Desperately seeking advice for v. painfully engorged breast

[Wills]

Hi, I've read other threads and have tried many things. I woke at 4.00 am this morning in pain and things are simply not getting any better. At 4.30 this morning I tried a hot bath, this has been followed by massaging, combing, and attempts to use an Avent hand express pump. All I've got out of the breast is about 40mls. DDs is not contented with the other breast - (never has been) and I've been advised not to use either soya or cows milk formula because of her potential allergies by my gp. I've also tried keeping a hot water bottle on it and am permanently putting dd2 to the breast. She is getting as equally unhappy as I and things are "sinking fast" in this household. Meanwhile I'm now starting to feel rough but this may be because I've either had dd2 on the breast or been pumping and my breast is screamingly painful.

My breast feeding councellor is phoning me tonight but I've got to get to then - anyone with any more tips? (Can't find savoy cabbage ). Pleeeease

Hopefully, you'll hear from Mears (bf-expert) soon. In the mean time, you should know that nothing compares to putting your dd on the breast. Expressing is not as good as putting your DD on the breast, so you are doing the right thing - just keep her on the breast, and try to stay off the pump. Sitting under the shower - with a warm moist towel should help - sounds like cabbage leaves are out, although I've heard that advised too. Just keep your DD on the breast as long as possible. Good luck and hopefully Mears will be on soon.

Just realized that it is unclear to me whether you are putting your DD on the engorged breast, or on the other breast. You need to keep her on the engorged breast - to empty it obviously. Expressing will not do the job as well as your DD will. Painful as it is. . . HTH.

Yes, it's vile but keep her on, honestly it should empty you better. I am SO sorry.

Have you tried different feeding positions? The best I found for relieving engorgement-on-the-verge-of-mastitis was feeding lieing down on the engorged side, with the 'lower' arm outstretched on the mattress over the baby's head. HTH.

Sympathies Wills, I know how painful this is. Like boyandgirl I found different positions useful - rugby hold alternated with baby across the chest was great for me. I think you're doing this - but keep feeding on both breasts, and definitely on the one that's engorged and painful. I had one side that was agony to feed from, and I found it best to feed from the less painful side first because my dd's latch on was so strong when she was hungry. Then I'd bung her on the sore side to finish off and let her feed as long as she wanted.

You could try pumping whilst feeding from one side - as the baby will trigger the let down for you. But I never really got the hang of that very well!

It will get better - but i know how miserable it is when it's so painful and how it just dominates your life.

Try and get dd to feed from that breast - much more effective than a pump. Take some brufen for the pain. Massage breast whilst feeding. How about a cool compress if warm hasn't helped. Definately yrt alternative feeding position. If you get the milk moving hopefully the pain will resolve. The last thing you need is antibiotics with your thrush history.

Yep been trying different positions and definitely trying to leave her on the breast, the problem is that she's obviously not get enough and she too is getting rather pissed of and keeps fussing it i.e. moving her head rapidly and arching her back, all movents which of course pull the breast around. She's getting very hungry.... I've been thinking about running a bath and sitting in it with her on my breast but am a little nervous to do that - what do you think?

Yup, that is worth a try. Is there someone there to hand her to you? If so, lie on your stomach in the bath and dangle your boobs in the water for a few minutes first. If she is tugging around perhaps the milk is not flowing too well - may be a little blockage somewhere that will shift. Offer her the other side too if you can. She may also be fussing because she can sense that you are stressed. You both might benefit from some relaxation in the bath.

Also, Wills, remember that if you are engorged, and she is sucking, she is getting her milk. There is a large psychological component to breastfeeding. Do not worry that she is not getting enough milk - as clearly you are producing, having become engorged. I know how painful it is, but it will pass. You may have a blocked duct, but that will clear with DD's feeding on that side. Also, remember for yourself - to stay hydrated - drink lots of water and make sure you yourself are eating well.

Wills - I was thinking about your problem whilst at swimming lessons with dd. Have you inspected your nipple to see if there is a white spot present? Sometimes the duct is blocked at the exit point of the nipple with a hard crust of milk. You can remove it with a sterilised needle - the milk often spurts out in a jet to release the pressure.
Here is some info on it with treatment suggestion
here

Mears that's very useful and I will give it a go in a mo. I've just returned from my bf councellor who has spent the last hour and half trying hard to clear it. Unfortunately its just as bad as ever and she agrees that its a blocked duct. We managed to get a ounce and half out but that was it and now my nipple is incredibly sore. My main concern now is my fear. I'm suddenly very frightened that this will spell the end of my breast feeding. I know this will work against me as I need to relax and chill out, however my bf councellor was concerned enough to recommend that should the situation not have resolved itself by tomorrow morning that I should get myself to my gp. Words such as breast absces (sp?) were mentioned and I foolishly didn't follow up. This probably sounds full of bravado but I don't care about the pain I'm just very concerned that I'm able to continue bf my dd2. After 14 weeks of fighting thrush I really really don't want to fail at the final furlong. Can anyone give me reassurance that its early days and that I really shouldn't be worrying yet???

As my boob was so engorged i couldn't get dd1 on it as the nipple was flat. I expressed to reduce it from a massive balloon so as she could latch on and that really helped plus i used a nipple shield for a few days. I found massage just made me more sore but warm flannels helped reduce the pain.

I've had this twice and I was very lucky to be able to get rid of it. I did the same hot bath, as much hand expressing in the bath as I could, paracetmol for the fever (do you have a fever? sounds like it if you feel rough) and then went to bed with DD and let her suckle that side to het heart's content!

I really hope you manage to sort it - can you relax and have a rest, it might help if you're feeling stressed about it

p.s. I feed DD in the bath ALL the time, she lies across me with her head resting on my arm - it's very relaxing. Problem is she sometimes fall asleep!!

Wills - do not lose heart. You have worked too hard to let it all go by the wayside. This hurdle can be overcome, it will resolve. Have you tried a wee alcoholic drink to aid relaxation? Sometimes you can try too hard. You will get through this in the next few days. Even in the worst case scenario of a breast abscess, you can have that treated and still continue to breastfeed.

I had mastitis and a blocked duct on separate occasions. DD fed through both, I did find that a warm wet compress helped with the blocked duct. Neither of these events stopped my breastfeeding. HTH

TRY THIS - I know too what u r going thru. Feeling like u hav flu and even the slightest movement, sneeze or cough causing pain.

I was not disimilar to a rugby ball with hardly a nipple to latch onto that was split and painful beyond belief. I tried all positions but all proving so painful I'd be in tears while my son fed. I was as determined as you sound to continue to bf.

The best thing for me was an electric breat pump. Its pressure was gradual and consistent and worked wonders. I fed my son on the good breast first and at the same time started the elec. br pump on the other side. Once you have the let down reflex and a decent size nipple change baby over to have a good feed off the engorged breast. Its not pain free by any means but is quicker to settle into a decent feed to reduce the pressure.

To get over this very painful period I did take painkillers half an hour or so before a feed but I'd rather that than antibiotics. Its need is short lived.

To prevent the build up of pressure I'd use the elec breast pump to control the amount of milk produced myself instead of relying on baby. The breast is an amazing life giving thing and will adjust to suit as you know.

It only took a few feeds to feel comfortable before a feed to calm myself down. I felt in control and once you have that then you can relax too.

There are people who say whats right and whats wrong for bfeeding but you are in the position where its you who need to decide and you can only do that by judgement of your feeds and milk produced as you go and what works for you and your baby to get thru this difficult time.

Once the engorgement is under control the amount of milk and feeds will come together and give you many many months of joyful, unforgettable moments.

I got thru it and u can too. I successfully bf my son for 13 months and if it wasn't for my friend Nicky's encouragement of "persavere coz it pays dividends you'll never forget" I am sure I'd have given in.

PS: I was warned that once I started on nipple sheilds I'd struggle to get my son to accept my nipple once healed - Its just another thing for you and your baby to work through later - and you can. I used shields for many weeks and it had no detrimental affects at all.

Gud luck

Just so u r sure Wills that's an ELECTRIC breast pump its amazing the difference it makes to a hand pump. Beg, steel or borrow one if you can -even at this time of night - I am sure all the other ladies that have offered advice tonight would get out of bed whatever the hour to get it to you. Don't be afraid to call a friend or even your midwife. Even call your local maternity hospital as they do have electric pumps on the wards that you can use. They arent exactly mobile but it will get you through the next few hours until you can purchase one.

Its an incredibly important thing for you and your baby. Do all that you can, if that means a late night trip then I'd definately do it. Its worth considering if its 'do-able'

I sat up until half past twelve last night and I'm pleased to report some progress - small, but definite. My bf councellor has hired to me an electronic pump and I'm now using that before and after dd2's feeds. I had a large glass of wine and a really really hot bath (the two really didn't mix well) and managed to express loads off in the bath. I'm also taking ibruprofen and that too is helping. This morning I've still got a big lump, but its definitely shrunk from being two thirds of my breast to only half and is not as painful. I'm going to keep going with the routine of iniating the feed using the pump, then dd2, then finishing with the pump.

Fingers crossed and thanks to everyone.

I'm so glad to hear that things are a little better . Persevere and you'll see that they will continue to improve...you've done so very well so far. I just remembered something else that helped me, because my dd has been a dreadful thrasher, which really hurt my boobs, and it certainly doesn't help when they're sore already! I used to give her the dummy for a minute or so in the feeding position, and then slip it out of her mouth and present the nipple immediately. That way she seemed to settle into the feed with less thrashing. I don't know why it worked, because in theory it shouldn't, but it did!

Things are definitely getting better but the lump is still there, but smaller! Does anyone know roughly how many ounces a 3month old would be drinking at each feed. dd2 seems particularly hungry but I'm getting at least 3 ounces out of my breast when I express and am then putting her own till she finishes. Probably being way over the top but am now concerned that my production is getting less