Humour me with my low supply whinge. V sick of BFing

[Hopefully]

DS2 is 5 months. I'm sure most of you have spotted me on here over the past few months bemoaning our various BFing problems, but the short version is:

• DS fed constantly from birth
• Latch checked by 2 BFCs and infant feeding specialist, perfect, no probs
• DS gained very little after regaining his birth weight (like, under 1lb in 9 weeks)
• More constant feeding
• Paed referral at 3 months (after no weight gain for 3 weeks), who wanted me to FF. I agreed to top up 3x per day at 2oz a time
• we now give 1 2oz top up in the day, and 1 4oz top up in the evening.
• DS is gaining at a vaguely civilised rate (following 0.4th percentile, although 75th on length and head circ)
• He still feeds all the bloody time
• I am sick of it
• Oh, and if I try to express I get mastitis within a few days. Have had it 4 times (well, 3 really, as I think the 4th was just the 3rd not clearing properly)

He feeds more than hourly throughout the day. By 'more than hourly', I mean that occasionally he goes an hour from start of feed to start of feed, but for about 50% of his feeds it is 20-30 mins. Apart from after his 2oz top up, when he will go about 90 minutes before needing a feed. At night he goes 2-3 hours after his 4oz bottle, then feeds at least every 2 hours for the rest of the night. Most nights he feeds more or less constantly from 4am till we get up at 7am. He doesn't really nap in the day as he is too busy feeding. Perhaps twice for 20-30 mins at a time? Normally he needs a feed again before I have managed to get him to sleep and ends up napping while feeding and screaming if removed, so I don't even get to put him down then.

I have seen BFCs more than once and had his latch checked, it is perfect as far as anyone can tell, no TT, latch is nice and deep. There is no obvious physical problem with him or me. But he feeds all the time.

The odd time I have really needed a break (or to earn some money - I am self employed and needed to earn a bit from when DS2 was 4 months in order for us to pay our bills and eat) and DP has given him some formula he has been a different baby. He has fed, stayed happily awake for a couple of hours, then napped for a sensible amount of time in his pram or the sling (not ages, perhaps 45-60 mins).

I am getting so bloody bored of it. I am really trying to stay committed to BFing, but my commitment is really wavering. I think if it wasn't so much better when he has a bottle i would feel a bit more determined, but it's perfectly apparent that he isn't getting a huge amount from me at a time, so is needing to feed constantly.

And FWIW, with both babies I never get engorged (not even when I had to spend 12 hours away from DS2 at 4.5 months), never felt my milk come in, never leak, can't express more than an oz at a time (even when expressing daily and subsequently enduring mastitis while still trying to stick to EBF).

Sorry for the rant, I'm just so bloody sick of having him permanently latched on, not having enough time for DS1, not getting a break day or night (I feel that if one would improve then i could continue) and generally feeling green with envy of my friends who are complaining that their baby is still only going 2 hours between feeds and only sleeping 3-4 hours at night.

Anyone else had similar? Given up? Continued? Want to share similar stories of appallingly bad feeders? Please? [desperate]

Looking at it you have to take quit a high dose so I don't think a tea would be enough. Deffantly worth a shot you've nothing to lose by it.

Are you co-sleeping I find this help's a lot, my babies don't tend to sleep well. I couldn't actualy tell you how offten DS feed's at night.

I think you're doing a fab job too, well done! Also had a hard time with bf my DS at about the same age. Mainly, from the evil HV, that he didn't put on 'enough' weight,blah blah, though was perfectly healthy and from my perspective, woke up all the time at night. Only ever managed to pump a trickle, and feeding remained painful; can remember days when I couldn't imagine getting through the next feed. A good friend of mine had bf 3 children and was surprised that it didn't get any easier; I found this quite comforting. I got really good support from the breast feeding counsellor at the hosp and managed to stick with it, but it was hard and nearly everyone else I knew had stopped by 6 months in any case. Am now at the other end, as he's nearly 4 and am trying to get the little devil to buy into the idea that there really is no milk left and it's time to stop pretending that there is. Do whatever's right for you. It's a harder job than any man does, but very precious. Good luck :)

Hopefully you are a trouper, I breastfed to 22 months and DD was a guzzler, but nothing like your DS apart from when she was newborn or teething.

The advice on starting weaning after six months in a developed country such as the UK has been challenged recently see here.

I myself started slowly weaning at 5 months with breastmilk mixed with baby rice, then moving to pureed fruits and vegetables, then to vegetables and pulses all before 6 months. I waited until six months to introduce animal protein (fish, chicken, cheese, yoghurts) and wheat based products. I introduced red meat at around 8 months. Oat cereal and cows milk at 1 year.

My DD is fine, has never had a problem with eating a wide range of foods and has no problems with her digestion. She was however grabbing food off our plates and showing the signs of readiness which for baby-led weaning are:

*sit with little or no support
*reach out and grab effectively
*take objects to the mouth quickly and accurately
*gnawing on toys and making chewing movements

It is best to start weaning in the middle of the day so that it is less likely to disturb sleep (some foods may not agree or take a while to be digested and you won't know your DS will react until you have tried them) so if you intend for it to replace the formula feeds you may want to move one of the formula feeds to lunchtime first.

Weaning will not at first reduce his demand for breastfeeding though, but over time it will replace more and more feeds.

Don't feel bad if you need to up formula feeds, your sanity comes first and he will not be happy if you become a sleep deprived quivering wreck. It is very admirable that you have lasted so long under such difficult conditions and so long as he gets some breastmilk he is still getting some of what he needs from you.

Another thing to remember is as a breast fed baby he will not gain weight like a formula fed baby, and so often the charts they use are based on ff babies. Check your DS's weight gain against the charts given here, you may find it shows a different pattern. WHO also have new charts taking into account breastfeedinghere, but for some reason I can't open the pdf files. Maybe you will have more luck.

ZhenXiang - Please try to get your info right. All Red book's should have charts now basied on BF babies, although I know it's a resent change they have all been change for over a year now.

That so called study wasn't a study at all but a review of previous data that had already been included in the data used by the WHO to set a weaning age of 6months. So nothing new and no change in recomendations needed even the WHO said that at the time this articale was reliased.

The 3 signs that show a baby is ready for weaning are.

• Stay in a sitting position and are able to hold their head steady *Co-ordinate their eyes, hands and mouth, can look at food, grab it, and put it in their mouths all by themselves *Swallow their food. Babies who are not ready will often push their food back out, so get more around their faces than they do in their mouths.

As per the NHS guidlines www.nhs.uk/start4life/pages/no-rush-to-mush.aspx

Gnawing on toys has nothing to do with it. Plus there is no need for such a slow introduction of food stuff if started at 6months there is very little you can't give them. The only thing that would warnt slow weaing onto adult foods is a know food allergy or a family history of such.

I haven't read all the replies, but i couldn't not post, because your experience really chimes with what happened to me.

Like you I had good latch/happy feeding/lots of babymooning and help - but very frequent feeding and tiny weight gain. Also didn't have big increase in boob size during pregnancy, never leaked etc. And also madly irrationally commited to bf (my DC turned out to have problems digesting cows milk/formula - so i think i had a gut feel that I had to throw everything behind bf).

Anyways, after three kids with the same story, I've rather forgiven myself, and acquired a bit of experience.

1. I'm afraid you're fairly stuffed with long feeds, but prioritise your comfort with feeding lying down in bed, feeding in a sling, feeding out and about etc. It's survival.

2. Pharmaceuticals. I had some success with Fenugreek. In particular i bought a tincture calle 'More Milk Plus'.

I also swallowed hard and started Motillium (the UK brand name for Domperidone). It's not licensed for this purpose, but KellyMom (and informally my GP) said it was fine. It's over the counter, but they weren't too probing about selling it IME.