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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

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Original poster

Breast feeding trouble

55 replies

littlemiracle · 14/12/2005 14:21

Hi everybody,

I'm new to this and could really do with some help. After having breast cancer i was given the go ahead to have a baby, who is now 10 wks old. I'm only able to feed from my right breast as left one is pretty much display only! Initially, I did what i was told and breast fed exclusively for 6 wks but she always seemed hungry so i started her on formula as well about 3 wks ago. the problem i'm having is that she only feeds for 5 maybe 10 mins on the breast at any one time, and then is hungry again after an hour or so, but she won't latch on. If I keep persisting, it usually ends in tears and the last thing I want to do is to put her off the breast. It's at this point i offer the bottle.She feeds well on this taking 3/4 ozs in one go, so i've started to alternate between bottle and breast - not sure of this is the right thing to do. I've heard that the first 5/10 mins of feeding is foremilk and then the hindmilk comes through. If this is true does it mean that the little one is missing out each time? I've also tried expressing after a feed but it's usually only 1 oz. She was 6lbs 11 oz when she was born and is now about 11lbs so weight gain is steady.I've tried to explain this to my health visitor but she's not much help.
Please can someone help.
Thank you

OP posts:

PrettyCandlesAndTinselToo · 15/12/2005 14:41

I've used both GF and Baby Whisperer, with two babies, and done both mixed feeding and exclusive bfing. While I won't comment on their advice re breastfeeding, I do think that they have a lot of very useful advice and suggestions, especially for a first-timer. What I wouldn't do is follow either of them slavishly - or any other guru, for that matter.

I discovered GF when ds was 3m, by which time I had had bfing wrecked by a dreadful midwife and had partially re-established it myself, with help from the wonderful NCT Breastfeeding Helpline. Ds was sleeping through the night, but daytimes were all over the place and I was almost as much of a wreck as I had been before he slept through. GF rescued me there! I found it impossible to put her principles in action from newborn with dd, partly because of having to see to ds as well. But again, from 3m on her stuff worked well for me.

moondog · 15/12/2005 15:05

LM....I amsomeone who always found it hard to express (90 ml was good going) yet had big strapping exclusively breastfed babies,so something was obviously going in!!

Forget routines and schedules.If you want to up your milk production,kick back,relax and plug baby in for some loooong sessions at the boob.
It really is as simple as that.

Original poster

littlemiracle · 15/12/2005 15:20

ok, so i've got the fenugreek. it's 550mg capsules and i've read from other threads that i need to take about 6g - thats 12 caps a day - phew!
tiktok, you are a wealth of info - i've been reading the archived messages there are some fantastic messages.
I breastfed dd at 2pm and then when she wanted another feed at 3, i tried the breast but she wouldn't have any of it. She started screaming everytime i tried to latch her on. Ended up giving 3 oz of formula .
Do i need to be stronger and keep persisting with the latch on? It's the crying that bothers me.

OP posts:

moondog · 15/12/2005 15:24

Are you calm when you sit with her?
Try lying down in a peaceful place..maybe even in the dark.
Every time you give formula,your supply is dropping. Sorry to be blunt but it is true.

You may even need a supplementary feeding system for a while.Have you phoned LaLeche League or Ass. of Breastfeeding Mothers??

SarahOnTheRock · 15/12/2005 15:27

I agree with all the great advice below but my little extra is look after yourself.....I ran round like a mad thing thinking I had to be a perfect mummy and my supply dropped off (to the point that dd became constipated) i started drinking vast volumes (well felt like it to me) and she's much better now but rest and lots of fluid certainly help!

imo GF was just unrealistic but it seems to work for some.

SarahOnTheRock · 15/12/2005 15:33

also am exclusively bf but can't express 10mls would be close to a miracle! dd is steadily gaining I got really hung up about it at the start but 4 months in she has a bottle of (soya) formula if i leave her for any length of time ( not often.

In your last post you say she fed then an hour later was crying is she definitely hungry dd was crying (angry cries) about an hour after each feed but eventually established was my diet (she has a dairy intolerance the made her feed so often) sorry may be completely irelevent but don't know?

Original poster

littlemiracle · 15/12/2005 15:41

come to think of it, dd is constipated - i though it was the formula causing it.
I am as relaxed as i can be when i feed her but admittedly i don't drink enough fluids. She falls asleep whilst she's feeding and nothing i do can rouse her up. I've tried rubbing palm of hand, taking of some layers of clothing etc.
As for being super mummy, my partner helps out as much as he can but i can't stop feeling like i'm letting things slip.
Does anyone know of any support groups in Solihull ( West Midlands)?

OP posts:

expatinscotland · 15/12/2005 15:45

out of curiosity, i have 40ml i expressed yesterday sitting in the fridge. how long can i keep it to give to her? i just kept topping it up from a breast w/an injured nipple.

like littlemiracle, the supply in that nipple isn't the greatest right now. i went 3 days w/o feeding her on it.

i know what you maen about the crying - dd2 is crying on that breast and keeps dropping off it.

hunkermunker · 15/12/2005 15:46

Eight days, EPIS - in the main part of the fridge, at the back, not in the fridge door.

nanneh · 15/12/2005 15:53

LM - I am not an expert but if you really want to give bf a chance you MUST stop topping up with formula.

The fenugreek is no good if baby is not suckling enough to boost your supply. Also please rememebr that babies cry for lots of different reasons. Your baby is only 10 weeks old and the crying may well go on for a few more weeks. This is not always because baby is hungry or frustrated wih lack of milk.

This is a common myth and many mothers (incl. my own sister) end up giving formula because they think baby is crying from hunger. Babies this age need lots of skin to skin contact and have a natural urge to suckle OFTEN - even if it's for just a few minutes. Baby could also just be over tired or just wanting attention, etc.

My baby screamed and screamed almost non-stop for the first 4 days of his life (he wasn't latching properly because I think he was put to the breast a little too late by the midwives, well over an hour after birth) but I refused to give formula. I knew that once my milk was in (mine came in on the 4th day after birth) he would latch and he would bf. My brother half-jokingly called me a "fascist" for "starving" my baby for the first few days of his life ! I just knew I was doing the right thing though not giving in to formula.

Your baby is 10 weeks old and does need much more milk than a new born. But expressed milk is NO indication of how much breast milk baby can get from suckling.

Please don't give up !

SarahOnTheRock · 15/12/2005 15:55

you can also freeze and then allow it to slowly thaw for when you need it

nanneh · 15/12/2005 16:01

LM - constipation is almost definitly due to formula and explains the crying.

A breastfed baby almost never gets constipated at this age because breast milk is incredibly easy to digest. My son (17 months) has never ever had costipation or diarriah even when we went on holiday, because I never gave him anything other than breast milk or cool boiled water (after 6 months I started giving him water with his solids).

Original poster

littlemiracle · 15/12/2005 16:23

i've just contacted a breast feeding support grp and she's pretty much said the same thing. - I need to STOP formula. It's going to be tough but i need to give it a go.
going to stay at home for next couple of days, relax and do lots of feeding - hope dd takes to it.

OP posts:

Kathryn1967 · 15/12/2005 17:03

LM, there's a breastfeeding clinic on Fridays in Heartlands, I think. I know it isn't Solihull, but I don't think that Solihull has one specifically for the area. Your mw/hv will have the details. I've never been to the clinic myself but you could give it a try. Also, I'm sure that NCT have a Solihull branch. If not, then there's definitely one in Coventry, and there are also a number of breastfeeding cafes in Cov - in somewat rougher areas but I'm from Balsall Common myself and could go with you to hold your hand as it were.

RacersTheRedNosedReindeer · 15/12/2005 17:09

LM good luck

Clinic/support groups are great, I hope you enjoy them and get all the encouragement you need.

Kathryn1967 · 15/12/2005 17:11

Have re-read that post - I don't mean that you're likely to get beaten up in the breast-feeding cafe's - just that they're in deprived areas, some of which are a bit rough, and that you might not feel like trying to find them on your own, map-reading and driving with a baby in tow, and I think I'd better stop digging now because I'm not making this sound any better.... Please be assured that the intention is good, if not the phraseology.

tiktok · 15/12/2005 17:20

LM, there is nothing wrong with a baby falling asleep while feeding. Don't bother trying to wake her (who told you that you need to do that??? Was it that blinkin' Baby Whisperer?!). Just let her rouse herself, and make a point of feeding more often than before. This is better for your milk than trying to get a sleepy baby to feed for longer.

Good luck with this.

suzi2 · 15/12/2005 22:44

Littlemiracle - haven't read the thread in full but just wanted to let you know that I have a fussy baby who cries for a feed and then refuses it! my answer? If he refuses it i don't feed him! More often than not he's tired or bored, not hungry. So forcing a sleep (taking him out in the pram) or playing with him stops the crying. He will still take a bottle of expressed milk when he's like this though. In fact, I think he would take a bottle anytime!

I guess what I'm trying to say is "are you sure she's hungry?". DS also only feeds for 5-10mins.

As for the increasing breastmilk thing, I find that expressing several times a day in between feeds helps us through growth spurts quickly. So perhaps if your DD refuses a feed you could express to bump up your supply?

Good luck.

Original poster

littlemiracle · 16/12/2005 10:01

OMG - what a night!! She finally stayed on the breast for longer than 5 mins Yesterday evening, she was on for about 45 mins first time and 35 mins second time around. She was definately hungry as I had ruled out other options ( sleepy, bored, nappy change). Wouldn't even take dummy. But by midnight my nipple was sore and she was still crying - 3 oz formula and she was fast asleep
She's than had a feed ( breast) at 6.30 and then formula (2oz) 45 mins later.
I've made contact with a Laleche leader and will be going to a breast feeding support grp in Solihull ( yes, there is one behind the hospital)which means i can avoid going to Coventry ( only kidding)
As for rousing DD during feed - yes it was the blinkin' BW that advises it.

OP posts:

kiskidee · 16/12/2005 11:24

good going lm. now it means that everyday you keep her there a little longer, the better your supply is the following day so you can keep her there 'a little longer again'.

PrettyCandlesAndTinselToo · 16/12/2005 13:41

I don't know whether others will agree with me on this, but you might find it easier to drop formula feeds one or two at a time, starting with the morning feeds, rather than cold-tukeying on the bottles. In other words, put off giving formula as long as possible each day, even if that means that you feed more frequently during the morning.

You'll regret this, you know . My two were slow feeders, especially ds, and the rare occasions when I could do a full feed in 15m were fantastic - I still remember them! When ds was about 10w I calculated that I was spending at least 8 hours feeding him in each 24h, nearly 10h if you included associated burping, nappy-changing and bottle-preparation.

Original poster

littlemiracle · 16/12/2005 20:05

quick update - she has not had the botlle all day. It meant a feed almost evey hr to start with, now she's going about 2 hrs between feeds.
Seems more settled and doesn't refuse the breast second time round.
Not had any milk myself today so wondering if refusal was down to dairy intolerance as someone has mentioned that it can happen.

OP posts:

hunkermunker · 16/12/2005 20:14

LM, that's great!

As for the dairy thing - you can wonder yourself in circles with this kind of thinking - I used to do it with DS. You won't ever know, I don't think. If she has a dairy intolerance, that may well have shown with the formula, so it's not likely. Chances are you're more relaxed about things and she's picked up on it.

Well done - you're doing brilliantly!

RacersTheRedNosedReindeer · 16/12/2005 22:21

Yes, well done LM - sounds like you're doing great. What a lucky babe to have you

moondog · 16/12/2005 22:32

LM..sounds brilliant!

Well done.Everyone of us knows that it can be bloody hard work so good on you gal!!

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