Is my 4 1/2 month old feeding too often? (EBF)

[LittleWaveyLines]

During the day she currently feeds every hour to hour and a half, except if we are out when it extends to 2 hours before she gets majorly grumpy.

At night I have one 3 hour stretch between feeds, then it reverts to 2 hourly to hourly feeds.

She has never gone longer than 2 hourly with one 3 hour stretch at night. NEVER. (I'm a but tired...)

Is this too frequent? Or is this normal? When can I expect it to stretch out a bit?

Birnamwood As you've seen - you don't :) Too dangerous.

But, using a woven wrap, what I do is pop bub on my back, then place the centre of the wrap around him, then I tie it. Simple .

So, as it's not that simple, you need a demo in person (preferably). Is there a sling meet near you?

Oh dear, had a grumpy baby this morning after being in the Moby for 10 minutes. But he did consent to nap for half an hour during the morning walk in his travel system... Man, this baby is fickle! :)

seriously doubting myself ladies.
Had to take my mum to emergency dept at tea time last night after suspected heart attack- thankfully she's ok and it wasn't but... Had to leave ds with dh from 6-11 pm as it took so long to get all clear. With not enough ebm in freezer dh had to give ds 2 bottles formula. That's hard enough, but lo and behold he slept 5 hr stretch. Dunno what to think or feel, but am both sad and a bit confused as to what to do next. Yes I got some much needed sleep, but it's not really a road I want to travel iyswim? Please reassure me, cos I feel crap!!

Could it be he just slept because he knew you weren't there so couldn't get milk from you, so it wasn't worth waking up? It might not have been the formula. Maybe he was just tired out by the stress?

I know how you feel though - in my antenatal group of ladies, there are only 4 breastfeeders left, and the other 3 all give a bottle of formula at night - and they sleep now....

Mmm- you might have something
clutches straws he did cry for over an hour after the first bottle , which he has never done before (doesn't get a chance to cry), so he might have tired himself out... Then I wasn't there for second bottle either. Feeling a little better now! Just wouldn't want to think he's not getting filled up well enough by me....

Yeah I expect it was the crying

It's very common for babies to get a bottle of formula, then crash out, and sleep well thus making a mum really worry about her milk supply/whether they're getting enough.

Yet - FF babies don't sleep better than BF babies (taken as a group). Some will, some won't.

But sometimes stocking a baby up with formula will get them to sleep longer. But consider what they're doing - if BFing is the biological norm and their sleeping patterns when BF are therefore that baby's individual normal pattern (hard as that may be), filling up with formula is interfering with that natural pattern.

Does this matter?

Maybe. Formula is harder to digest (I know you know this, but I'm writing it all out because who knows who is reading it) and takes longer to get through a baby's system. This can lead to a longer, deeper sleep for a baby who isn't naturally made to do this and this is a known SIDS risk. (Compare this with the fact that SIDS is exceptionally rare so nothing to panic over per se).

But what you are doing is interfering with what is natural for that baby (by tanking them every night) and no one knows what the ongoing risks of that are (aside from the known risks of using formula).

Kellymom as always explains it well:

www.kellymom.com/nutrition/solids/solids-sleep.html

I'm not sure exactly where you need reassurance. Was it ok to give formula? Yes, of course, your baby would have been distressed and in pain without it. Will it have harmed him? As a one-off? If he's no dairy allergy (which would have shown up?) No. Over the next week or two his gut will be re-lined with your milk so in theory over the next little while he'll be marginally more prone to infections but realistically as you BF this will sweep stuff out.

Are you worried that he's not sleeping well because he's not getting enough milk from you? Nahh, he's growing fine (I assume), all the usual things. He's just not a good sleeper.

However, if you do get desperate for sleep then you've got the option of doing this again if you want to. The choice is always yours. You know the pros and cons and we all know that sleep deprivation is utterly, utterly appalling and potentially dangerous if you're driving, etc.

Glad your mum is ok. That must have been a terrible shock :(

"But what you are doing is interfering with what is natural for that baby (by tanking them every night) and no one knows what the ongoing risks of that are (aside from the known risks of using formula)."

Sorry, badly worded mampig. I didn't mean that YOU are doing this every night. I meant that "if one did". Sorry.

Thank you Carrot . And I'm very glad you pointed out the link between deep long sleeping and SIDS, which I hadn't considered. I know what I'm doing ( bf) is best, it just seemed like a big kick in the teeth, after the night I'd had I suppose! I won't be giving formula as routine anyway, or even for more sleep, but glad I had some for this emergency! Thanks again

It's not best, it's normal :)

But lots of things kick us in the teeth. When DS2 sleeps really well snuggled up to Daddy but will kick, bite and jump on me all night I feel (literally sometimes!) kicked in the teeth. .

I am being serious though. Teeth kicking is all part of being a parent. Just wait until he's at the "I HATE YOU" stage .

It will all be fine :)

Oh please can I join you!? All of this sounds so familiar! My 4 and a half month DS feeds every 1.5 to 2 hours during the day, and during good periods every 3 hours at night, hourly when bad. I too get the poonami in the morning - in fact it normally wakes DS up at around 5am every morning, and nothing will get him back to sleep so we start the day then. He generally doesn't like being put down for more than 10 mins at a time, and I usually only get that right after a nap. He also won't sleep on his own - in fact he will currently only sleep on me, not even next to me. I have to go up to bed with him at 7, so I get no evenings to myself. We had a little success getting him into his cot for 1.5-2 hours at the start of the night, but then he got a cold 3 weeks ago and won't even do that now! He hates the car seat, and the pram so I mostly use the sling, which I don't mind at all, in fact I really like it! I do feel like I've barely put him down in his short little life so far. The only break I get is when DP gets home from work when I can make/eat dinner and have a few mins to myself when DP baths him.

I'm resigned to this just being who he is (although he really can't sleep on me much longer, he's getting too big!) and have mostly been able to just go with the flow. It does get a bit depressing though when every journey out in the car is a battle with purple faced hysterics, I really hate seeing him like that. It does make me think twice about going out at times, which I find hard to deal with.

I do find it difficult talking to other people at times - it does feel like I'm being judged - like I've made him this way by always picking him up etc etc, you know the type of comments, I'm sure. My take has always been that I've done what I felt is best, and he is who he is, but I do question myself when comments are made. :(

It's great to know I'm not alone! DS is my first child, and I love him incredibly but I often wonder if I have a clue what I'm doing!!

Welcome! You are most definitely not alone in most of that (my DD is the same barr sleeping on me at nights - has to be touching, but doesn't have to be on me...)

I think we need a list:

1. Feeds frequently daytime
2. Feeds frequently nighttime
3. Needs to be constantly held
4. Wont sleep alone
5. Hates the car seat/pram
6. Short naps

If you get 5 out of the 6 you can join the club - actually, what do people think about a special "high needs baby club" thread?

DD asleep on me currently.... would not be put down AT ALL all morning....

I think a dedicated thread is a great idea!!

Absolutely!! See u there!!

Jeewizz... Are you me? Seriously, apart from the sleeping on you during the night, your life is pretty much identical to mine!

I often feel like I don't have a clue. Well, to be honest, 99% of the time. I dread going out also, due to the aforementioned histrionics.

I love him so much but he is such a challenge...

It's good to have you join us :)