Baby is 4 days old and is never satisfied, Should I just give up bfing?

[shadycharacter]

As the title says, DS2 is 4 days old today and I'm really struggling with BFing. I didn't BF DS1 so am a total novice.

DS2 weighed 9lb 5oz at birth and although we had skin to skin right after he was born, I had to be taken to hospital for stitches and we couldn't get a good latch. Midwife said to give formula if he hadn't fed from the breast after a few hours.

I gave him the formula as he was so hungry but I've been trying to BF him every day since. I've just been offering him the breast when he starts rooting and sucking but he gets really frustrated and starts sort of boxing the breast (!) and shaking his head quite violently until he latches on, then he gives a few quick sucks, a few longer sucks and just falls asleep, so I've ended up giving him formula at each feed.

This morning my boobs were rock solid (my milk seems to be coming in properly now and not just the colostrum) but he latched on well and definitely fed properly for around 30ish mins on 1st breast and then swapped to the other one for around 20 mins. He came off himself and brought a bit of milk up when I sat him up so I figured he was finished. Around half an hour after that feed he started getting really agitated and started the usual rooting and sucking his clothes and hands but I had visitors and my nipples are so sore I just made him a bottle, he drank the whole 3oz.

So, is it normal for a baby to feed for that long, bring up milk after detaching themselves, then have room for another 3oz half an hour later?! I feel like giving up because it seems pointless to BF and then have to top it up with formula so soon after, but I really do want to breastfeed. Any ideas anyone, I'm at a total loss!

Congratulations on your DS

This sounds pretty normal.

I think that at this age the sucking is as much about encouraging milk production as it is about the baby's need for milk. It is normal for them to feed frequently when they are very small. Do you need to use formula? If you stuck to breast milk it might help you get a clearer idea of how your DS is feeding, IYSWIM.

Yes it's utterly, utterly normal for them to want to go back on again. For comfort, for nutrition, for all sorts of reasons. There are a couple of problems with giving formula in this situation. One, for every formula feed you give, you don't tell your breasts to make more milk so your supply won't adjust. And two, they will take milk from a bottle even when they don't need or want it because it's easy for them to suck and the milk flows freely. The fact that they take it doesn't mean they needed it. And they take more than they need which makes them even less in need of bm, causing more supply issues.

I'd see a rl breastfeeding counsellor but in general terms in these early days you need to be putting the baby onto the breast whenever they ask, offer as many sides as they want. If you're getting sore, all the more reason to see somebody and have your latch checked. It does seem relentless at first but that's how they put their order in and it gets better. Please see the kellymom website in the meantime for advice on what to expect from bfing in the early days. Here.

congratulations on your new baby!
the early days can be difficult with breastfeeding, but if you really want to do it, try to persevere, when it starts working it can be brilliant!
your baby is very young yet and is as much a novice at this as you are, you have successfully given him a good feed so that is positive. he will settle down within a week or two.

i would exercise a little caution with regard to bottles IF you wish to continue with the breast as every time he feeds from you and not the bottle he is giving your body signals to produce more milk, if he feeds from a bottle you are not getting those signals and over time your milk supply will respond accordingly, please do NOT worry about this now though, you ARE producing milk, just be aware of it.

i am not a counsellor or anything just another mum who is currently feeding

find a breastfeeding support group (try childrens centre) they can be a real life saver and you will get support and friendly faces there.

best wishes !

shady - please, please see a midwife or someone who can really help you sort this one out.

It is perfectly normal for a baby of this age to bf many, many times and to ask for more soon after he seems to have finished. Giving formula at this stage is very undermining to breastfeeding and greatly reduces your chances of happy effective bf.

It sounds as if he is doing well, from your description of feeding this morning.

Sore nipples can be fixed so do get this checked out.

If you want to breastfeed - and it sounds like you do - then you need to be aware that topping up can be the finish of bf.

Sometimes, formula is necessary, but in your case, it does not appear to be.

Hope you get good help.

Thanks for the replies everybody.

I sort of decided to give up on Mon but after reading the replies on here I called my midwife yesterday and we had a good chat and a practice and I'm feeling much better about it all.

As soon as the midwife put him on the breast he fell asleep, we tried everything to wake him up but he was just using it for comfort which is fine for now. I'm expressing every 2-3 hours after a feed because at the moment he won't feed from the right breast at all, we tried all sorts of positions but it's difficult as he's a big baby and my boobs are big so there's not much room to tuck him in! When he started sucking it didn't hurt at all, he'd been really pinching before but he obviously wasn't quite latched on properly before.

I watched a program last night called Breast best? and it's totally opened my eyes...it seems everything was going fine, I just gave up too soon and didn't get support quick enough. Anyway we're getting there now just gotta keep practicing!

Shady congratulations and I'm so glad you've had some support from your MW and are feeling much better.

shady. It really will get better - I never believed it could be convenient or easy or quick or painfree but honestly if you can get through the first bit, it'll be worth it.

I found it really helped to go along to breastfeeding support groups and baby cafes to practice. You can search for your local meetings here

Good luck! As you've now realised, you got really bad advice at first.

I got DD to ebf from being fed formula in hospital and then needing lots of top-ups so it can be done!

I'm glad you got some good support shady - if there's one thing I really, really wish BF-ing info prepared us new mothers for, it's the sheer amount of time new babies need to feed for in the first few weeks. And how they feed (cluster feeds, for example - SO many friends thought there was something wrong with them/their baby because they were only spending 30 mins or less away from the boob in the evenings....).

I've been thinking about this a lot recently - so much of our expectation is to do with formula feeding, and how that shapes babies' feeding behaviour (they can't feed for 20 mins, nap for ten, feed for 20, sleep for half an hour, feed on and off for an hour etc because of the frequency that bottles need to be made up and then thrown away if unused. I take my hat off to anyone feeding on demand and using formula, I really do). So we think the pattern of 'big feed' - sleep - long gap til next 'big feed' is normal, and anything else is abnormal. Not true.

Until my baby was born, he was 'feeding' 24 hours a day, via the umbilical cord! So when he was a newborn, really I should have been thinking it remarkable that he was taking so many breaks in his new feeding regime instead of fretting that he was feeding 'so much'. IYSWIM.

Easy to say now, of course - he's 9 months, only feeds a few times a day. The first few weeks are very demanding, I think.

Agree with gloyw. I stopped bf dd after three weeks as she seemed pretty constant! Ds (slowly) spaced his feeds but was a constant suckler, 3 weeks, 5 weeks, 8 weeks, 3 mths then 6mths were the 'getting progressively easier' milestones for me. And then bf him with no thought about it til 14mths.

Ds2 is not So constant but still feeds a lot at 11 weeks. He wanted a lot at 4 days though!! Don't forget it's not just food, it's safety, comfort, reassurance, way to get to sleep. I preferred to look at it as my magic boobs - if he cried I latched him on! i like things I dn't have to analyse/think about.

He is a big baby, you can't over-feed. Just latch him on. Nipple soreness should't last more than a week (IME) . Check your latch again - every-time. It's breastfeeding not nipple-feeding remember.

Good luck, he has already had loads of benefits from bf - hope you manage to keep going. Is so much more convenient (IME/O)

just seen your second message. You are absolutely right and glad your mw was such a good support. Newborns are hard (however you feed them).