Oh god my nipples hurt

[nancydrewfoundaclue]

DD is 4 days and already I am struggling :-(

She fed really well within an hour or so of delivery but then became very sleepy. Was given a plan when discharged to wake her every 3 hours but not going well. She won't wake the feed feels very forced with her dozing every couple of sucks and so her latch isn't great. I eventually have toremove her as latch gets worse and worse. As a result my nipples are in agony.

If left to her own devices she wakes more like 6 hourly and has a long feed unlatching of her own accord after 20/30 mins. In these circs her latch is (according to MW's) good and it certainly feels better but the damage is being done.

I don't want to express unless I have to as I am assuming she needs to practise her latch as much as possible. Likewise I am not keen to use nipple shields.
I have been using lashings of lasinoh and breast cups which help with the soreness but how do I solve the cause?

I really don't want to give up but can see I am already on a downward spiral.

Hi - didn't want you to go unanswered, there are BF experts who will be along soon with more specific advice I'm sure but i'd suggest firstly getting a breastfeeding counsellor to come and see you when you wake the baby to feed and sit with you and help. Your local Surestart centre should have BF counsellors - mostly they work part-time but if they're not around someone from another centre should be able to help. Or phone the NCT for a local BF counsellor, usually you can go to them and they will help you as you feed. Do get on the phone - there's nothing better than real life help as you feed.

Also strip your baby down to her nappy, take your top off and spend some time in bed with her, waking her to feed regularly. This should help her show more interest, plus it's just nice to spend time cuddling skin to skin when feeds get stressful - do protect your nipples though, small flailing hands can hurt! (you don't have to get up if a BF counsellor or MW comes btw - they can help you in bed).

My DD is 16 weeks now and I didn't ask for help like this til she was nearly a month old, I really wish i'd asked sooner.

Good luck and congrats on your lovely DD!

Sounds like you are having a tough time nancydrew.

You say that she wakes 6 hourly and then feeds well with a good latch so that is postive.(although that is a longer time feeds than most would like to see).

However, Dr Jack Newman says: "There is no evidence that a healthy full term newborn must feed every three hours (or two hours, or whatever) during the first few days."

Has she been weighed since birth?

How are her nappies? After day 4, poo should be yellow and she should be having about 3-4 of these a day. Once your milk is in, then expect 5-6 wet nappies in 24 hours.

Personally I would go back to basics
-lots of skin to skin

• readjust the latch to make sure it is comfortable every time.
• go back to bed and just keep your baby close. This way you can watch for very early feeding cues see here for egs.

Ring a breastfeeding helpline for more expert advice.

The numbers are on the right hand side of this website.

Persevere, get lots of support and help, ask your midwife for more advice on the latch.

You'll get there - just takes a bit of time and patience!

Yep, definatley agree with the skin to skin contact. Getting her cooler will wake her up a bit and exposing your nipples to the air apparently toughens them up a bit and helps them heal.

You feel like you're on Tribal Wives but it helps.

If her weight gain is good you might want to let her feed in her own time. But do seek advice.

Good luck.

Can you feed lying down? If not, I'd get practising it and just take the baby to bed. My DD found feeding lying down easier, so even though she also fell asleep more that way, we could sometimes feed better than sitting up and trying to force the issue. And she objected less to being woken up when a nipple was right in front of her already.

FWIW 20/30 minutes is not a long feed for a newborn. SO although those feeds may seem better, a feed of that length every 6 hours is extremely unlikely to get her enough calories afaik.

Make sure her weight gets monitored, but don't allow the health team to scare you if it isn't gaining fast enough. Weight monitoring is a useful tool that's all.

Take her off whenever you know the latch is bad. Trying to grit your teeth through the pain is only going to lead to more problems so less chance of successfully bfing for long! It's a very very short-term tactic (I did try that too, but it was a bad idea!).

Hi there, firstly I must say that I'm certainly not an expert - but I can sympathise as the same thing happened to me. My DD is now 12 days old. What we did which worked well for us, was to express a little into a small cup and feed her top ups that way as I knew she wasn't getting enough. We kept doing this whilst still practising the latch each time. She has got better at bfeeding now, but we are still expressing some as she won't go the whole feed and my nipples are still recovering. Keep persevering and eventually it will happen! I know it doesn't feel like it at the moment.

Thanks for all the advice.

I am trying to get as much skin to skin as possible and also stripping her off immediately prior to feed to wake her but this can be something of a double edged sword as sometimes appears to distress her which means getting her latched on is virtually impossible.

Feeding lying down doesn't work at the moment but we are working on it.

On a positive note there are plenty of both wet and dirty nappies. MW is coming tomorrow and will weigh her so will see how that goes and I am going to attend a BFing group at the hospital on Wednesday so fingers crossed for some advice.

I am determined not to give up but feeling like it's very hard work at the moment

Afraid it's normal for bfing to be very hard work at first!

That all sounds fine nancydrew. Sensible to keep an eye on the nappies as this gives you an indication of what's going in to her.

Definitely a good plan to go to the BF group and get someone to watch you feed and check your latch.

It is hard work at the moment, but it won't always be like this. Don't worry, you'll crack it soon and breastfeeding will be a piece of cake.

Is it always hard work though? Advice is so mixed and tends to be one extreme or the other e.g. Of course it's going to hurt and it takes commitment and effort or it should never hurt & if it does you're doing it wrong.

I had such a difficult time BF DC1 I think I have lost all perspective on the realities of what it entails!

Oh, congratulations . My experience is that it can hurt in the early days. It doesn't mean you are doing it 'wrong' but found that if the baby was not sucking moving jaw, it would hurt as it ended up building up a tremendous amount of pressure.

But it isn't always such hard work and you will know when the latch is right.

It will get better.

Congratulations !
I could have written your post a few weeks ago ! DD lost 10% of her birthweight because of exactly the problems you describe. Oh the times I cried for the first few minutes of a feed !
We spent the first week struggling to keep her awake to feed but after that she became much more alert which made the whole business a lot easier. Other things which helped were time in bed, loads of skin to skin, experimenting with different positions so she was chomping on a different part of my nipple, and getting as much help as we could from wherever we could - midwives, health visitor, NCT BF support line, BF drop-in and a visit from a BF counsellor (and reading MN of course !) Every time we saw or spoke to someone they would suggest something which made things a little easier until at 4 weeks we suddenly mastered it and now at 6 weeks BF is almost easy ! I'm so pleased I stuck with it. I know that probably seems like ages but believe me it will fly by.
Good luck !

If it hurts it does usually mean that there is something that needs to be changed/worked on.

Once you've got it sussed it won't hurt.

It does take some committment and effort at first, but the you both master it and it becomes easy, painless and convenient, I promise!

I think new mums all go through sore nipples, sorry... just check your position is good, make sure babies tummy is against your tummy.

Also try pulling your baby's body around towards your waist a bit more and make sure her mouth is very open when getting on / off.

I had the same problem but it started to easy up after a week and i exclusively breastfed for 6 months, and carried on until a year as she wouldnt take a bottle!

You can get special lanolin creams to help get over the first week, then all of a sudden you will find the pains gone :)

Thanks again for more advice

Bit gutted this morning was starting to feel things were improving - feeds have become more regular and she isn't quite as sleepy, my nipples aren't quite bad but she was weighed this morning and she has lost 11oz. She was only 6lb 2 oz when she was born. I feel dreadful that I was worrying about myself.

I am seeing BF specialist tomorrow and meantime have been told to feed 2 hourly offering both breasts then express for 20 mins and top her up with that from a bottle. Worried that the bottles are going to totally destroy the BFing but obviously very concerned about weight.

It may help you to get direct advice over the phone.

e.g.
National Breastfeeding Helpline
Helpline: 0300 100 0210

Good luck with specialist tomorrow. Hope they're helpful.

How about giving top ups with a cup or syringe instead of a bottle?

Latrucha thanks for the number.

Rita I asked about feeding by cup and MW said she'd really only recommend it where top ups were around 10ml due to risk of choking with larger quantities. She thinks I ought to be looking at topping up around 30mls per feed

Thanks again

Ah, I didn't realise cups were a choking risk.

I can recommend Breastflow bottles then - the sucking action is supposed to be similar to breastfeeding. I've used these since my ds was a few weeks old and not had any problems with his latch.

I would talk to an expert at one of the phonelines for the best advice, but from my personal experience, we ended up exclusively cupfeeding DS for a couple of days, and it wasn't a problem (well, the fact he wouldn't latch on was a problem...). He was a little bigger than your DD, but still a newborn.

Sorry to hear about the weight loss nancydrew, though at least you have a plan to address the problem.

Just one thing - has DD been checked for tongue tie? It can cause painful feeding and poor weight gain- worth an ask when you see the bf specialist.

Have a look at breast compressions too- google Jack Newman as he has a video of it on his site. Good way of getting more milk in to a sleepy baby.

Hope things get better soon.

And try offering more than 2 breasts, just keep switching between them when your DD comes off the first. Go for 3,4,5, whatever until your DD seems satisfied (difficult to tell I know).

When is she next being weighed?

As crikeybadger said, it is worth getting her checked for tongue tie. With tongue tie, the latch can appear fine from the outside, but it isn't.

There is a tongue tie support thread here which has a lot of useful info.

Congratulations on your DD :)

Hang in there. We had to do top-ups too (plus DD was tube-fed in SCBU and din't breastfeed until day 3!) and we managed to get back to ebf.