new mum with BF woes

[Rubeywednesday]

my DD (first child) is 11 days old and we got off to a bit of a bad start with BF - she was forceps delivery and her face was bruised and she wasn't able to latch on at all at first. On the advice of the HV we got her on formula feed on day 3 just because the poor mite was clearly starving. Since then I've been BF all day and giving her a bottle at night. I like this because it obviously gives me (and my nipples) a break and she also tends to sleep longer. During the day she is feeding constantly from me and never seems to be satisfied with breast alone - she will suckle for over an hour, sleep for twenty minutes and wake up starving again, pretty much all day.

Does anyone know if this amount of feeding is normal or is the night-time bottle feed meaning I'm not producing enough milk for her? I am also in quite a bit of pain even though the HV, Breastfeeding suppport person and every other mother I've asked seems to think her latch is good. Does is just hurt anyway for a while?? professional advice seems to say if they're latched properly there should be no pain, yet friends tell me its just painful for a while anyway.

any advice would be appreciated. I'd also love to hear from anyone who successfully mixed fed at this age and continued doing so.

Sorry that things have been so hard :(

Yes unfortunately you need to feed at night to get your milk production going. Very very important in the early weeks. Some people can get away with the odd bottle at this stage but I don't thing bottles all night and BF in the day will work at 11 days.

You should try and see another BF counsellor and go to a BF support group if you can. I had many people tell me I was latching fine with DS (and DD), but I wasn't. I had someone come over to my house and help with DS. Once I got the latch right it didnt hurt (until he slid off again), so I knew painfree was possible.

Has she been checked for tongue tie?Awareness of this is growing at the moment - I didn;t know about it with DS, but did for DD and it has been a source of many troubles for us. I was told it was a minor tie but had a specialist come over and found out it was far from minor!!!

Thanks very much Iggly. I have another appointment with a BF counsellor this friday and hoping to see my local group too. I will stop with the bottle night feeding and see how i get on - very upset about this as don't think I can face nights of hour long feeds and 20 minute naps

The BF counsellor did suggest she had a minor tongue tie but it should be fine... I will get this checked out again!

Even a minor tongue tie can affect their feeding so definitely get this checked out again.

In what way are you in pain? is it just an initial "ow" at the start of a feed which passes after 30secs, or are your nipples getting properly sore / cracked? Are they mishapen after a feed? Again, if her latch looks ok but you are getting sore nipples this could come back to the TT.

Unfortunately the night time feeds are really important, especially in the early days. Anything you can do to help support night feeding is a good thing. Stock up on pre-wrapped cakes, bananas, treat yourself to some posh cordial so you have something nice to drink, and keep them close to your bed so you don't have to get up to feed in the night.

I would also get the latch looked at by another person. I was told DD's latch was fine but my nipples got ripped to shreds, then I got thrush but that's another story. It does stop hurting after a while as baby gets bigger and learns to feed more efficiently. Don't be afraid to break the latch if it's not right and put baby back on. Your nipple should look the same shape after a feed as it did before.

See if you can be referred to a tongue tie specialist.

My GP, the paediatrician, HV, MW etc all said it was minor until I found someone who specialises in TT who told me otherwise. 11 weeks of difficulty for nothing.

Also ask the BF counsellor to teach you how to feed lying down. I promise you it really makes the world of difference at night!

Totally agree with Iggly. It does sound as though the latch isn't right because of the length of the individual feeds, although the frequency sounds about right in these early stages - eat and sleep is about all they do at this stage!

I would definitely check with a specialist, does your PCT have an infant feeding co- ordinator or is there a lactation consultant who works for them (infant feeding co-ordinators are often lactation consultants). My personal experience has been that you can speak to a lot of doctors, midwives and health visitors whose opinions you trust because of their professional capacity, but in actual fact they have turned out to be wrong because they are not given training or updates in breastfeeding. There is a lot of misinformation floating around, so it really is important you see a specialist.

I struggled with my first child through four bouts of mastitis and I permanently had sore nipples, which I put up with because my doctor told me they were normal and the HV said my latch was fine.

With my second child I had a different HV who spotted tongue- tie. I was referred to a lactation consultant who sorted it out, checked my latch, and I have been feeding ever since ( she's almost 2).

One good sign of a good latch is: baby take several fast sucks at first, settling down into a slower, shallower suck, with swallows every 1-2 sucks, coming off contentedly and perhaps sleepily of their own accord.

Perhaps look here for immediate help? www.kellymom.com/bf/start/basics/latch-resources.html

thanks for all your advice. i have an appointment with lactation consultant tomorrow so hopefully things will improve - she spotted the posibility of tongue-tie before so i will get her opinion on if it needs to be treated

Hello Rubey, not sure if you'll pick this up but just wanted to offer support; not an expert but can give you my experience.

I was in exactly the same position- one bottle feed in the evening gave me (and my nipples, as you say!) a break, and allowed me to get a good chunk of sleep from say 10 to 2/3. I would then be feeding him for the other 20-odd hours, and yes, it felt almost permanent, especially with the cluster feeding in the evening where he just wouldn't let go for hours!
Kept me sane though.

For the first two weeks I yelled the phrase 'bad words!!' repeatedly as he latched on, as it hurt, but the cracked nipple and the blistered one healed by about day 10.

It got easier every two weeks, and by four weeks he was essentially EBF, which he has continued, and by week six it was just so much easier.

Second everyone on here that says if you're concerned, get checked out and also (if you're able) co-sleep. That has made a massive difference, as once we stopped giving him a bottle, it meant I would get 8-12 hours a night, albeit interrupted by pushing a boob in DS's direction every few hours...

Hope bf goes well, and congratulations on DD.

What did the lactation consultant say?