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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Constant pressure to ff is depressing me

28 replies

Cleverclever · 30/03/2012 11:38

Namechanged for this...sorry if it is a bit long.

My son is 13 weeks old. He is my second child. I breastfed my daughter for 2 years- she was a real boob fiend, refused bottles or dummies and required me to nurse her down to sleep every night. My son is different- maybe because I didn't want to repeat the experience of having a baby solely reliant on me, we introduced the dummy and bottle of expressed milk pretty early. He likes the comfort of breastfeeding but he's happy with a bottle or dummy too.

Most of the first 3 months were one long screamfest with colic hell-he had terrible, terrible wind after every feed. My husband and MIL kept muttering about how my milk was possibly "poisoning" or "injuring him". MIL in particular kept voicing concerns about the "quality" of my milk. It was clear I had enough, since I was able to express easily and in fact often times it was spraying out across the room. I cut out all dairy/wheat from my diet for 6 weeks to see if that helped- and it didn't really seem to make too much difference. In the last couple weeks, he seems a lot better and I've reintroduced all the banned foods- and he's fine.

When he was born, my son was on the 75th centile for weight- this then dropped to 50th but the HV wasn't too concerned because he was proportionate for weight. At the last weigh-in, he was hovering about the 25th centile. Despite this, he's happy and seems quite content- a big contrast to his former misery. The HV forgot to measure his length. But on the whole, she thought he seemed and looked OK- though she wanted to weigh him again in a couple of weeks.

My husband and MIL are, however, horrified. They are really worried about his weight and wellbeing. It's now led to immediately supplementing with one bottle of formula a day. I wasn't at all keen on this- since I know all about the issues of supply/supplementation. But my husband really felt like his input as to what was required was not being taken on board, and so I agreed it was fair enough to try it.

However, meantime, I am stilll getting lots of comments from MIL about how he's not thriving, he's "meant to be a big boy and he's not now" etc etc. It's frankly driving me crazy.

Here's the thing- I don't want to ignore possible issues of failing to gain weight. etc. I'm not an idiot and of course I want my son to get fed by one means or another. But I really don't believe that he's falling off the chart because he's somehow "meant to be bigger" than he is. I thought at his birth that his relatively large size was kind of a fluke. I am a quite finely boned, slim petite woman, just under 5'3" and my husband is 5'9" and also slim. The idea that we were meant to be producing this strapping rugby player of a child is to my mind a bit bizarre. I'm also probably taking it a bit personally, but it's hard to constantly hear that somehow I'm not giving him enough, I'm not doing it right, my milk is not good enough etc. I'm at the point where I almost want to throw up my hands and hand over a bottle and let someone else get on with feeding him.

OP posts:
showtunesgirl · 30/03/2012 12:04

I thought that a drop of two centile lines is ok and it takes babies a while to adjust and get to where they are supposed to be?

I'm sorry you're getting such negative pressure from your DH and MIL. Is there any way that you can address how you feel with DH and he can handle your MIL for you as it does seem that you are being ganged up on here!

tiktok · 30/03/2012 12:22

Your baby sounds fine, and the HV has confirmed this.

Would it help to be part of a breastfeeding support group?

Your MIL really, really needs to stop undermining you from a position of sheer ignorance, from what it sounds like.

can you share with her some written information about the quality of breastmilk being pretty consistent across women? (you can find user-friendly info at www.kellymom.com)

The 'rules' should be: i) you appreciate her concern, but your baby is fine and the constant carping is upsetting you ii) be quiet

As for your DH, is he really 'horrified' at your breastfeeding? That's just awful - if he is that concerned, can he come with you to the clinic and hear for himself all is well?

tiktok · 30/03/2012 12:23

If your baby is thought to need more calories, then you have them already - in your breasts. Feeding more often, breast compressions, switch nursing, are all ways to get more breastmilk/calories into him :)

Pootles2010 · 30/03/2012 12:27

The hv is the expert, and your mil really needs to back off. Perhaps you could suggest either your dh or mil coming with you to have a chat with hv if they're really that bothered?

Cleverclever · 30/03/2012 13:17

Thanks for all replies so far.

My husband isn't horrified at bf so much but more that the baby is not thriving according to the charts. Doesn't buy that the two centime dip is ok. He has been at all HV appointments so far but he missed the last one. The HV followed up with my GP as well and phoned to confirm that there was no need to panic but we would follow up in a couple of weeks. I think my husband feels left out of the loop. He also thinks that women who bf spout a lot of "dogma" about it and ignore what doesn't support the breast feeding method. So I am guessing a clinc would not help. Hopefully the HV will be supportive of my continuing to feed at our next weigh in otherwise I fear the pressure to switch entirely will just ramp up.

At the moment I am demand feeding- problem is, he never seems to demand, so basically I am sticking a boob in his mouth at every available opportunity and hoping he takes some. And going on the baby, not the chart, I think he looks ok!!

OP posts:
tiktok · 30/03/2012 13:31

Your dh needs to read some of the documentation about weight charts, then. Why would he think the two centile drop is not ok? The fact that is, in a healthy baby, is evidence-based - the vast majority of babies who 'go down' the weight charts like this, or who go further than this, are ok, and maybe your HV can show you her guidance, which will almost certainly have this in writing.

But if he thinks all this is dogma, even though it is to do with growth and not feeding method per se, then it's going to be hard work convincing him.

Weight is only one part of an assessment. By 13 weeks, with a healthy baby, it's becoming less significant, anyway. Feeding more often as you are doing is a more physiological way of ensuring the baby gets what he needs.

What is known to be harmful is unphysiological growth - that is, growth that is brought about by over-feeding, which is less easy to do with breastfeeding. This is why breastfed babies are, on average, lighter than ff babies by a year. Healthy term babies can almost always be 'allowed' to self-regulate their intake, and over-riding this with formula or other foods - which the baby finds harder to control than bf, which the baby can reduce by sucking/swallowing less.

MigGril · 30/03/2012 13:40

Sounds like he's doing fine and I deffantly ignorN MIL it's really nothing to do with her as long as you baby is healthy and happy.

The one thing you could try is droping the dummy they can mask hunger cues and if you want to up his milk intake sucking on you is far better then a artifical teat.

Also taking you OH along with you to a brastfeeding group is maybe a good idea.

nickelhasababy · 30/03/2012 13:52

ignore the chart.
they're not targets - you know this, but maybe your DH needs assuring?

show him a nappy.
as long as the baby is pooing and weeing, and looks like he's well, then noone needs to worry.

your MIL is probably putting these worries into your DH's head,you know.
you do need to tell her to stop making comments because it's not her place.
your HV says everything is fine, and she's right.

startail · 30/03/2012 14:07

The graphs are not God, in fact they are a god damn nuisance!

Loose your red book for two weeks, forget to go to have DS weighed and relax.

Sorry having had a DD who fell completely off the bottom of the graph, I know that's of weighing and fussing just stresses mum and does nothing for your milk supply.

It was all totally futile anyway since DD2 would not take a bottle so didn't return to the graph till she started on solids around 5 and half months.

By one she was on the 50% line and 10 years later she still is.

nappymaestro · 30/03/2012 14:35

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Diamondgirls · 30/03/2012 15:06

I second dropping the dummy as this will stop him comfort feeding.

Cleverclever · 30/03/2012 20:06

Just to respond to a couple of points:

Dummy use is now really only at nap and bedtime-it was a lifesaver during the worst of the colic but we are trying to wean him off it. The HV said not to do it cold turkey though as this can slightly increase risk of SIDS.

I think anyway, the issue is not that he is not getting enough to eat. He's seeing and pooing and seems happy/contented hitting milestones. The issue is that he's not increasing on the damn centiles. I think my husband is probably perceiving these as targets and maybe the HV can set him right on that.

I am not sure anything can set MIL right-she just has some odd ideas. For example, she was worried he was having too many wet nappies because the "nutrition was going right through him". Hmm. Then this morning she said that maybe he was dehydrated and I should give him some water. Sigh. I looked at pics of my husband when he was a baby and he was a complete formula fed butterball. I think that tells a story...

OP posts:
Cleverclever · 30/03/2012 20:07

Peeing, not seeing. Stupid spellchecker.

OP posts:
discrete · 30/03/2012 20:13

Is it possible that part of what the screamfest was about was reflux? Sometimes babies with reflux in the early days eat less than babies without, and fall down the charts a bit. As they get better it generally reverses, so if he is fine now, then chances are he will get to his right weight soon enough.

flagnogbagnog · 30/03/2012 20:41

Sorry if someone up thread had already mentioned this but is hv using a bf chart or a ff chart? There was a point a few years ago that ff chart was used as standard and of course this produced lower results for bf babies.

My 5yr old DD didn't grow very quickly as a baby. She kept dropping down the chart. The hv eventually started using the term 'failure to thrive'. But I knew she was fine, and when she was six months old I stopped taking her to be weighed. She is just a small build. One of the smallest ones in her year group. But completely in proportion, no developmental issues at all.

My two boys were also ebf and they had no growth issues at all. I can safely say I was doing nothing differently.

Eglu · 30/03/2012 20:51

Lots of babies move up or down the charts in the first few months to where they are meant to be. DD and DS1 moved from 75th to 25th and stayed there. I grow decent sized babies whilst pg, but they then adjust down to where they are meant to be.

It's a shame when people can't be supportive. My MIL made the odd comment about DD not liking my milk when she would throw up, but she did not mean it in a nasty way, it still hurt though.

It is difficult when people expect all babies to be big chubmonsters when that is not the case.

nellyjane · 30/03/2012 21:06

How were your DH and MIL about your DD being BF for 2 years? Or was it a different DH and MIL that time round? I'm just wondering if DH is worried about creating another 'boob fiend' and is looking for excuses to bring it to an end early this time round?

It sounds like you know what you're talking about, and they need to educate themselves and stop undermining you. It also sounds like your HV is supportive of BF? Would it be possible to talk to her and ask her to give your DH some info/reassurance when he next comes to an appointment? As for MIL, I'm afraid I would be being pretty rude by now...

neverinamillionyears · 30/03/2012 21:27

My dd is now 4 months and at 10 weeks she dropped from 25th centile to 9th and falling. hv really upset me and for a whole week I constantly fed her (ebf) I was distraught as hv said "may have to refer her" I was devastated and it made me feel inadequate. Anyway that week she put on 6oz and not just the 2 or 3 she had been. I knew then nothing was wrong but my daughter still gaining weight and thriving. I don't get her weighed every week now and I usually leave my book at home forget my book.

I was that stressed, whenever anyone mentioned how dinky she was I cried.

She is still dinky but just lovely and doing all the things she should be.

I was pressured into giving formula, but so glad I've stuck it out. We can only do this once for our babies and I'm so glad that I've been privileged to be able to :)

Cleverclever · 30/03/2012 21:28

Ah yes, should have said-different dad to the my daughter. I met my husband when she was a year old. He had some issues with my feeding so long-mainly to do with the fact she woke up for the day at 4am for months and months only so she could have some boob. But because he was not her father he didn't feel it was really his place to tell me how to feed her.

With my son, we were never sure if it was reflux or not-my instinct was not since he didn't really have symptoms other than screaming after a feed. I suspect possible lactose intolerance issues since we did give him some Colief quite late on and that seemed to help a bit. I do think I probably didn't feed him quite often enough during that time-simply because it seemed to make him so uncomfortable every time he ate, and possibly his weight dropped a little as a result.

I checked with the HV and she assured me she was using the new bf charts. I think what I do is have a chat with her before she comes and explain to her that my husband is skittish about the centiles and the impact that might have on future breast feeding.

It is frustrating, this. I've tried to point him to advice and research on bfing the Internet but he has this notion that the internet will confirm any viewpoint if you look hard enough. Which is kind of true but in this case, it's overwhelmingly backing up what I am saying. He tends to kind of portray me as a breast feeding obsessive which is unfair. I am not-I do feel I've done enough feeding with my first child for a lifetime-but neither do I want to switch to formula simply because of some misguided notion about where our son should be on the charts. :(

OP posts:
Nobhead · 30/03/2012 21:34

Those charts are mostly bollocks. How can your milk not be right for him Hmm? Your MIL sounds like a pain the ass. Mum's and MIL's always have to have their ten penneth worth about how you are feeding your baby at some point and to some degree. But remember it's your's and DH's baby not your MIL's. Perhaps she has some issues with the BF because she didn't do it with her children.
My MIL made a few comments on the fact the I didn't BF my DS- she would say "is he getting the right nutrients from that?" and point to the formula. I was already feeling guilty for not being able to feed him and I was also a little PND too which didn't help. Then my DSIL had a baby and breast fed her until she was 12 months old and my MIL thought it was fantastic non stop gushed about how babies bond far more with their mothers and that DSIL's DD was far more bonded to her than DS was to me. My DH soon put her in her place though Smile
Whatever choice you make will be the right one- as long as it is YOUR choice.

metalelephant · 30/03/2012 23:09

You're doing so well, I'm impressed with your patience - I would have snapped long ago!

I know the mantra is "smile and nod and do your own thing anyway", but your MIL sounds very stubborn and irritating.

Perhaps you should try to avoid seeing her that much, maybe this way she will also get the subtle message?

metalelephant · 30/03/2012 23:19

I think you need to work on developing lovely thick skin as I doubt your MIL will stop at breastfeeding. She will probably have opinions on when to wean and just what solids your baby should have, whether you should stop the nursing earlier or later, what age your son goes to nursery and when to start potty training.

I don't mean to be negative, it just seems to me that she's playing the alpha female so you will either roar and let her know who is the boss or fashion a pair of invisible earplugs and just go "lalalalala" whenever she offers her priceless advice.

tiktok · 31/03/2012 00:00

Sounds like your MIL and your DH are in cahoots - not good for you or your family :(

Your MIL can be frozen out of discussions about feeding pretty easily, but it's more difficult with your DH, as fathers obviously have a role in any decision about their kids' well-being (and a good thing too!).

But he seems to have very fixed, yet uninformed ideas, perhaps based on what his mother is telling him, and that's not good for any relationship - something to nip in the bud, really, I would have thought. When it comes to taking sides, it's yours he should be on, not his mother's.

I can't imagine it's a good thing for any mum to have to 'prime' the HV to say the right thing, so the dad is appeased :(

Your relationship, your marriage, your choice....but, well, Shock :(

Cleverclever · 31/03/2012 09:19

I think what I need to try to remember here always is that ultimately both my husband and MIL just want the baby to be well- and are speaking from the standpoint of concern about his wellbeing, rather than trying to get at me as a mother. Though sometimes it's hard to do that when I've knocking my pan in to feed the baby and the comments are still negative on that score.

My husband does often have some very good instincts about other aspects of parenting and I've learned to value his opinion in other areas - so I am trying to avoid being overly dismissive. He's really not saying I should not breastfeed, just maybe that we need to supplement more to boost my son's weight and my worry is that I know going down that route can irrevocably damage supply, leading to the end of bfing altogether.

I also tend to be the sort of person that tries to see things from other people's point of view, although in this case it seems to be undermine my own confidence that I am able to feed my son. MIL is also very supportive in other ways-we usually get on very well as a rule- so I just need to find a way to tune out the negative stuff.

I also don't mean I should somehow be in cahoots with the HV- just that if she is aware of my husband's concern, she can maybe come prepared with some additional facts and information on the growth charts that would dispel any unnecessary worry.

OP posts:
nickelhasababy · 31/03/2012 10:50

unfortunately, it sounds like your dh takes his mother's word too much as gospel.

sorry.
you need to tell him over and over that you are doing the best for the baby, and that him undermining you is not helping.

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