ds 1 week - really struggling with BF

[lainey1981]

hi all,

just looking for a bit of support really
DS is one week old today and I am really struggling with BF'ing.
Had long labour and assisted forceps delivery meaning we missed out on initial skin to skin - DS eventually latched on for a feed 36hours after birth after many tears from me and lots of help from midwives
However, I find feeding absolute agony, despite being told my latch is correct, my nipples are bleeding cracked and sore and by the end of the day I am in agony feeding.As a result since the 3rd night (after DS feeding from 10.30-3.50am) I have offered formula for night feeds, which is leaving me racked with guilt.
I feel guilty for wanting to FF every feed, as it seems to satisfy DS so much easier.
the MW suspects he may may have slight tongue tie - as he struggles to latch on - I have to offer the breast 4 or 5 times before he latches properly, which in the middle of the night was causing me much distress, accompanied by his sucking of hands and wriggling head.
I have only been able to 'master' the rugby hold, so feel that I cannot even go out and about as feeding in this position in public would be v difficult IMO.
I have spent hours and hours crying - agonising over continuing through the pain as I know breast milk is 'best', and desperately wanting to switch to FF to feel like I have some control.
I also feel that am not bonding with my son as I am dreading him waking to feed, particularly today as he has been feeding every hour for between 20-30 minutes.
I don't know what to do for the best, I really wanted to EBF, but just didn't understand the overwhelming nature of being chained to the sofa in agony with a hungry baby.

poor you

first, get on the phone to bfn, nct or lll. or all 3! they are fab and better than mws. i had a bfn peer supporter round with ds2 and it really helped. it was free.

second, if it is tt, it needs fixed! really soon. shout if necessary.

third, you are doing fab. many give up before this stage. it is awful to feel so bad.

get on the phone now

www.breastfeedingnetwork.org.uk/

www.nctpregnancyandbabycare.com/home

oh, and i ffed ds1 and bf ds2 and after the first few weeks, bfing is miles easier

are you getting enough mw support? can you get to a bf cafe or speak to a bf counsellor? is his weight ok?

I have been in similar circs and it did get better although it is not easy. Rugby hold seemed to help get a deeper latch and lying down to feed is really brilliant, have a look at the www.kellymom.com/ site for more positioning and general advice.

thanks for your replies.
I have had 2 midwife visits since birth, he was 3.490k at birth and lost 230g when weighed on saturday so less than 10%.
When MW was here he latched on and the pain wasn't so bad despite the cuts. i have been referred to TT clinic so just waiting to hear from them tomorrow.
MW wasn't very supportive when I told her I had been giving FF during night as couldn't cope with night feeds - she just said I should EBF for 6 months - no sympathy or advice!
everyone keeps saying "if you can just get through the first couple of weeks it gets easier" and I know this is probably true - but in my emotional fog even tomorrow seems like an age away. DS is asleep and my nipples are still stinging from the last feed despite lathering on Lansinoh.
I will try to get to a BF cafe as I would like to master the more traditional hold which i think will be easier in the long run as for rugby hold am constantly having to get pillows etc to support DS.
I just didn't realise the first week would be dominated by me thinking about feeding constantly and in so much pain. I don't think it helps that am anaemic after PPH which means am even more tired so therefore prob over emotional
Poor DP is constantly having to comfort me - he's back at work today and the morning was full of feeds.
DS often feeds for 10 minutes, then falls asleep only to wake up 20 mins later and want to feed again. I know this is probably all normal but often means it takes 3 attempts for him to finish a feed.

The first weeks can be very hard, regardless of how you are feeding.

Do try the helplines.

Crap that you are getting little support, and just being 'told' to get on with it. That was mt experience with ds1. I got help this time and now LOVE bfing.

I know it seems so far though.

I know it isn't really that helpful but it really does get better! I felt the same as you a few weeks ago and now DS2 is 6 weeks old and it is so much easier and much more comfortable. It is just bloody hard at the beginning and no one prepares you for this. I found it so unhelpful when I read constantly that bfing "shouldn't hurt". Well, it does first of all. He also had a tongue tie, which I got snipped at the bfing support group by a midwife. I found it helpful to go there for support. I also spoke to friends who I knew had successfully bf for a long time, for some support and advice. I found that whenever I had to latch on in front of a mw or health visitor, that it was less painful and I realised I was probably trying harder when someone was watching. So I kept this in mind, and this helped. Are you expressing when you ff at night? Just because if you are replacing feeds at this stage it might not help your milk supply.

I had terrible problems with DS1 and he had lots of bottles, but I had the time to express them that time round. This time I decided if bfing didn't work I would have to switch to ff and not beat myself up about it. But I have stuck with it and I think it is starting to pay off. Have you tried the exaggerated attachment method? This helped me - there are lots of instructions online.

Do you use Lansinoh (spelt something like that). I found it really helps. Are you very engorged? I found that by using a hand held pump and expressing only about 1/2 0z it released the nipple enough to give baby something to latch on to. Thinking of you. It is tough at the start.

I was in a similar situation during the first week after the birth of my DS. He also had tongue tie and I was sleep deprived, dreading the agony of every feed and in floods of tears.

Will you need to wait long to see someone about the tongue tie? If there is a long waiting list it could be well worth asking your local breast feeding counsellors if they know anyone who can see you privately - I don't know how you are placed financially but it cost us £160 to have it treated privately (to avoid a 4 week waiting list) and we felt that was well worth it given the impact that the wait would have been likely to have on my ability to continue feeding.

Have you thought about expressing? Not everyone finds it easy but it really helped me psychologically. I was very upset at the idea that if I couldn't continue with the feeds I would have to give my DS formula. My DH pointed out that I could give him expressed breastmilk and for me having that alternative gave me the ability to continue coping with each next feed as if it was too bad there was an alternative for the next feed. While there is a risk of nipple confusion if a young baby is given a bottle, many manage fine - others would be better placed to advise on this as in the end I managed to feed through it.

My DS is now 4 weeks old and we are doing well. Things improved dramatically on the 2nd day after his tongue tie was snipped - so don't lose hope.

Well done for persevering so far! It is a real sign of your devotion to him that you are feeding despite the pain.

Poor thing. I know exactly how you feel, six months ago I too had an assisted delivery and between the jigs and the reels and the exhaustion, struggled with the very basics of BF'ing. LO had a tongue tie, which was cut at day two by a midwife in the hospital - have you asked whether they do it at your local hosp? - unfortunately by this time I was sore and cracked and had bleeding nipples, my general everything was sore and I couldn't think straight.

I too started offering a night bottle formula feed and was racked with guilt. I was in tears every night because of the exhaustion and guilt beating myself up about not being good enough.

BUT, BUT, BUT I PROMISE you if you keep going, it will get better. I told myself if I could make it to 4 weeks, I could then take a view as to whether to continue BF'ing or switch entirely to bottle. We made it to 4 weeks combination feeding and then I said let's try to make it 5. We were lucky at 6 weeks to meet the ninja of all BF'ing counsellers who sat with me for hours and helped us feed. It did seem for a while that LO would be perfect whilst watched and then lose the latch when we were alone, but eventually, it started working and now, 6 months later, it's second nature. Suddenly,at 6 weeks we were able to give up the bottle and went totally BF. I found that either sitting up and placing and an exagerated amount of boob in his mouth worked and then we worked out how to feed lying down and didn't look back.

There is but one rule though, whatever happens, he's your baby and you know best. If for your sake you feel that you've no alternative but to switch, then that's your call. Don't let anyone tell you what to do. It's probably the hardest work I've ever done, and eventually it worked. Do what's right for you two.

Stupid midwife - it's her job to help and support you so you can breastfeed, just telling you to EBF til 6 months is a complete failure on her part

Hopefully you'll get the tongue tie sorted soon, and definitely get some decent real life help from NCT/LLL/BFN.

Oh I empathise. If you have a look at recent threads, I posted a similar thread just a few days ago!
My ds is now 18 days old, and at two weeks I was really struggling. Just four days later I can honestly say it's got infinitely better and easier.
The midwives think he has a slight tongue tie, but there was some debate about that, and nothing was done to fix it. I often felt/feel like his tongue is licking the front of my nipple which can be rough and painful.
But as a previous poster said, the more practice you both get, the easier it seems to become. The "regular" cradle hold is now just about doable now with little discomfort. I still find the rugbyball better, as ds finds a good latch quicker and easier.

Take one day at a time, but if you decide to go to formula, then that's what you do, without guilt. It's not poison, after all. My ds1 was ff from a couple of weeks old, and he thrived on it. I've no qualms about doing the same again if bf doesn't work out.

Lansinoh won't really soothe the pain you have, but will allow the cracks to heal much quicker, as they are not being allowed to dry out and scab over (you do not want that to happen...)
BUT.........I've noticed that Lansinoh can actually affect the latch, as ds seems to struggle to keep it in his mouth - it literally slips out. So I've started wiping it off before attempting a feed. Maybe this is worth a try

Best of luck x

thanks for your replies.
harasniffud & Likes I have an appointment at King's to get the suspsected tongue tie assessed today, and am hoping to get some general advice about my latch and positioning to see if there is anything I am doing wrong.
Right breast was too painful to feed from yestreday evening so all feeds were done from left. has helped a bit though woke up leaking and engorged on right side.
vmcd good tip about wiping off the lansinoh, will give that a go as he does seem to struggle more when I have that on.
tras will try to express a bit as probably would have helped this morning when i was very engorged and was hard for DS to latch on.

hi all, just to say been to hospital this afternoon and they confirmed DS has a posterior tongue tie, meaning he can't lift tongue to roof of mouth - leaving me the bare the pain of his gums grinding against my nipple

so relieved there is a reason for all the pain and not just that I am wimp. Have urgent referral for a snip, which should be next week. Fingers crossed this resolves the pain and will help us progress with BFing

Well done, that is good news! Can you persuade anyone to do the snip sooner? It's very quick to do and to heal if done by someone experienced - I understand they don't even use anaesthetic, just do it and then latch on to feed and it's all over.

If you have to wait, would nipple shields help your pain in the meantime? Or at least plenty of painkillers, if you're not already on these.

Good luck!

The bonding will come, I promise. I found it impossible to bond when every time my beautiful newborn came near me I ended up wailing in agony. It got to the point where I refused to hold him between feeds at all, I just wanted to be away from him. (I know that sounds horrible but I don't believe I'm the first person to have felt like that!) He's 11 weeks now, been feeding all afternoon, and is now happily asleep in my lap with his head resting on my boob. I never want to put him down now! They don't stop the clock on when you bond,it will happen.

I deleted the first half of that post somehow... it was just empathising with the pain really, but it sounds odd without it! Could you try expressing for a few days to give the girls a rest?! That definitely saved my BFing career. x

KN, I felt the same with ds1, I dreaded him waking, and gave up bfeeding after a couple of weeks cos I couldn't cope any more. But with ds2, 18 days old, I feel very differently. I think it's because I KNOW this time that things get MUCH easier VERY soon. With ds1 I felt like there was no light at the end of tunnel.

Lainey, try to take some mental pressure off. Look at each issue separately and deal with each. Re the bfeeding problems, you have a few options - switch to formula (as I said earlier, it's not poison, it won't harm yr ds), or if you want to continue bfeeding, you can express every feed till your boobs don't hurt so much, or you can speak to a bfeeding support worker for support and advice. I now know myself that it can and does get better after the two-week mark. The best advice I got was to accept that for the next few days you'll have to make feeding the priority. Just a few days of feeding when ds wants fed will make all the difference. Get a good book or some films/dvds, and settle down for each feed, and try to enjoy it more, instead of it being a chore. The constant feeding doesn't last as your milk supply increases and gets richer over the days.
The bfeeding support in my maternity ward made a great point when she said that you're both learning a new skill, and only practice will make you both better at it. With me and ds2, it's very hit and miss, but we have more nice feeds now than uncomfortable feeds, but I'd never have believed that was possible just a few days ago.
I had a traumatic delivery of ds1 and resented him for what he'd put me through. I wish I'd made more effort just to try to enjoy him - they don't stay at that stage for long. X

Well done bfing for a week through posterior tongue tie! That's what DS had and it was bloody agony and I couldn't figure out what I was doing wrong.

Take paracetamol and/or ibuprofen, use jelonet, get that TT snipped and get ready for a feeling of immense relief. I fed DS in the doctor's office after the snip (a teensy 2 minute job) and couldn't BELIEVE how little it hurt, even with damaged nips!

And a hearty 'congrats on your baby!' and "well done for breastfeeding him!" from me!

thanks again vmc i read your posts from last week so see you were also struggling, glad things are better now. i am typing one handed as expressing, been doing a mixture of bfing expressing and formula since last night. worried ds will get confused but seems to be coping well. in fact he has been so much calmer today as think it was very hard for him to get a full feed as tt babies have to work harder.
kn think bonding is coming now he's not constantly wailing at me for starving him
catilla the tt is only once a week so tues is earliest - just hope he makes the cut for this week

blackcurrants you have no idea how much i needed to hear that

It's true, I swear! I promise! You just need to keep expressing till then, lots of skin to skin, and what worked for me before we could get the snip was feeding him lying down (because all the damage had come from trying to feed him sitting up, so lying down didn't hurt at much).

I couldn't feed sitting up until after the snip, not without it hurting - but I fed lying down in the days while I waited for the appointment. Dunno if that would work for you. It's still one of our favourite things to do [lazy buggers in my house] :)