had your latch checked I just remembered this when you mentioned the green poo. It may be worth getting another b/f expert to check. she may help you to arm yourself with amo before seeing the paediatrition.

Cripes sorry bossykate and Lizs, my thoughts are currently going a lot faster than my typing. Please don't be insulted, I was so glad that you'd all picked up the thread and had been giving me reassurance. I know that I'm in full blown paranoid mode and its such a relief to be able to "talk" about it.

Sorry

ok, wills, maybe i was being the slightest, teensy-weensy-est bit petty...

i really hope your dd is ok and you get reassurance from your visit to the paediatrician.

ps - i'm a grumpy, old bag today, can you tell?

Don't know about you bossykate - but personally I could do with an ENORMOUS glass of wine.

oh yes, wills, plus a big cigarette with it, but i have quit!

How BIG a cigarette, bk? A home-rolled one, maybe? I'll share anything herbal going, and that from someone who has never even tried such things before. Desperate times for all.
Well, I've come to join the VERY BAD August mums who starve their babies thread. I too have been putting off visiting the HVs (it's not them so much as the barmy nurse whom you get gratis and who does the weighing) as I have sensed for some time that dd is not packing on the lbs. She may be long and busy (also trying to roll over Wills, and screeching crossly when she only gets 90% of the way) but she's just not wide enough for SE London it seems. I have been summoned back in two weeks to "check her progress" - by the same HV who applauded my continued bf and has already said her babies slithered down the charts too. I nearly asked her whether she referred herself to herself for a wigging too, but managed to restrain myself.
I think lots of people have made interesting points here about sleeping through making a difference (dd is going through every other night and having a 5 minute chomp for form's sake on other nights) and about how little it bldy well matters in the end as long as the babies are perky and producing by-products. One minute we're told even babies are getting obese these days and we should watch it, and the next there are at least three of us right now on Mumsnet getting a kicking because our babes are still finding their level. Ooooh. I sometimes wonder whether anxious mothers exude an irresistible aroma to HVs. I sat next to a TOUGH-looking gal with a spherical baby on Wednesday and I bet any money the HV didn't tackle her about her baby's weight.
Wills, good luck at the paeds - I think it is hospital doctors' relished duty to scoff at GP referrals, I am sure you will be signed off with their tinkling laughter ringing in your ears as they mark your GP's card again. Seriously, I hope it all goes well.
Solidarity, ladies. Why do they do this to us?

Hi Just wanted to send my best wishes to those getting grief off the HV's for low weight gain - Im the owner of one of those "spherical" babies who wont stop gaining and my HV has had a go at me for that! Calling him a fatty and suggesting I wean at 12 weeks!!

You cant win it seems
Good Luck for Thursday Wills

Becca
xxx

Can we write a letter of complain to our surgeries???? i am SERIOUS.....

i would agree with pupuce
ds is 16 motnhs and i spent the first 6 months of his life worrying about going to see the HV cos ds was big
he is perfectly in proportion though - heght and weight both just below 91st centile
then i stopped taking him and since about 5 motnhs he has been once - two days after his first bday so that i coul dknow what he was on his birthday!!!
he is nearly 3 foot tall now!!!!!

lol, marina i meant an ordinary one - but now that you mention it, feeling completely relaxed and giggly doesn't sound half bad!

casting my mind back, ds's weight was also a source of misery to me, due to hv pressure - guess what, he was v. early to sleep through as well - seems there is a pattern emerging.

next time, i don't plan to take my baby to the hv except for 6wk check and jabs. i can't believe what i put myself through last time when i knew he was fine.

wills, i think marina has made a good point about the hospital doctors sniggering at gp referrals, most likely this is what will happen...

TYPICAL! dd1 and I have woken up this morning with really rotten colds and now dd2 seems to be getting it and guess what... She doesn't want to feed . However you've all made me feel that the current situation is fairly normal. Apart from my gps' suggestion that I cancel our 2 week holiday to Florida I supposed in the end I'd rather my gp were over cautious than under

Just in case you don't see the August babies thread Wills, I hope it goes well tomorrow. I'll keep my fingers crossed for you! xx

About to go to bed so will be short but will try to say more tomorrow. Basically Paed said - what a gorgeous, healthy, happy, content little girl! . What a clever mummy you're being

FANTASTIC NEWS! Well done you Wills. I'm really pleased.

Come 'on, Wills, you've got to give us more detail than that!!

So gald to hear that Wills

gotta agree with that doc too!

Good news, Wills....to be be honest, I think it was reasonable for the GP to seek a second opinion if she had no confidence in her own ability to reassure you. A baby about to fall below the 0.5 centile and continuing to fall is unusual enough to warrant an expert view.

There are rare metabolic conditions that lead to poor weight gain, and you can't expect a GP to know how to spot them, or to judge when a baby needs to be investigated for them.

You also had the HVs hinting at weaning early, and a specialist opinion could avert this unnecessary intervention.

It's horrible to have had all that anxiety, but at least you have had the seal of approval now!!

wills, hooray! that is excellent news! you must be so relieved. i'm very pleaseed for you.

have a wonderful holiday

The consultant was great. Gave dd2 a thorough check over and then proceeded to ask me questions. First one was "What do you think is wrong" - nothing we our response. He then asked "does she sleep for long periods", yes was my response - often over night. "What does that tell you" (consultant). That she's content! "Yep" (Consultant). Basically he's very happy with her. He explained that I'm supplying her enough calories for her to grow perfectly healthly but that yes the calories in my milk might be slightly less than others. We'd already discussed the fact that dd2 and I STILL have thrush and he concluded that this was probably leading to me being tense a lot and therefore producing slightly less fatty milk. He's quite happy if I continued to feed this milk all the way through but did tell me that I should rest and de-stress more (didn't tell him about my problems with my mother and the fact that I'm just about to have a very very stressful holiday with her ). We discussed her "allergies" i.e. permanent blocked nose and sneezing a lot and his response was that she has a small nose and as she grows this should disappear. We also discussed when to wean and his view was that it was entirely up to me and dd2. He did point out that if I left it too long dd2 was likely to get "very pissed off". Said that as her Mum I should trust all of my feelings and that I was obviously doing a great job and was obviously very much in tune with my baby . Great ego boost!

Vaguely talked about dd2's thrush and mine as I'd secretly hoped he'd give me ammunition to go back to my gp over the lack of fluconazol. Basically although my gp has put me on fluconazol at long last I've just discovered that she's only put me on a quarter of the recommended dose. Oh well.

Tiktok - totally agree that my gp should send me to the paed. In the end I would rather she did that than be too complacent. I was more upset at her statement that I might not be feeding her enough, that I probably wasn't listening to her properly. I came out of her surgery feeling that she'd just accucsed me of starving dd2 and not being close enough to her - basically a bad mother and it really really upset me.

So pleased for you Wills. just goes to show, us mums know best! so now you can relax!

Brilliant news Wills. You will probably relax more having that weight lifted off your shoulders Keep away from the scales now is my advice

Wills, that is tremendous news, I'm so pleased for you (and what a nice-sounding paediatrician). Just hope that the forthcoming "holiday" turns out to be less stressful for you than you fear.

Pleased you had a successful consultation, you must be so relieved. Hope you have a good time in Florida.