baby is sleeping loads, sometimes for 5 hours

[DuelingFanjo]

my baby was in special care for 9 days and fed my expressed breast milk every 4 hours. Now he's home he's fully breastfed (no bottle since 5am yesterday) and now seems to only want feeding every 4-5 hours. I try to wake him but he often just won't. Yesterday I fed him at one andthen again at six then at half ten ish. He only woke once in the night.

When he feeds he is on the breast for ages, sometimes an hour.

is this ok? he's now 12 days old. Lots of dirty and wet nappies and seems content.

Where is he sleeping? And how often is he feeding in 24 hours?

I'd say one or two 4-5 hour stretches in 24 is ok, so long as you're feeding more frequently other than that. Your supply won't cope with such infrequent feeding for one thing.

Should be feeding something like 10-12 times in 24 hours, 8 at a minimum. Hour long feeds are normal though.

DF - you are right to be concerned, especially after your difficult start.

Are you in touch with the midwife? Can she weigh him?

It could be an unusual day and today might be quite different, but normal feeding at 12 days is much more frequent than this, and I would be very concerned about a baby of this age who was only asking for feeds every 4-5 hours.

I think you need to speak to someone today.

he's sleeping with us, sometimes in bed with me specially after his feed in the night. Or in the moses basket next to the bed or during the day he's usually with me or in the moses baske.

He's feeding about 6 - 7 times in 24 hours. He gained weight in hospital in the first week. Midwife came round yesterday but didn't weigh him as it was only 2 days since he'd last been weighed.

Yesterday MIL and FIL were here and they held the baby from about 2 (after a feed) until MIL left at 6. He didn't display any obvious feeding cues the whole time, though I can't be sure as I barely got a chance to hold him. I have a breastfeeding person coming round today - arranged by the midwife. He's just fed for about an hour. Last feed before that was 6 am-ish.

I'll try to wake him for feeds. I am worried about my supply. When I was pumping for him I did it every 3 or 4 hours and my breasts seemsed fuller. They don't seem to be as full now.

When you say "loads of dirty" nappies, what do you mean, exactly? If a poo only counts if it's as big as a 50p piece, how many poos per 24 hours?

I would be a bit concerned - may be worth pumping a bit to ensure your supply stays good?

Dirty nappies with poo and/or pee - about 8-10 a day. They are yellowy mustard.

Would pumping help? Should I do that straight after feeding? Breasts are usually pretty soft by then, or wait an hour or so?

DF I wish I had been firmer with restricting visitors this time round, it did have an effect with DS. I would get help today and ban all visitors until feeding established - I've done this over last few days and it has made big dufference. Hope you get it sorted.

If he's used to being on a 4 hour schedule at the hospital, it sounds like he's keeping up with it at home. He's having a good, long feed when he does, completely emptying the breast. If he is gaining weight, having plenty of wet and dirty nappies, which it seems he is, then I think you've struck very lucky with a happy, well fed baby. Enjoy.

I was the same but dd lost weight. was told by midwife the more they sleep, the more they will sleep. I would try to get him on a 3 hour routine. when I did this I found my dd was more alert and awake for longer stretches. she then got better at feeding on demand and I did not have to worry about a routine. having said that, get him weighed in another couple of days and as long as he is gaining should be fine. good luck and congratulations!

Thanks all. Have just had the breastfeeding person round and she says he has lost 30mgssince we got him home but is still above his birth weight and advised me to wake him every 3 hours. She also said to introduce a top-up in the evening of 20 ml. Not sure what to do as we just got him off the bottle.

She said he's nice and alert and pink and to not worry but to get him up to 10 feeds a day if I can. She also showed me a different hold for feeding which is a lot nicer than the grip and shove method I was taught by the midwife yesterday!

Bloody midwives and their shoving!

I agree with you about the top up, especially for such a small amount. Plenty of time to introduce a bottle later (if you want to) once feeding is going well.

TheVisitor, your reassurance is misplaced, sorry.

Very few 12 day old babies, especially with the really difficult start that DF's baby had, are doing well on four hourly feeds. This is a sign to really check that feeding is going well.

DF, your baby may have been over-stimulated and being held by different people, being kept away from his mum, is not good for a new baby in any way - babies can sometimes 'turn off' to protect themselves from the handling and passing about - even if it is gentle and loving, it is simply not helpful to you, to bf or the baby :( The good news is that any setback is likely to be temporary - lots of gentle, quite close cuddles from you, and responsiveness to his feeding cues, with waking him (gently) if needed, will fix things.

The top up suggested to you does not have to be formula, but ebm, if you can manage it.

Visitors holding a baby for four hours - sheesh.

Next time you will put your feet down, I'm sure, DF!!!

Visitors really messed with getting bf started with my first, was a very stressful time. DS had to be 'topped up' but as tiktok says this was with EBM, and it doesn't have to be a bottle (he was cup fed). He got increasingly sleeping and jaundiced and wasn't asking for feeds. We did manage to turn it around and he then bf until he was ready to give it up.

Good that you're getting RL help, and there is also good advice on this thread.

Thankfully the visitor thing was a one off.

I have fed him every 3 hours since 11am. He seems happy. DH has made me a spreadsheet will keep you posted. The health visitor is coming on Tuesday.

thanks for all the help and advice.

Good that he's feeding more regularly now, hope things continue to improve :).

I was also led to believe by the neonatal unit that 4-hourly breastfeeds were ok. But that'd possibly be why DS put on 150g in total in the 5 weeks he was on that unit! When he got home he went to demand feeding and put on 200g+ a week. But damned hard to wake a tiny sleep baby if they aren't playing ball, though!

One thought - an hour+ at a time was standard for my DD but her latch was rubbish, as I now know. With DS, who despite being a 26-weeker is a champion latcher, he can empty a full breast in 10 mins flat. I know that hour-long feeds are within the realms of normal, but if every feed is like that, could it be that your baby is exhausting himself trying to get a full feed, hence the long sleeps?

On the other hand, and forgive me tiktok as I have no specialist knowledge here at all, but it must be theoretically possible for a tiny baby to fill up their tummy enough to go for 4 hours between feeds, or surely (surely?!) so many neonatal units wouldn't put babies on 4-hourly expressed feeds via ng tube or bottle??

Good luck DF - it's an anxious difficult time but you'll get through it by hook or by crook!

oops sorry didn't actually see your last message - something wrong with updating of threads on my phone! Glad things are on the up.

libellule, you ask "it must be theoretically possible for a tiny baby to fill up their tummy enough to go for 4 hours between feeds, or surely (surely?!) so many neonatal units wouldn't put babies on 4-hourly expressed feeds via ng tube or bottle??"

Yes, babies' stomachs can take more than they physiologically need at any one time - but why would this be encouraged?

Big huge loads like this are absolutely not good for most babies - we are 'designed' by evolution to take relatively small amounts at short intervals when we are babies. The frequent loving, social contact this enables us to have with our mothers helps develop the brain in the short 'bursts' of stimulation the brain can cope best with, when a newborn.

There is tension between this normal, healthy, frequent pattern and the need for sick or tiny babies to stay as calm and untroubled and un-messed about with as possible - which is why kangaroo care www.kangaroomothercare.com is absolutely the best way for babies to be cared for in SCBO/NNICU, whenever possible. Tucked up next to mum's chest means temperature is regulated well, sounds are muffled, and handling is kept to a minimum.

Four hourly feeds or three hourly feeds may be as much messing about as a non-kangaroo'd baby can cope with - and also babies who are too little or sick to 'ask' for feeds may need some timetabling to ensure their intake is monitored.

But as a routine for a healthy baby it makes no sense at all, unless the baby seems to be 'asking' for this sort of regularity.

It seems to have all turned around now. He's having feeds every 2 hours or so now. First of all we had to wake him but last night he fed at 22.30, midnight, half past 2 and 4.30 am then after a bit of a long sleep he fed again at 9.30 am, 11.15, 13.10 and I am in the middle of a feed now - well DH his changing his nappy as he just filled his nappy

I thik lots of Skin to skin has helped us both too.

Well done DF, brilliant news!

DF - that sounds great.

DF - excellent!

Beg to differ tiktok about the feed timing in NICU/SCBU - smaller, sicker babies are fed every hour, or even more often than that. 3 or 4 hourly feeds are what babies 'graduate' to when they get bigger and their digestives systems more mature. And my suspicion is that that's partly a nursing time issue - tube feeds take a long time when they are up to 30/40ml+ in volume, and much easier management-wise to do less of them less often. I suspect, as you say, that it's more a bottle-feeding v. breastfeeding issue, and that many nurses don't realise that a 'full' feed direct from the breast is likely to be less than a full bottle feed.

I do think that babies do come home from SCBU
still primed for the same schedule they were on in hospital - seems (in mine as in DF's case) that it just sometimes takes them a little while to get used to 'normal' demand feeding.

libellulle - I am not saying that it's a good thing to have prems on scheduled feeds, not at all. Very tiny, sick or very early babies have frequent feeds anyway as you say.

Bob has put the weight he lost back on, and some... in 2 days. mightily relieved :)

That's great news, glad things are going well :)