Dieting whilst breastfeeding

[colette]

I intend to feed my ds (now 8 weeks ) for as long as possible,but am feeling depressed about my weight. I am 1.5 stone heavier than pre-pregnancy . I appreciate it will be a very slow process and I will have to ensure I eat as healthily as possible and fit in more exercise.
I am thinking of joining a Rosemary Conley class, but a friend who is also a Dr. said you need to maintain a reasonable intake of fat whilst b/f. I am confused as to what a reasonable amount is and my other concern re dieting and b/f is that I am not eating enough calcium . I have had sore joints and have wondered if there is a connection- thinking about it I drink very little milk and have cut right down on cheese .
Any advice on dieting whilst b/f and what I should be eating per day to ensure an adequate intake of calcium.
Thanks

You do not need to eat extra fat to make milk. That's simply not true for anyone who is overweight. The fat on your body is the fuel for breastfeeding. It's why we tend to get fat when pregnant. Some of us more than others!

Yes, the article was illustrated with a pic of her in a swimsuit, much appreciated whilst lounging on me settee eating breakfast with bedhead hair and eyebags.

I don't think you have to be fat to breastfeed, but to me dieting means depriving yourself of food, therefore depriving your baby of nutrients.

My hv and midwife advised me not to diet so I didn't and was so hungry the whole time, don't think I could have done.

Will have to agree to disagree on this one, but I take your point that I did find it fairly easy for the weight to go. Not this last half stone though its here to stay methinks.

Oliveoil, I think we all know that hvs and midwives aren't always up to date! I think the reason I get quite, um, agitated about this is that I think we tend to think of breastfeeding as this amazingly fragile thing which involves 'paying the price' and 'sacrifice', during which you can't live a normal life, exercise, diet, drink wine, eat all sorts of foods etc and I believe that this all contributes to women either not starting to b/feed or giving up. I felt Elle Macpherson's statement strongly suggested that she would only breastfeed for six months and THEN diet and exercise, which is such an unneccesarry thing to say. I believed all the hype, urban myths and misinformation when breastfeeding. I was SO shocked when I didn't lose weight, believed I couldn't diet etc, and when I stopped after 14months I was equally shocked to find I didn't miraculously lose weight then either.
Extremely good studies have shown NO difference in the breast milk of dieting and non dieting mothers, so it is simply not true that the baby doesn't get enough nutrients via breastmilk if you diet. The breastmilk of third world mothers who eat very limited diets indeed hardly varies at all from that of pampered Western mothers. Plus, of course, it is largely composed of fat and sugar anyway, both of which are easily supplied from a mother's own fat stores. The thing is, it would not make any evolutionary sense for breastfeeding to be so fragile. All over the world, women get up from having babies and go back to hard physical work, caring for other children and eating a diet limited very much by availability. They all breastfeed!
I posted links to the studies on the other thread but will try to look them out again. They really are considered very conclusive, even by breastfeeding organisations such as nursing mother and La Leche in the US, which are very pro normalising breastfeeding as something you can do while living a normal life.

I don't think b/f means depriving yourself of any of the things you mentionned, especially food. And what is so unnecessary about saying you would b/feed for 6 months and then diet/exercise?

Oliveoil, lots of people believe you can't eat or drink all sorts of things when pregnant -eg tea coffee, wine, grapes, citrus fruit, brocolli, curries and the list goes on and on. They turn up again and again on this site alone. It really puts people off. As for E M's comment, what it seemed to be saying was after six months, she's stop breastfeeding so she could start whipping herself into shape. What's so unnecessary about that is that she can lose weight and exercise while still breastfeeding. I think a lot of people would read that comment and think, well, I have to stay fat until I give up breastfeeding, so I'll give it up at six months so I can try to fit back onto my clothes/get fit. There's no need to give it up if you realise it is OK to lose weight and get fit while still feeding - that way women can breastfeed longer with all the mutual benefits that confers.

Oliveoil, lots of people believe you can't eat or drink all sorts of things when pregnant -eg tea coffee, wine, grapes, citrus fruit, brocolli, curries and the list goes on and on. They turn up again and again on this site alone. It really puts people off. As for E M's comment, what it seemed to be saying was after six months, she's stop breastfeeding so she could start whipping herself into shape. What's so unnecessary about that is that she can lose weight and exercise while still breastfeeding. I think a lot of people would read that comment and think, well, I have to stay fat until I give up breastfeeding, so I'll give it up at six months so I can try to fit back onto my clothes/get fit. There's no need to give it up if you realise it is OK to lose weight and get fit while still feeding - that way women can breastfeed longer with all the mutual benefits that confers.

I found this snippet about her on the web. While I think it's great that a celeb is breastfeeding and I loved her maternity bra (!) I think it's a shape she's in a position to give accurate information and is giving misleading information instead. I think she's making it clear that she intends to stop breastfeeding at six months so she can lose weight (not that she's anything but skinny even when pregnant, grrr!) and I think it's sad that she will probably encourage others to do the same who might otherwise carry on feeding.
MACPHERSON PUTS BABY BEFORE BODY

Australian supermodel ELLE MACPHERSON is determined to breastfeed her new son - even though it endangers her famous figure.
The leggy beauty, known as THE BODY for her astounding physique, gave birth to her and financier ARKI BUSSON's second son on 4 February (03) - and Elle is happy to put little AURELIUS CY ANDREA's health before her looks.
She explains, "Nowadays, all the doctors are saying that the recommended time for breastfeeding is six months, and I put the health of my children ahead of the way my body looks.
"It is tempting not to breastfeed because you lose the weight more quickly - you can diet, which you can't do when you're breastfeeding because you lose your milk. You can't do a lot of aerobic activity either.
"So you to not be vain for six months of your life and say, 'Okay, I'm going to be a bit heavier but I'm doing something really good for my child.' For me there's no question."

A shame not a shape. Durr

I think we should call it a miracle she is
a. feedng and
b. telling people about it

Personally I used it as a bit of an excuse to eat lots of cakes and wasn't aware of any foods I "couldn't" eat.....I had the odd glass of wine as well.

I had planned to b/feed for around 6 months anyway so it wasn't that I was in a rush to slim down. Maybe Elle Mc was of the same thought?

(ps - her maternity bra made me itch and gave me pointy boobs)

I am pregnant with my 4th child. I have b/f all three of my other children. As soon as I felt good (4-5 weeks) I started moderate excersise. The weight will come off alot quicker when you b/f. Do not diet! When you cut your calories, you stop producing enough milk. I lost all the baby weight in 12 weeks.

You do not reduce your milk supply by cutting calories. How many times does that point need to be made. Yes if you go on a starvation diet your milk might suffer, but I don't think anybody should be on a starvation diet anyway. Eating a healthy diet (lots of fruit/salads/veggies/protein) is perfectly Ok when breastfeeding. Cutting out high fat food is perfectly OK.
I agree with aloha that if bf was treated as a more normal thing, that could easily fit into your everyday life, more women would do it for longer. I hate the idea taht is perpetuated by views like elle's that bf is something you should put up with doing for the sake of your child - it's just as good for the mother.
My frst ever Mumsnet post was to ask how long I had to pump and dump for after getting trashed. My dd was 3 months or so, and I really really wanted a big night out. My HV said I shouldn't be even considering drinking whilst bf and actually told me I should give up bf if I wanted to drink. It was only because of Mumsnet that I realised I could have my life back whilst still bf.

Prufrock, this is my first time posting on this site. I DID cut my milk supply when I cut my calories. Maybe it does happen to some people. Be a little nicer to the newcomers.

I'm sorry you felt my post was getting at you sherryhon - that was not my intention at all. Welcome to Mumsnet.

Sherryhon, prufrock is right, sorry - and I don't think she intended being nasty in the way she said it, either

The research - and there has been quite a bit of it - shows that calories 'in' does not affect calories 'out'' when it comes to breastfeeding.

Individual experiences are of course individual, and individual perception is individual, too. You may well have observed something different happening to you.

But - and I am not being horrible to you!! - you can't generalise from your experience and tell people not to diet, or assume that other people's experience is going to be the same.

Of course, sharing what happened to you is something else, and that's fine, and it's good to do this on mumsnet, but using your own experience to tell others what not to do is different...it's like telling people 'don't breastfeed' or 'don't bottle feed' which I bet you wouldn't do

Sherryhon, you are very lucky if your weight just fell off you while breastfeeding. That's not everyone's experience - and certainly not mine. I envy you, I really do. I breastfed for ages but never shed a pound. It was very depressing because I so wanted to be like you.

Aloha - I'd like to sing your praises. Like you last time not only did the weight not fall off in fact it went on. My HV kept saying to me you can eat what you like but I ended up in a really bad downward spiral. As I got fatter so I emersed myself in feeling bad and promptly ate more. When dd1 was 4 months I was 3+ stone overweight and extremely depressed at my body. It took me almost another year and half to get back to my pre-pregnancy size (a healthy size 12(ish)) and I have no intention of letting myself go again. Its been wonderful reading that other people have had similar experiences and that the myth of being able to eat what you like when bfing is a not true for everyone. Whilst I want to breast feed I also want to feel normal and healthy! It is true that there is a sense of having to put up with being overweight for the sake of bfing but I simply can't believe that's true. Agreed that a crash diet is not sensible - but its not sensible as a norm.

Thanks aloha and everyone else.

Aloha thanks for puting forward the informed case for deliberately losing weight when breastfeeding.
When I went to weightwatchers I had been bfeeding for three months and was steadily gaining weight. I was getting fat and miserable.
I actually nearly cried when I went for my first weigh in; it was like publicly saying "Yes, I am fat" which hurt my pride.

Losing weight as part of the whole new baby/sleepless nights thing had a very positive impact on me.I felt last year was a time I struggled with various aspects of my body (childbirth, breastfeeding, weight loss,turning forty and having and foot surgery ) and I felt I regained a lot of my self respect through losing the weight. I would not like to have been put off by misinformation about it being in some way unsafe to do so.

I am appalled that so called celebrities are talking a load of tosh about this.

I am now really undecided - the RC class is tomorrow and I am wondering if cutting fat right down might effect my energy levels. I really want to lose weight but am wondering about the connection between diet and energy levels. Being up 3 times a night and then getting Dd to school (she's just started) is leaving me feeling very tired. I don't know how my mum coped with 4 of us.
Weight watchers and slimming world do not have a class that suits .Anyone know any facts re. reducing fat/calories and energy levels ie:what is the best way to do it whilst b/f. I hate being undecided so any advice comments would be helpful. Thanks

Fat isn't the only thing to give you energy. If you want to maintain energy levels you are better off eating lots of protein (lean chicken/fish) and complex carbs (brown rice, veggies) not fatty stuff. You could do a normal RC class but allow yourself an extra glass of full fat milk if you do feel worried about the fat/calcium content.

Perhaps we should get away from the concept of 'dieting'. Weightwatchers is infact, healthy eating as are most of these other weightloss clubs. There is absolutly nothing wrong with healthy eating and losing weight whilst breastfeeding. What is not recommended is crash dieting. I was a fat pig whilst breastfeeding because I did not eat healthily. Lots of chocolate went down my throat (sugar surge is good for milk production you know ). I also fed very frequently so had an excuse for sitting down ( ha, ha).
Anyway, weightwatchers healthy eating did it for me. It is perfectly safe to actively try to lose weight at a sensible pace when breastfeeding.

However it may be quite hard to combine, say, the Atkins Diet with BF - I for one craved carbohydrates and sugar. My personal weight loss programme was a bout of vomiting and diarrhoea courtesy of DS, combined with BF - worked surprisingly well....!

Colette ... you can do weight watchers without joining a class. I am sure that you can join on-line these days and do it 'from the comfort of your own home' ... there is definitely a CD Rom that you can buy that takes you through the program. Personally I 'need' the classes to keep me on track but I am sure that the on line programs are good....

From what I have read the Rosemary Conley plan is very sensible and based around cutting out all the junk and eating very healthy foods so I don't see how it could be a problem, unless like me you really like to incorporate chocolate and wine into your plan .

Just copied and pasted this from the Weightwatchers site:

Can I follow the Points diet if I'm breastfeeding my baby?

If you are breastfeeding and your baby is less than six months old, we ask you to get your doctor's permission before you join Weight Watchers Meetings or start attending Meetings again if you were a Member at the beginning of your pregnancy.

If your baby is less than six weeks old or if you have not yet had your postnatal examination you may not join Weight Watchers Meetings or attend Meetings. If you have already joined or attended and were not aware of this, please tell your Leader - she or he will be happy for you to continue with your Meetings Membership once your baby is old enough. The online subscription products available through WeightWatchers.co.uk are not appropriate for breastfeeding mothers at this time.

Will I have to pay another registration fee for Meetings when I come back to Weight Watchers after having my baby?

If you joined Weight Watchers Meetings before you were 12 weeks pregnant you need not pay another registration fee as long as you return before your baby is six months old and you still have your Membership Card. If you are a Gold Member, you may attend Meetings free of charge until your baby is six months old, even if you are more than 5lb over your Goal Weight.

Once your baby is six months old, you will be asked to pay the weekly Meetings fee if you are more than 5lb over your Goal Weight.

If you are a subscriber to Weight Watchers Online or Weight Watchers eSource, you should cancel your subscription when you become pregnant, and re-register once you have stopped breastfeeding, your baby is six months old, and you have had your postnatal examination.

Hope that answers a few more questions. I'd have loved to do WW online - it means you don't have to go to classes, but as I'm still bf I think I'm out of the running atm. Excuses, excuses...