Am I being selfish?

[Mammahippo]

Hello, hoping somebody out there can tell me what to do!

My 16 week old DS refuses to settle for a feed in the morning once he is up (usually between 7:30 - 8:30). If I sit down to feed him (he is ebf), he screams, arches / goes rigid and generally gets very upset. We've seen various medical types who generally aren't that interested because he's big and putting on lots of weight, so they don't see this as a massive issue. Its been suggested that he is suffering from reflux, so I give him infant gaviscon in the morning. Whilst this sometimes seems to to work, other times it doesn't. I find it distressing that he won't eat, sometimes until as late as 5pm before he has a 'proper' feed for the day.

Also, I'm puzzled by the fact that he feeds quite happily in the evening and his best, most cencerted and focused feeding is overnight. This makes me sceptical of the reflux diagnosis and think that he is really just doing his daytime feeding at night. This would also link to the fact that although he goes to bed at about 8pm, he is then waking for feeds quite frequently, perhaps six times across the twelve-hour 'night' period.

I've just been discussing this with the immunisation nurse who has suggested I start weaning at 17 weeks/4 months - just baby rice as a way to encourgae day-time feeding. I'm aware the guidelines are to exclusively breast-feed until 6 months. Would it just be selfish of me (wanting some longer sleep periods at night) to start on baby rice so soon?

Does anyone have a simialr experience? Any advice?

Sounds like your baby is reverse cycling Mamma and although weaning wouldn't be selfish is isn't advised until 6 months as you have said, also, I really can't see how weaning your baby would help with reverse cycling.

Have a read of this on reverse cycling, and you may want to read this on baby rice before making your choice.

There are lots of studies that say to wean before 6mo too. My ds had formula, not through my choice, but then i accepted it and it didn't do any harm. What Im trying to say is that not bf isn't necessarily a bad thing.
To introduce food is fine. I did at 15 weeks. It's not going to cause huge problems if you give a bit of water in a beaker and some food. Though from experience not many babies will eat baby rice. Veg and fruit might be a better bet.

Sorry its a bit garbled, on my phone and very distracted.
Basically just do whatever you like. It won't hurt him.

Also, we did sleep training of weaning off milk at might by reducing quantity and concentration of bottle. You can't really do that bf, but the book said to try giving water before feeding at night, cos most don't really need it, it's just to help them settle. We did this from 5weeks and in 4day he slept 9hrs.

Good grief that's a mess. Anyway, i hope it helps in some way. And best of luck in deciding. Don't worry, your dc will be fine whatever.

X

That's very interesting ItWas. Have you got any links to the research that says early weaning is a good thing?

food has fewer calories than milk so introducing it won't fill your baby up more than bm

introducing food too early CAN cause huge problems - immature gut, greater likelihood of allergies etc., so please be aware of this

I can absolutely understand your tiredness and it's not at all selfish to need a proper night's sleep, but it would be better in the long run not to wean for another 10 weeks.

Not selfish but I don't think it will work. I gave ODS rice at 4 months, he's 9 and it was recomended - didn't make any difference.

I ebf, but if I was going to supplement with anything would choose formula over rice, which really has limited nutritional value.

ItWasThePenguins can I ask where your advice is from as all the information I've read says tha weaning early is not recommended and giving water to babies under six months is dangerous unless advised to by a physician.

I'd be careful of weaning too early. He might well not be able to digest it, so just get tummy ache and food passing through the immature gut could cause an immune reaction leading to intolerances and allergies.

Try cutting down the length of the feeds at night by taking him off the boob. He might protest but you know he won't be starving and he should increase his day feeds (when you let hm feed as much as he wants) to compensate.

ItWasThePenguins - although some studdies do maybe show that some baby's are ready to wean before 6months. They all agree on one thing that weaning before 17week's can acctualy be quit harmfull.

The gut linning in baby's is open allowing alligines to pass into the blood stream. As a baby develops this slowly closes it's generaly agreed that by the time a baby is six months all baby's gut's have closed. Therefore the blancket recomendation of six months.

But what they have shown is that a baby's physicaly devlepment coinsides with this gut clossing. Therefore a baby who can sit unaided and put food in there own mouth should have a closed gut.

You can read more hear www.kellymom.com/nutrition/solids/delay-solids.html

What things have you tried to get him feeding in the day?

I was told by health visitor that it was fine from 4months. She even advised what to give. My ds was sitting up unaided at that age and was putting things in his mouth, so by your logic MG he was ready.
i was just trying to share my experience and what I've been told along the way, i didn't mean to upset anyone. My son eats anything we have, and has since before 1yo. He tries everything and has no allergies. It worked for us.

my boys did this, things that helped

taking them to bed for a few feeds in the day, so that they would have a good feed.

feeding them standing up and walking/rocking

also having them in a sling so they can have easy boob access, again whilst moving seemed to help.

they did all grow out of it but it was an issue we had on and off for months, they were all very nosey babies and got distracted easily!

re food, all giving him solids will do is fill him up a bit more but as he still needs the calories from milk he will still feed at night, probably more so as eh islikely to feed less in the day if you give him food as he wont feel hungry.

I think these days there is far to much 'this is right, that is wrong'. It's your baby so you do what you think is best. It's trial and error. Give some food through the day and if it works, great. If not then you might want to hold of till slightly older. All of today's adults were probably put onto food at 4 months and it's not done us any harm. As already said, I would go for fruit/veg purée rather than baby rice. Even try a first stage cereal. wait till the magic 17 weeks then give it a go

Can't offer any advice on the reverse sleeping/feeding but I understand that you want sleep. It's not at all selfish so don't worry about that

Oh and my dd was bf for 4 weeks then onto ff. she has always drunk well so can't say how to encourage more there. Good luck

No HV should br advising weaning before 17weeks at the bare minimum, if she is still then she needs retraining. Baby's should only be weaned before this on the advice of a peditrution.

OP: it could be reflu if DC is reacting to something you eat at the same time each day, and it subsides by nighttime?, Soy and dairy are common culprits so see if you can see a pattern.
As for the later debate, I think weaning from 17 weeks can be okay, in certain cases and under medical supervision (not some daffy HV), but weaning before then is likely to result in kidney damage - so please don't, the damage is irreversible but not likely to be seen for 20 years or so and simple isn't worth it for a month and a half's wait. Some things are trial and error but for other things we have health researchers, and its up to us whether we want to take the benefit of their work looking at the outcomes of hundreds of thousands of families, or do our own trials using our kids as guinea pigs. I know which one I'd opt for.

Fuzzy, weaning at 4 months has been shown to lead to a greater risk of obesity in adult life. I'd say early weanings done a lot of people some harm.

I don't think early weaning had got much to do with obesity. In my opinion obesity is caused by over eating, not weaning 8 weeks earlier than what the current guidelines are

I agree fuzzyduck. People are always too quick to blame something else and not take control of things they should. It's fast food (and perhaps a little lack of knowledge about diet) that's causing obesity IMO. People just like to overindulge and not take responsibility for their actions.

And to say using our kids as guinea pigs? Hardly! I said give a little fruit/veg/cereal a go, if it helps great, if not stop and wait.

Thank you. Teaching kids from an early age about portion control, not allowing to over eat etc will prevent obesity.

Sigh, here we go again with personal anecdotes verses clinically tested health research. Of course fast foods and sedentary lifestyles play a huge part in obesity. But they should affect us all equally no matter when we were weaned. But scientists have found that regardless of diet and activity later in life, early weaning increases the likelyhood of adult obesity. They looked at thousands and thousands of families, looked at who weaned early then looked at who got fat, so you personally disagreeing with that finding is abit pointless really. I might as well disagree that the earth is round because it looks flat out of my window and it always has.
And I'd say testing out food early on someone, and if it works keeping doing it, and if it doesn't stopping doing it, is just like conducting your own rudimentary sort of trial - and the nickname for people who have things tested on them in a trial is a guinea pig. I'm sorry if I've caused you offence, could be worse, could have caused you permanent kidney damage or a lifetime of obesity.

Hiya
Have you ruled out tongue tie? milkmatters.org.uk/2011/04/15/hidden-cause-of-feeding-problems-however-you-feed-your-baby/

Re baby rice: www.analyticalarmadillo.co.uk/2011/12/nine-good-reasons-not-to-use-baby-rice.html

AA

Thanks to everyone who responded. We've started trying to reduce feeds at night so I'll see how that goes... Holding off on weaning for now.

Could be he's too nosey and distracted during the day? Are you feeding him in a quiet room with minimal distractions? not based on anything at all, just a thought!

Good luck, we have vaguely similar issue with DD feeding more frequently at night than during the day