Could I ask for some advice from tiktok and any other bf experts / veterans?

[legallyblond]

I am a bit stuck in terms of 3 month old DD's nighttime feeding/sleeping...

I know its all been asked before, but all advice v gratefully received!!!

3 month old DD is ebf, except for 5ml of formula the midwives gave her when she was about 20 hours old.. it was 4am and I allowed it but I regret it! Nothing wrong with formula per se but I am not at all convinced that DD really did need it as they said, she was just sleepy and newborn. No big deal in the general scheme of things I know, but my very earth mother mum still mutters darkly about one sip of formula being enough to damage the virgin gut etc (she is a total "Breast is Best" by Dr Stanway obsessive, has been since 1982!!!) But I digres...

I love bf, had no problems from day 1 (no sore nipples - yay) and ideally would like to bf alongside weaning until DD is 18 months or so. DD is a VERY big baby. She was 2 weeks late and was 8lb 4oz at birth, but is now steady on the 98th centile and at a few days over 3 months is 16lb+.

Increasingly, the nights are a problem. Whereas at 2 months she was waking twice in a night (asleep by 10pm, woke at 3ish and 6ish then properly woke up at 9), she is now waking every 2 hours. I don't think its a sleep issue - she goes strsight back in her crib (next to our bed) after a feed and doesn't need the nipple to fall asleep - in fact when she's v tired, she violently refuses the nipple and prefers to fall asleep in my or DH's arms (or on a good night, in her crib!).

This 2 hourly waking has lasted 4 weeks now! Surely too long for a growth spurt and too early for the 4 month regression thing? On the 4 month regression note, DD's feeds in the day are pretty distracted now, but they weren't when all this began really and she glugs without distraction in the evenings.

Is there anything I can do to help? Any bf tips?

I am considering introducing organic baby rice with ebm at 4 and a half months ish (current news, I know!)... that's not because of the current news story, but because I spoke with my mum (who has a total of 8 years bf'ing!) who said she had the same thing with all of us, but then the weaning age was 4 months, so she just continued until then and baby rice seemed to help with the sleeping... but will it? I have heard mixed reports!

Just for the record, I am not interested in introducing formula I'm afraid - its just not for me!

Sorry for long post!

All advice gratefully received!

I started weaning DS at 5 months and I'm afraid it made no difference whatsoever to his sleeping habits. When she wakes, is she definitely feeding? Are you sure it's not a comfort thing?

Or teething perhaps?

Does she feed 2 hourly in the daytime too?

Not sure if the baby rice will help or not - my 5.5 month old is a couple of weeks into weaning and has two meals a day but it hasn't really made a difference to his sleeping.

Would co-sleeping help maybe, so you wouldn't have to really wake up for feeds? Was a life saver for me.

Yes - its 2 hourly in the day. I am pretty sure she's hungry... she is having a proper feed each time. Could be comfort...

Thankfully I barely wake.. I just bung her on in bed then am asleep again within 20 mins... its stil exhausting though!

legally - this sounds like hard work, but you don't need to make any decisions now. 4 and a half months is 6 weeks away.

Frequent night waking and feeding is on the normal spectrum.

True co-sleeping means you get better at not really waking and the babies help themselves.

Sorry - there is no way you can alter this current pattern without doing mad things like ignoring her when she wakes (which is unkind).

Easier to alter what you do than to alter what she does :)

I'm not a BF veteran but had similar.... try having as many of the day feeds as possible lying down in dark room to encourage her to take more in the day.

I find EBF very very hard after 4 months. My mum said it was the same for her but as you say advice was to give babyrice. I

I held off weaning until 5.5 months and yes it did get better then but not sure if thats because of the formula rather than the purees.

legallyblond, I don't have much to add, just that weaning did not really alter my DD's sleep pattern. No matter how many solids she eats, she still wakens in the night (only once but this was the same before she was weaned) at 9.5 months old. We have recently introduced supper and although she devours this most night she still wakens once and takes a very good feed.

I weaned my DD onto solids (she is still breastfed) at 6 months old and her sleep actually got worse for a few weeeks - I believe that this is quite common?

I echo what MumNW says - make sure that your DD is taking in plenty during the day. From about 4 months babies get very easily distracted, as you have started to notice. Feeding in a quiet room can help and will maybe encourage her to take in more calories during the day. It isnt always practical, I know, but does help. From my expeience, the distractedness (is that a word?!) does improve over time.

After not having a lot to add, I wrote loads sorry!

I too had a big baby 9lb 3oz and ebf til he was 6 months when he started taking rice. He did still wake in the night. I stopped bf at 8 months when he bit me and drew blood. Enough was enough for me - never enjoyed it at all from the start tbh. He was still waking in the night til he turned 3 which I blame myself for - I always gave him a drink when he woke - big mistake! I firmly believe its mostly for comfort and you can't not comfort a baby so its a just a matter of time I believe so hang in there! BF DC2 til she was 4 weeks (only because she was prem) and she was a much better sleeper. I do think BF is a good start for babies but I hated it. It suits some people more than others. One thing I would say to any bf mum is if you really don;t enjoy it - don't let guilt force you to carry on - it will make you miserable and resentful. I didn't resent the 4 weeks with DC2 because I knew it was only for a short time and would do her a lot of good.

My DD did this and carried on to 6.5 months when she switched to 3 hourly and now at 10 months she goes 4 hourly (with a lot of variation either way). What has worked well for us recently is to alternate trying to feed her and DH trying to settle her. We only do this before midnight. After a few days she does longer stretches.

There have been weight concerns for us so was generally reluctant to not feed her until she did longer stretches by herself. The biggest tip (like tiktok says) is just to relax and go with it. Otherwise too much of your time is taken up with stressing about it and over analysing everything.

Thanks guys!

You are so right about going with it.... its all I can do really as I am not prepared to withold feeds in the night or leave DD to cry etc. If its less than 2 hours, I do get DH to cuddle and shh rather than feed, but that never works if its been 2 hours. Thankfully, as I said, I love love love bf (I swear it releases some sort of feel good chemical on let down!) so I shall persevere.

The only reason I had thought of baby rice in 6 weeks is to have a sort of finite "it will get better then" IYSWIM. But baby rice at bedtime (mixed up with ebm) doesn't help...!?

Maybe she'll just get better herself over time! Its tricky because in real life (like you are all fake!!) I am the only person I know still bf AND I have the biggest baby, so get told a lot that she wakes because my breastmilk isn't "enough" for her... which I mostly ignore!!!! But it does mean that I don't know what's normal for a bf baby.

And when I read about other poster's 14mo still waking multple times in the night for feeds I get a little worried!!!!

Thanks again

Oh and I will try a few days of non distracted day feeds - coffee in costa can wait for a few days!

my DDs sleep got alot worse when she started solids (at 6m), she'd been a fantasy baby till then....

solids are not always the answer!

have you found out about BLW - then the baby helps themselves to food when ready, as it's up to the baby it avoids you having to decide when to start...

I know people who've started blw from 5m.

I think baby rice, even made with milk, is unlikely to have much of an impact. Once they're on three good meals a day including protein then hopefully they'll sleep through.

My ds has a bowl of porridge and a banana for his tea, and I think he might be more settled earlier on in the night because of it. The biggest difference to his sleep has been getting him to self-settle at bedtime though. If he feeds to sleep or is rocked/patted to sleep he wakes loads, every 45 minutes sometimes. If he puts himself to sleep he'll sleep 3-4 hours.

MoonUnit - how did you manage the self settling? If I put baby in her cot tired there are screams of protest! Only happy to be put down when awake and playful! (Or comatose!)

Don't listen to all the 'big baby' nonsense! DD was 9lbs 4oz at birth, was 98th centile but now down to 95th, 5.5 months old and EBF. Honestly, what did people with big babies do pre formula? They just got on with feeding breast milk! Maybe introducing solids a bit earlier (not that I'm at all convinced that makes a not of difference) but come on, it's not as if big babies are a new invention.

I am also having sleep problems, but that's due to a protracted sleep regression. I am making sure I feed in solitude during the day so that she can concentrate on the job at hand. I also give a feed at 4.30pm and then her final bedtime feed just before 7 to try to load her up for the night.

Obviously I don't have all the answers since she's waking in the night, but like you, formula's not the answer for us (not least because it actually isn't the answer to these specific issues!). We started BLW yesterday, but she's not really ready for it, so it will be a while before that makes any difference.

Yes - I have the BLW book and would like to do BLW when DD shows an interest. I was considering introducing baby rice before bed early, but apart from that, doing BLW, if that makes sense! So aside from the baby rice that I thought might fill her up a bit at night, letting her have finger foods and choose foods herself etc etc... but as everyone says, now not convinced that baby rice will help!

5dollar - thanks, its good to know its not just me!

Its hard because as I said, I am the only mother I know bf'ing (also the only person I know using a wrap sling, using washable nappies and not using Gina Ford... you get the general idea!)

Whenever people tell me that because DD is big she needs more than my breastmilk, I just tell them that its my breastmilk that got her big and is keeping her big!!! She was born just above the 50th centile and has been steady at the 98th since 3 weeks! I think she feeds more often than my ff friends because breeast milk is so easily, therefore quickly, digested and because babies' tummies are small, right? She only poos once every 3 days as well, I think because there is so little wastage! Nearly everything in my breastmilk is absorbed and used by her! Well, that's my theory...

Its good to come on here and chat etc!

LeggyBlonde - it's taken us quite a while to get to self-settling, as I wasn't prepared to do controlled crying/CIO or anything like that. I suppose we did it in stages really over the last 6 weeks - I stopped feeding ds to sleep and DP rocked him instead, then we stopped rocking and just held/cuddled ds (this resulted in 5-10 minutes crying in our arms before every sleep!), then some pick up/put down, then I just sat next to the cot with my hand on his tummy til he fell asleep (2 hours the first night), and now we're at a point where he goes into the cot awake and can fall asleep (sometimes with me going in once or twice to resettle him).

It wasn't quick and he certainly wasn't ready to settle himself at all before 4 months.

I guess with each "stage" we just aimed for a little less input from us.

Just wanted to say that my DS is 8 weeks old and is EBF. I too love feeding him myself, but also seem to be the only one still doing so in my baby group

Go us

Sorry for coming back so late to this!
Legallyblonde its hard when you've no one in real life to ask. I am in the same position really. Have you gone to a bf group? I have had no bf problems, just questions like you, but I go every week to a group and its great. Some weeks bf doesn't even get discussed but its good to know it can be and that there are people on hand to give advice or just talk things through.

Oh and baby rice can cause constipation so I'm not convinced its the best first food even though alot of people use it.