Tongue tie

[lookout]

Following on from my other thread, can anyone share their experience of tongue tie division? Ds has a slight one, feeding is horrible, the pain is driving me to tears at most feeds and we've been offered the snip if we want to.

I was all for it until the mw explained the risks of not being able to stop the bleeding and having to cortorise (sp?), and infection. Just wondered if people could tell me about both feeding with a tt, and getting it snipped.

TIA.

I am really cross with your MW. Unless your baby's tongue tie is very extreme (and your surgeon can advise when he/she sees it), it shouldn't be at risk of bleeding much at all as it's distinct from the veins in the tongue. Some surgeons cauterise it though - I don't know if you've ever had a wart frozen but DH says what was used with DS2 looked like that, but hot.

My younger two both had tongue ties. With DS2 feeding was agony. My HV referred us and it was snipped when he was 3 weeks old. It took ten minutes, he cried but fed immediately and even then (with a sore tongue!), seemed to appreciate the difference. It hurt initially as of course my nipples were shredded at that point but improved so quickly. It made such a difference - I was dreading every feed beforehand and it had affected bonding.

With DS3 I recognised the clover-leaf tongue the moment he was born and pushed for the snip. MWs told me to wait and see but I insisted (could 'feel' he wasn't latching properly and things were going to be painful again), and he was snipped at ten days old. Again - nothing terrible happened. Was a voracious feeder.

Both now old enough that I can be pretty certain their speech wasn't affected by having the snip. However I do know a tongue-tied 4-year-old and his parents wish they'd had it done when he was a baby as he has now 'learnt' to say many words around his tt iyswim, and will need it snipped and speech therapy.

So from my POV, I'd say get it done.

Get a referral a.s.a.p. Speak to the surgeon about your concerns, you can always change your mind if you decide not to go ahead with it.

My advice would be to get it snipped, soon as. The tongue is very involved with breastfeeding and if your baby doesn't have full mobility of his tongue it's likely he's going to struggle to feed effectively.

DD TT was snipped at 10 days old. Feeding was agony beforehand, sooooooo much better after. No problems with bleeding or infection. Best thing I ever did although broke my heart at the time to hear her cry afterwards. Still BF 16 months later....

We can't do the snip until a week on Tues. I'm not sure why but the surgeon 'can't get me on the list for that day'. So we have a wait of 10 days . Reading your messages I am more and more inclined to do it. Just to be able to feed without dreading the excruciating pain would be amazing. Thanks for your replies.

just look up unicef and tongue tie. Will tell you all about it. Some lactation consultants divide tongue tie have a look on IBLCE for your area

A midwife spotted my DD's tongue tie when she was 2 days old. Lactation consultant snipped it at 3days old. Said we could wait & see how feeding went, but DD is a sleepy newborn & she thought that cutting the tongue tie might help with feeding. I watched them do the cut (lactation consultant, then another midwife to hold down swaddled DD. They basically used a pair of small kitchen scissors, no special equipment!). Yes, she screamed, but then fed well & fell asleep after, quite content. No major bleeding or infection or anything untoward after.

I would be inclined to get it done as soon as poss....I do have friends whose babies also had tongue tie but it didnt effect feeding so much, so perhaps wasnt quite so severe. But if its making your life (or nipples!) so painful then its defo worth getting it done.

lookout, ask your midwife if there is anyone else who can see you, it doesn't have to be your local hospital, she can call other teams in other areas and ask. Or get to a breastfeeding group and see if there is anyone there who can refer you elsewhere, or find an LC (who you will probably have to pay) who can either do the division themselves or recommend ways to cope until then. Another 10 days is a LONG time when you're in pain.

Wishing you lots of luck and strength. x

DD2 had her tongue tie divided at 2-3 weeks (took a while to diagnose and then had to wait and then had to drive 2 hours!!)

They showed my photos of what they did, took her away, did it, brought her back crying with a paper towel under her tongue, offered her boob, she fed and that was that. No more blood or tears.

Instant huge reduction in pain level when feeding

fortunately they now perform division at our local hospital.

My DS had a tongue tie and no one noticed before we left hospital (and I had no idea such things were an issue!). Feeding was virtually impossibly painful and we ended up back at a&e with a dehydrated and jaundiced baby 3 days later. Felt like a terrible mother. They got him better in neo natal and snipped his tongue the next day and from then on breastfeeding was soo much easier. We carried on til 10 months. Would def see if they can fit you in earlier, I couldn't have managed another 10 days trying to sringe/cup feed as the mws were trying to get me to (I was adamant I wouldn't give him a bottle - although looking back I now wonder why).

He hardly made a sound when they did it, took seconds, virtually no bleeding. While I was waiting outside, there were a couple of older babies (maybe 10-12 months?) ready to go in next, think that would have been much worse to have to deal with - they were there as it can make a difference to speech as well.
If I have another baby I will be getting them to check his/her tongue before I go home!
Good luck with it all xx

Your MW is a scaremongerer - I am quite cross with her too.

DS had a slight tonguetie, so slight that it was missed by 3 MWs, despite me asking them to check (DH has one too) - the breastfeeding expert was the one who found it by running her finger under his tongue. She said she could refer me then and there or we could see how I went with feeding. A couple of days later, the home visit MW asked me how it was going - felt like razorblades being sucked through my nipples and DS was taking around 2h for each feed (Lying down in bed, mostly) so she referred him to have it separated.

The paediatrician was lovely. He looked, felt it, said it was only a partial and that snipping may make no difference; or it might help. He said he'd seen full tongue ties separated that made no difference, or that made a huge difference; and the same for partials. Did I still want to go ahead? I said yes because I thought it could make a difference so it was silly not to try.

A sip of sugar water, a drop of novocaine (the stuff they use in dental anaesthetic), one quick snip with the scissors, a dab with cotton wool and 5mins later he was on the breast. Not even a whimper. No later bleeding, no problems, no infection and it made a HUGE difference (I had a survey thingy to fill in afterwards, presumably for statistics to show that even partial tongueties can benefit from being separated.)

I am SO GLAD I had DS's tongue tie done, I can't tell you. Feeding improved slowly but became much less painful as he managed to use his tongue better and he fed a lot more quickly.

A friend of mine had a DS with a worse tongue tie than my DS's - not properly picked up until he was 3 when I was teaching him to stick his tongue out and I noticed it. He was having speech problems as well, so they had it done then - general anaesthetic, quite a lot of pain, difficulty eating for a few days - far better to get it done when they're tiny babies.

Think very, very carefully and get a second opinion or referral. My baby was diagnosed with a posterior Tongue tie at about 10 days old and I did some research, spoke to friends and family and heard only positive stories and relief from pain (the mother's) so went ahead when my LO was a month old. The first mum went in, came out within a couple of minutes, sat down and BF with a huge smile. We went in, bleeding didn't stop for 45 min, emergency surgeons called in and two stitches needed under my LO's Tongue. I was devastated and my LO couldn't BF- at all, let alone painfully. I had a nightmare two weeks when I pumped every 2-3 hours, tried all sorts of strategies, felt on verge of collapse, a failure etc but - with local and family support- eventually got BF again. Went to see a specialist after that to check all ok and it seemed to be but he wouldn't have done the snip (he was at GOSH). now, a year on, all is ok but I still regret doing it where I did, even though I really did believe I was doing the right thing. I think it probably is the right thing for some babies and their mothers, esp for BF benefits etc, but would definitely get a second opinion on whether it is necessary.

DS had his TT snipped at 7 or 8 months as feeding was a nightmare. It had been missed be all the HVs and midwives we had seen who just suggested I put him on a bottle instead.

Best thing we did. The area they snip has no nerve endings so baby won't feel anything, although they might not like being held firmly while the snip takes place.

It's all over in a few seconds, DS did not even cry and there was no blood that I could see. No more sore nips for me and DS was a much happier baby when he could feed properly!!

Do it. My tongue tie wasn't diagnosed until I was 11, by which time the snip involved a GA and a night in hospital. I had years of speech therapy pre-diagnosis and needed more after being snipped in order to learn to use my tongue properly. Having it dealt with as a baby would have made my life far easier.

My DS had his done at 8 days and it made an immediate difference. It was over quickly and he fed well straight away. Very little bleeding and healed up fine.

Hospital had spotted it but said it wasn't bad, my community midwife was raging and got him an appointment straight away!

Thanks so much for all your replies. To be fair to the breastfeeding mw, the snip is done at the hospital by a surgeon so she is obliged to tell me of the risks, however small they may be.

Had a dreadful day yesterday, one of my nips was steaming with blood after an unsuccessful latch so I'm leaving it alone. Have been expressing from that side and dh has been giving a bottle, alternating with feeding from the other side. It seems to be working ok atm. Will pseak to mw tomorrow and if she can't arrange to have the snip done this week, I will investigate someone else doing it, there is no way I can wait for another 10 days.

So pleased to hear so many positive experiences. Needakip, i'm really sorry you had such a difficult experience. Can I ask where your babe had his done?

lookout - yes that happened to me too and the GP told me to wait 3 days before feeding from that side again. Before anyone gets aerated about me going to the GP for a bleeding nipple, that's not why I went - DS had vomited up blood and I hadn't realised I was bleeding, so panicked when I saw the blood and managed to see the GP that afternoon. She asked to see my nip and there was the tiny scab - panic over, phew!

3 days, ok that's good to know, thumbwitch. I know it's only been a day but it's still very sore . Slathering on the lansinoh and have to wear breast pads so it doesn't rub on my bra. Hope it'll be better soon, it's very uncomfortable!

A little blob of vasseline on the inside of your breast pad to stop it sticking to your nipple can help.

DS1 is slightly tongue tied -the end of his frenulum joins to his bottom gums, not to the floor of his mouth.

However, I had no idea about this until I learned lots about breastfeeding, by which time he seemed to be able to feed ok. Before that, we did have feeding problems, but I didn't realise. First baby, and of course everybody says oh yes, they feed all the time at that age. But he really did feed ALL THE TIME. My nipples came out blanched and pinched too, but again I didn't realise this indicated tt.

Fast forward to now. He is almost 6yo. He is having terrible gastric trouble and I am absolutely confident that his troubles are because he is swallowing a lot of air. And why's he swallowing a lot of air? Because of his tight frenulum affecting his chewing and swallowing. He also has trouble with congested ears, which I am willing to bet are full of stomach stuff which is being brought up because of the air swallowing

I have only recently pieced this all together and we are in the process of trying to convince the docs that he needs his frenulum operated on. If I had known about it as a baby, it could have been done at that time and saved a lot of pain and distress.

Your choice at the end of the day. There is some interesting reading here and here

My dd had a posterior TT that I diagnosed myself after huge problems with bf. After getting a second and third opinion I found a private lc and had it snipped when she was 4 weeks old.
The procedure was actually VERY straightforward and quick and was much more traumatic for me than her!
There was the tiniest amount of blood on a tissue. Less than a paper cut. Then afterwards she fed well then fell asleep contented and napped as normal. We had no further problems with it.
It took 2 weeks for my nipples to completely heal but I could feel that the latch improved instantly.
Now she's 9 weeks and loves showing off her little Tongue!
Best £100 I've spent
Good luck whatever you decide

Best thing I ever did. Had to have it done twice. Once at local hospital, but was no better. Finally got to see the 'King of TT snips', at Kings, and he did again, saying the local hospital had not done it properly. Bf immediately so no pain for ds2. So glad we had it done.

I just need to pluck up the courage I guess. The sound he made when he had the heel prick done broke my heart and i hate the thought of hearing that again! But we can't go on like this. Will be speaking to my mw tomorrow and will find out when the hospital can do it, but if we really have to wait til the week after I will find someone else to do it. I can't wait another week.

Nipple is still very sore and cracked. Any idea how long it might take to heal?

My ds had his tongue tie snipped at 3 weeks. DP held him on his lap, Dr snipped the tie with some scissors, and that was it. There was literally one drop of blood, and ds cried for about 30 seconds before going back to sleep.

DS2 was snipped at well over 6 months. Had a nightmare of a time with constant pain, blocked ducts, nipple damage, ductal thrush which entered through cut nips, etc up until then but kept on regardless because I'm bloody minded. He was finally diagnosed at 6 months and snipped privately at home some weeks later. He screamed blue murder at being held down for it - but he was a very mobile boy, not a little baby. He didn't really even notice the actual snip as he was too cross at being held down.

He BF immediately afterwards - few drops of blood which immediately dried up and he was absolutely fine straight away. He needed some basic pain relief for 24 hours (paracetamol and ibuprofen) and then was 100% back to normal the next day. Bfing was immediately better, but given how old he was we needed to re-learn decent latching which took a few weeks.

It needed doing again 2 weeks later as it slightly re-grew, and after that things were much, much, much better. He still has a top lip tie but with careful positioning and latching BFing is perfectly comfortable and wonderful. He's 15 months now and we plan to term BF, something I couldn't have considered without the snip as BFing was so awful before.

There are, of course, risks with any procedure. And risks of not doing it. You need to weigh them up and make a decision, and then whatever happens is out of your hands.

From my understanding, excessive bleeding is very, very rare and is easily resolved but you can talk this through with the surgeon for your own peace of mind.

All of mine have tongue-tie, it's only affected one of them feeding wise and that was my first, ds. Back then it was standard to only cut it if it affected thier speech so when I asked for it to be snipped while tiny I was refused. Roll on 3 years later and ds could barely talk, so what would have been a quick, easy, almost painless snip as a newborn turned into an operation with GA a week after his 3rd Birthday. There are few nerves and hardly any blood supply to a newborms frenulum but as they get older all the nerves and veins grow in so it's a more complicate procedure.

I would always recommend getting it done ASAP.