breast to formula...

[kiki22]

I am FF baby once here but am thinking of doing some BF in the first 2/3 days for the Colostrum but tbh i have no idea about BF and am worried if i start him on breast he won't want the formula. Can anyone give me any advice on this? will it make it harder to stop leaking after or cause any more pain than not feeding at all.

I am deff only doing 3 days max so plz no advice on continuing to BF i have heard it all don't mean to sound rude i have just made the decision and don't want to go over the 'just try' 'you might like it' or it's best for baby' convos.

Hi there! At 3 days it would be very easy to transfer to ff, and you are right in trying to give your baby the colostrum . Also after the 3 days , it shouldn't really make u leak any more than if u never fed tbh. The shortest but probably most painful way to stop producing milk is to just stop feeding and go cold turkey. Take painkillers and pop a savoy cabbage leaf in your bra, along with breast pads. The leaf is cold and helps to drain the breast. Also pointing shower head on your boobs also helps to scatter the milk. Engorgement can be very sore, but if you start expressing you might just confuse your body. Just watch out for mastitis. When I went cold turkey thats what I did and the pain only lasted a couple of days, and I didn't get mastitis either. Good luck with the birth of your baby and don't forget you'll have a midwife to hand for any advice u need- plus mumsnet of course!!!

thank you :) unfortunatly my midwife is pro BF to the point every time i start asking she gives me a rant / lecture about not BF!

If cold turkey won't work well can anyone advise the best (least painfull) way of switching between over a few days?

I know I had the devils own job to get ds on the breast after he was ff whilst I was in intensive care.
No idea if it would be the same the other way. Ff is a total faf for me so I was quite determined, you sound as if you are, and know that this combo will suit you both so it should be fine.
I think its quite common for people to start ff after a few days. Good luck.

I think after just 3 days it will probably not make any diffference in terms of leaking or being painful because it's all hormonally driven then (which is why you still produce milk even if you never feed)
I would imagine your baby, being so tiny still, will not have a problem switching to a bottle.

The only other thing I will say is be a bit open-minded. You might have baby, feed for 3 days, switch to bottle. Fine if that's how you want it.
But you honestly might like it and want to continue and sometimes it can be hard to then say to everyone "oh actually I changed my mind" or even to reconcile it with yourself.... so you know, if you do decide to continue a bit longer, or mix feed or whatever then that's fine too, it's ok to change your mind :)

of course the other thing is that it might help you in terms of pain/engorgement etc to tail off slowly. so it is worth considering introducing formula at 4 days or whenever but just slowly increasing it. I know that means breastfeeding for a bit longer, but it would make the transition easier on you plus give baby more breastmilk?

Thanks i'm not BF mainly due to the amount of pain killers i take for back problems so even if i like BF not going to be doing it i have suffered for months and been unable to go out for more than an hour or so at a time due to it and just can not keep going like this with a baby so 3 days is the most i want to do possibly a week mixed if it's easier.

oooooh!

now. there was a poster a little while ago who had a similar problem with painkillers and breastfeeding, for a back problem and I have a vague recollection that it turned out that the painkillers the GP had said were not compatible with breastfeeding actually were.

Might be worth starting a new thread about the specific drug to see if anyone else has taken it while breastfeeding. we have a lot of very, very knowledgeable people on here with regards to medication going into breastmilk (often more knowledgeable than HCPs)

meant to say, drugs that aren't ok during pregnancy are often fine with breastfeeding because it doesn't transfer in the same way.

obviously you should ignore this if you just plain old don't want to breastfeed. but if you would like to were it not for the drugs then it's def somethin you could look into in more depth

I don't really want to do it anyway there are a few reasons PK are just the biggest. I have been told the pain killers won't do any harm to baby but won't do any good either if i have to take them now he stops moving completely for hours and hours plus they make me feel a bit stoned so god knows how a baby would feel. I have spoken to my GP and she agreed that tho BF is better for baby the amount and dose of pain killers i take is not best so basically it's benefits of BF vs draw backs of painkillers and they about even each other out. I've been given a very hard time over what people say is a selfish decision as some think i should stay off the pain meds so i can BF but selfish of not i'm just not willing to do it.

Anyway deff have made a final decision that i don't want buba getting any more pain killers than he already gets so it will be colostrum for a few days then formula once real life resumes after hospital it's just the how i need to decide now.

If the meds make you stoned will you be able to take them and look after baby (regardless of feeding method)? Or do you have help set up so you can take painkillers and hand baby over to be looked after until the 'stoned' effect wears off?

Kiki- it is very understandable!! My dd2 broke my coccyx during delivery . I was on so many painkillers and trying to rest as much as poss. Also it was difficult to get a painfree feeding position, and I have long term back probs as a result of compensating for the pain of that. Thankfully I don't need long term pain relief now and I happily bf my 19 wo. You know what u can cope with, and you are trying your best, weighing everything up etc. One thing I should warn u about tho is the emotional relationship that bf creates. This time around when ds was 6 wo, I was told to stop due to medication. I was shocked at how emotionally attached I had become to our bf relationship. I fought to get safe meds and turned out ok . Just wanted to share this as it's something u may not have considered- good luck!

truth sweet yes i do they can make me very drowsy on days i have to take a lot so my mum will be round plus dp has 3 weeks leave to be with us after 2 or 3 weeks my tolerence should be back up to allow me to take them without feeling spaced out. I'm starting treatment to fix it after babys born but will not be a quick fix so pain meds are a must i was half way through a physio program wen i fell pg and i can tell you i couldn't have done it without med.

mampig I've looked into what is safe and what isn't safe and have also been on many different types but the most effective combo is not great for babys, If i felt strongly about BF i might try to go for weaker ones but i don't so am going to take the stong meds so i am able to do other things and get treatment. I only want to do it for a few days because i know it may be hard to give up but after thinking long and hard i honestly believe the best thing for me and baby is to FF.

Kiki- I didn't mean that you should look into safer meds- I just wanted to prepare u that giving up bf can be quite emotional, especially when you will be so hormonal anyway. God no, you have made a decision and I totally respect it- it is what is best for u and baby after all!! But it might be very hard on you emotionally- that's all I meant - sorry

mampig thanks i know it might be hard i did consider not doing it at all but DP would like me to and it's good for buba but i will try to prepare for the emotional side. part of me is hoping i hate it so it's easier to stop lol

That's good that you have lots of support. It seems to be something that some HCPs over look - a drug may be compatible/non-compatible with bfing medically speaking but a drug also needs to be compatible with being a parent as well and some fail to take how much support/back up a parent has into account when prescribing strong or sedating medication.

I've had a few lots of strong painkillers over the years and I remember how spaced tramadol made me (I'm now not allowed to take them as it was worse than IV Morphine effects!). Luckily DH was home as there was no way I could have been in sole charge of the DCs in that state (actually I sat on the sofa for hours giggling whilst I waited for the 2 tramadol tablets to wear off). At no point did I get warned how spaced I could be on the meds and they knew I had children to look after too.

I have found they give out pain meds willy nilly and tho they say things like co codamol is safe during pregnancy i've found that it makes baby very still for hours (14 one day) i can not imagin how something thats making him what i assume is drowsy can be good for him so i would rather just FF and keep all that out of him since the poor things had it from day 1 already.

but milk doesn't transfer into breastmilk in the same way as it does when you are pregnant, so some meds are not safe in pregnancy for example, but are fine when breastfeeding.

i'm not saying that to try and make you change your mind because you sound very sure of your decision, and that is good. but just because i think it's a common misconception and I think that any HCP worth their weight ought to go through all of this with people likely to need long-term medication who are pregnant and may plan to breastfeed

Would you be able to contact the Infant Risk Centerin the US? It's the world's leading resource on medications and babies (in utero and during bfing) and they would be able to discuss with you what happens to baby when you take your meds and what might happen when baby is born (with regards to possibility of withdrawal/breathing issues/feeding colostrum).

The thing is with codeine is that it's not actually the codeine that's the issue - it's the morphine that your body metabolises codeine into that's the issue (codeine is not active in your body - it's the morphine that your body turns the codeine into that gives the pain relief). Codeine is no longer considered a compatible drug for bfing in most circumstances due to some people being able to metabolise more of the codeine into morphine than normal, this extra morphine can cause very serious problems if not picked up soon enough.

Would you feel happier with some expert advice on how to proceed? Would it be possible to arrange a meeting between your pain specialist, obs. consultant and a bfing specialist MW/Infant feeding co-ordinator to have a plan set up for baby's first days/weeks so that everything goes as smoothly as possible?

From personal experience I was encouraged by my neurology cons. to bf DD3 to avoid withdrawal symptoms from my epilepsy medication as if I didn't she could have been quite unwell. Obviously epilepsy meds and codeine/painkillers are very different and this may not apply at all in your case.

I am trying to find someone to speak to about it but every conversation ends up with me defending my decision not to continue to BF so i end up getting frustrated at peoples pushiness and disapproval and get nowhere :(

kiki might it help to think of people not disapproving, but trying to understand the reasons why you're not BFing after a few days? Not because they're being pushy but simply because the VAST majority of these types of calls are from women who DO want to BF, but have come to the conclusion that they can't, because they've been given incorrect information, say, about the safety of a drug they've got to take? What can happen is, with those conversations and with understanding the background, frequently a way for the mum to be able to BF is found.

It must be really frustrating to have to go through your personal story each time, but in order for people to help everyone who calls properly, it's quite important to understand the background. It doesn't mean they're disapproving at all, they're just trying to help, but to help they need to really understand what you're trying to achieve.

Often mums will say they've made the decision to FF anddon'ttrytotalkmeoutofit not because they really want to, but because they are upset about thinking they're not going to be able to BF and just don't want to rake over it again. While it's hard to persuade mums to talk about things in this situation, given that often they CAN be helped to BF, it's worthwhile.

It does mean that in the more rare situation that a mum really can't BF it's even more tough for her to get help, and it may be that you're one of those mums, but perhaps an understanding from the "other side" may make it easier for you to deal with this. :)

And of course some mums really do want to FF - I'm just talking about statistics in terms of calls to support lines.

Hi there. I intended to breast feed......but I only managed 10 days. In the hospital ds was very unsettled and midwives in hospital kept saying it was because he was hungry. I therefore took their advice and gave a bottle feed at night as a top up to try and settle. As he did this from a v early age he could swap from nipple to breast really easily. Think some babies struggle...and will refuse either bottle/breast. I managed to make sure my ds got all the good stuff in the beginning. Had no pain when I stopped but very leaky. I think by day 2 you should be fine...as your milk probably won't be in by then?? However I am clearly no expert but that was my experience. You do whatever you feel is right and forget any negative comments. And good luck!

Regardless of your feeding choices you do need to be supported in your medicine choices by people who understand the effects on the unborn baby. I am very shocked that no one will help you (not disbelieving you at all though!). Have you got a MW/cons. appt coming up soon that you could use to insist on having specialist support? Taking OH/relative/friend for extra support might help too (I always found I needed help with getting a back bone )

Perhaps saying something like - I wish to give my baby colostrum and want support to achieve that and to have a plan to manage moving baby on to formula given that my medical needs and personal wishes preclude long term breastfeeding. If you cannot help me to do that please refer me on to the Supervisor of Midwifery - might clarify matters if your MW thinks by waffling rhetoric at you you will suddenly change your mind.

beckieperk thanks thats really helpful. It does sound like it shouldn't be a problem to change or have a huge effect only pain or leaking.

All medical types i have spoke to have been very helpful on ways to continue to BF and have advised whats safe and what i can do to BF no matter how many times i say i do not want to BF i want to FF they just go on and on about but if you do such and such you can BF feel like screaming I DON'T WANT TO EFFIN BF!! but as i can't i just let them go on. I have given up now and will be doing it the old fashioned way and asking mums i know what they think.