how long on each breast?

[nello]

Hello,

i'm a new mum with a 11 day old and breast feeding. My milk has now come in and feeding seem sot be going fine, except that I don't know how long i am supposed to give on each breast at each feed. I have heard different things, all to do accessing both the fore and hind milk and I am getting confused. My doctor has told me to give 25 mins on one breast and then 25 mins on the other. Does this sound about right, even if after 25 mins I can see milk at my nipple?

Thanks v much for help

No hard and fast rules. Doctor is wrong. The fore and hind milk isn't as black and white as used to be thought. It just changes throughout the feed. Feed until baby has had enough and then offer the other side. Sometimes babe will want 2 or more sides. Sometimes just one will do. Let your baby dictate this and don't look at the clock as that way madness lies. Congrats on your wee one.

First of all congratulations on your new baby. As mollycuddles has said, there are no rules. It depends on how well your baby sucks - some are better then others. DD was a very slow feeder and took 45 minutes each side. I used the opportunity to watch TV or read a book.

She is 10 now and still eats slowly. If you want breastfeeding advice a doctor is probably the last person to advise you. You would be better off talking to a health visitor or breastfeeding counsellor.

Were they really feeding that long at only 11 days though?
I wold have thought a lot of that would have just been sucking rather than suckling and thats a recipe for mastitis.
My DS2 would have stayed attached for over an hour if I'd let him, but I'm pretty sure he was only actually feeding for about 15-25 mins. The rest of the time I was just a nice warm dummy.

Comfort sucking is also very important for the baby too. I've never had mastitis (touch wood) and let baby comfort suck, still do sometimes at naps and she's 13 months now.

Breastfeeding is more than just nutrition IMO. Every mother is different as is every baby so for some the dummy is a godsend but not always. Nothing wrong with using a real nipple for a soother. Coming up to growth spurts, the baby will need to suck more to get the extra milk supply for the growth.

I would switch sides when baby got fussy on one side. And often give my breasts a squeeze to see which one feels softer and emptier.

I also stopped wearing a watch after a couple of weeks and found that just going by babys cues was a lot easier for me mentally.

I agree don't watch the clock. My 12 day old only feeds on average for 20 mins. She takes herself off, settles well, is gaining weight and I have plenty poo and wet nappies. She's just very efficient. I usually wind her and offer other breast but she refuses. She is feeding about every 3 to 4 hrs but a bit more in evening. This is my 3rd baby and I bf other 2 but 5 yrs ago. I think I'm so chilled its rubbing off on her. She is making the routine and not me. However my nipples are killing me so away to seek advice on that. HTH

nello - your doctor is totally, 100 per cent and misleadingly wrong wrong wrong :( :(

You can't empty the breasts. You can't time breastfeeding. Babies do not need to 'drill down' to hindmilk.

Normally, if you follow your baby's cues, and getting to be more aware and more understanding of them is a process, you will breastfeed happily and effectively.

Comfort sucking is normal and it is part of being a baby.

It is not a 'recipe for mastitis' - bubbaluv, sorry, whoever told you that one knows very little about normal bf and normal infant behaviour.

I found that at 11 days, my DD wanted to be on or near me all of the time which is perfectly normal. Settle in at home and have her close to you. She will eat when she wants to for as long as she wants to. There is no right or wrong answer - every baby is different! Congratulations!

Feed your baby until they come of on there own, then offer the other side. There is no right or rong in how long they feed for, some babies take an hour and other finish a feed in 5 minutes (I've had both extreams). Always offer the seconed side but if baby doesn't want it that's fine to.

I hate the term cumfort sucking it implies there is something bad about babies doing this, what are our boo's there for if not to comfort a young baby. Any sucking at the breast is good for stimulating your milk supply, as long as baby is well attached and your not soure just leave them to it.

As usual, Tiktok's said it. Feed until they come off, there's nothing wrong with comfort sucking and sucking cannot lead to mastitis!

Makes your boobs all (unnecessarily) pruney and wet and allows more bacteria a chance - according to the breast surgeon who treated me. I also found that the latch is less effective when they are comfort sucking so it hurts more especially in those first few days before things toughen up a bit.

Bubbaluv, I don't think there was one true fact anywhere in your last post.

The nipples don't get all "pruney" after nursing. No matter how long the baby is on. It just doesn't work like your fingers in the bath.
Breastmilk has antibacterial properties so would never increase chances of bacteria.

Nipples don't need to 'toughen up', if the latch is correct it shouldn't cause pain. If what you experienced was a bad latch after feeding, it's best to just take the baby off the boob and start again.

Your breast surgeon doesn't sound like he/she was too familiar with breast feeding facts.

My nipples have never been pruney, and my baby was at the breast for at least an hour at a time in the first few weeks. I've never had mastitis either and comfort sucking hasn't made me sore.

OP, as others have said let the baby dictate how long they stay on. In the early weeks I found it was totally random anyway - an hour on one side until he fell asleep, then wake up half an hour later and have 20 minutes on the other side, then sleep for a couple of hours and swap back and forth between both sides for a couple of hours. He didn't start taking both sides at every feed until about 3 months - up til then I'd always offer the other side if he was still awake and he'd sometimes want it and sometimes not, often he'd fall asleep on the breast and then I'd offer the other side when he woke up.

I don't think you have to worry too much about which side/how long/when (I could never remember anyway!) - just offer both sides often!

I'm sure the breast surgeon is just fab at treating cancer or other serious breast disorders.

His knowledge of normal bf as quoted by you, bubbaluv, if accurate, shows he doesn't have a clue.

Utter tosh, sorry.

I used to feed for 2-3 hours at a time and never had "pruney" nipples.

OK I'm happy to have this explained to me by you guys but this is how he explained it to me at the time.
Once the milk stops being drawn by the baby there is a much higher concentration of saliva in the mouth than milk. Saliva is there to help break down tissue (while you eat) and it acts the same on your breast as it does on your steak which is why your nipples can get chapped and sore. If you leave you nipple in a bacteria filled mouth with all the saliva and without the protection of the milk being drawn by the baby you are providing the perfect environment for the bacteria to find a way into your nipple and hey-presto.
My nipples were always all wet and softened after a long feed (with a Newborn - not later once they had rubbered up a bit ) Meanwhile, I got the same advice (about not letting them suck if they are not feeding) from the midwives in the hospital and later from a lactation consultant. So I'm a bit confused about the total rubbishing of this concept here.
Not being cranky btw just

Thanks for coming back, bubbaluv.

Ok, where to start?

A baby on the breast comfort sucking is still taking milk - trickles rather that fountains, but he is still taking it.

The whole 'mouth filled with bacteria' infecting the nipple is balderdash, it really is.

Mastitis is an infection of the breast tissue. It does very occasionally arise from the outside, but not from the baby's mouth.

Midwives may have some daft notion that comfort sucking should be curtailed, but I cannot think why a lactation consultant would say this - she of all people should understand that it is part of normal breastfeeding.

Hang on -
"There is a main cause that leads to mastitis in breastfeeding. The infection is usually caused by bacteria from the skin or the baby?s mouth that enters the milk ducts through skin lesions of the nipple through the opening of the nipple. Once bacteria has entered the milk ducts the multiply, leading to the symptoms of the condition."

From www.breastfeedingmastitis.com/

Mastitis websites that I search while I suffered all stated this.

Anyway, I didn't come here to scare a new BFer, so I'm happy to leave her to our advice Tiktok - I personally have found it really useful in the past.
She can let the baby comfort suck if she chooses. I would just say if it makes her nipples sore she might want to consider that not all experts think it is a good idea for any length of time.

The site you link to is not authoritative in any way, bubbaluv. It's one of those weird sites that pop up on the net that come from nowhere.....other info on it is total rubbish.

Mastitis can very occasionally be caused by bacteria entering the breast, and this can come from the baby - if the baby has a mouth or throat infection, then yes, it could happen, but it is not a reason to avoid comfort sucking, which has nothing to do with mastitis.

National Librabry of Medicine Service (US) says:
Breast infections are usually caused by a common bacteria (Staphylococcus aureus) found on normal skin. The bacteria enter through a break or crack in the skin, usually on the nipple.

It seems that bf sites say one thing and medical sites say another.
Is this kind of contradiction one of those situations where medical science lacks insight into bfing?

I believe there are two types of breast infection Bubbaluv - the common form of mastitis which is caused by blocked ducts or milk sitting in the breast, and infections caused by damaged nipples and infections getting through cracks in the skin.

I guess if your nipples are cracked or damaged, bacteria on the skin or in the baby's mouth could get into the wound.

Comfort sucking with a good latch won't cause nipples to crack though.

If my DS2 had sucked my thumb as long as he had sucked my nipple I would have had a sore red thumb - I don't get why people always say nipples are immune to the effects of saliva?

Breastfeeding sites - the ones worth reading - explain that mastitis is caused by milk stasis (milk not flowing and instead, 'sticking' in one place). This causes a plug or a blockage and thence inflammation of the breast tissue (that's what mastitis means). Infection can sometimes result, when bacteria 'attack', but the inflammation is normally there first - the breast happily copes with bacteria most of the time, as of course the baby's skin, mouth, throat and so on are never 'sterile', and anything else, including the mother's own skin and clothing, has bacteria on it.

This does not really conflict with the quote you have found - it's just missed out the bits about inflammation and plugs happening first.

No one need ever worry they are going to 'catch' mastitis from their baby's mouth if they comfort feed :)

I can only comment on my own experience, but my ds fed/sucked for hours as a newborn, and can be on/off all night if I let him - and I've never had pruney, sore or damaged nipples.

Plus, nipples are designed to be sucked - that's their only purpose - whereas thumbs aren't