Help re-establishing bf please or tell me your success stories

[Fenouille]

I have a 10 day old DS who is fed expressed milk and formula top ups from a bottle. We had massive problems with the latch at birth due to an undiagnosed tongue tie and due to large weight loss in the first three days were recommended to bottle feed until the tie could be resolved.

The tie broke by itself yesterday but it was a bank holiday here (France) so I'm on my own until Monday. I'm planning on spending the day with DS lying on me ready to try to latch as soon as he looks ready to eat.

I have milk and he has been trying to latch but seems to get frustrated and waves his head around after a few minutes. He also doesn't appear to suck too much (I suppose that's now laziness from the bottle) despite the fact that he ends up with milk all over his face as my boobs start leaking as soon as he tries.

How can I encourage him to suck (he sucks fingers with gusto)?

Is there anything other than patience to get us back on track?

Do any of you have nice positive stories of your success in this situation?

Good news is that you're still very early into things, so there is more of a chance of it going well.

If he is getting frustrated, try pulling his bum in. It will be difficult for him to get used to the breast again because they have to work so much harder.

Lots of skin to skin, in bed, in the bath, wherever, maybe try some biological nurturing. And get some RL support asap.

Good luck :)

I bottle fed DD1 for 8 weeks with mostly formula but some expressed bm before we got to ex.bf she then nursed until she was 3.6y/o.

If you have milk there is hope. The first thing is to ensure DS is fed (if you can move to cup feeding all the better as then he should have to meet his suckling needs elsewhere) and the second is to protect your milk supply. If DS isn't latching you need to be expressing 8-12 times a day - milk yield is unimportant though it's the stimulation of the breasts thats the important bit.

Have lots of skin to skin especially in the biological nurturing position, but pull back from trying to latch DS on if he gets distressed and just do skin to skin. Co-bathing is also very good for re-lactating. Lots of stroking and gentle contact. Dad can do skin to skin too whilst you express (if it's not possible for you to express and s-2-s at the same time - I imagine if you haven't got an electric pump that would be tricky)

If the speed of the flow is off putting to DS, try hand expressing a little off before trying to latch him on.

Some good websites for information:-

Biological nurturing

Jack Newman's videos - lot's of latching videos and if you scroll down the page there are videos on cup feeding, and how to soften a breast if it's engorged to prepare for baby.

A great guide to relactation from Kellymom.com.

I really hope things go well and remember - where there's milk there's hope

Thanks SirBoob and Truth

The videos are excellent, thanks for that, and the moral support invaluable :)

I've started spoon feeding this morning but now I've seen cup feeding in action we'll give that a go. He did latch after the spoon feeding pretty spontaneously - took us both by surprise I think! Don't know how efficient it was but he definitely got something down him. He definitely wants to feed from the boob so I hope he picks up the hang of it quickly once he realises that there will be no more bottles.

I should be able to speak to someone in RL on Monday or Tuesday but you've given me a great morale boost to get through the weekend. Thanks :)

Hi Fenouille.

Just wanted to say hang on in there you can do it!

My DS did not latch on until he was 4 weeks old due to being in NICU. He was syringe and then bottle fed EBM and formula. Once I knew he could latch on (however difficult and he resisted and cried for bottles initially) I ditched bottles and he is now 10 weeks old and has been EBF for 6 weeks. It is much easier now.

I would definitely agree don't try and latch him if he is distressed and just go with the flow and try and relax.

Good luck you are doing really well.

Hello! I was in your shoes about 2 weeks ago. (Baby now almost 4 weeks old) I started going to the Baby Cafe and got some advice there; was subsequently able to feed from 1 side. Went to the hospital LC last Monday, and now am partially successful with the other side. The important bit is we got off of formula, and now she's not had any EBM for 2 days!

If he's interested in having a go, just keep letting him try. The 2 days of skin-to-skin we did are probably what boosted everything else into place. :)

It can take baby a little while to get used to his 'new' tongue once the tie has been snipped.

Hang in there, you have milk , you have a willing baby, just feed him if he looks even remotely interested, you'll get there.

I'm currently ebf ing my 20 week old who has unsnipped TT. I formula fed for 3 weeks without expressing and then had to relactate when he was 6 weeks old. You really can do this.

Good luck :)

Thanks e eryone :) Skin-to-skin all day today and he's now getting the hang of my left boob. At the last pump after his last feed I got about a quarter of what I've been getting up to now out of that side - that's a good sign he's emptied the breast, right? He's also slept his usual 2 hours since the feed so I'm taking that as positive.

I assume that as long as I keep pumping I won't end up lopsided?

Action plan for Monday: get the HV out for a home visit and get an appointment with the local MW specialised in bf.

Tomorrow it'll be s2s again. Just trying to persuade DH that we should fend off the DPIL tomorrow (long standing invitation for Sunday lunch, which is tempting as no cooking but not conducive to calm bf).

Thanks again, I really appreciate your moral support and really uplifting stories :) You should all be so proud of yourselves - from this side it seems like the most amazing thing in the world that you've managed.

You are the one who is doing amazing - you're my new bfing heroine!

If he's cracked the left side you are 50% of the way there (or 100% of the way there - some women feed one sided - something to consider if he doesn't take to the right which v v v occasionally happens). You can try rugby ball hold on the right side later on if he's still resistant - it 'tricks' baby in to thinking they are feeding on the preferred side.

Def. keep up the pumping - I know it can be a pain in the arse but when you've cracked the latching on you so will be grateful as baby then won't have to work to get up the supply whilst figuring out feeding.

Tell the ILs that they can come next week - you probably won't be the hostest with the mostest this weekend (unless your PIL likes semi-naked DILs ).

Your action plan sounds good. Don't be fobbed off and get your appointments.

If you are having a wobble between now and when you get to see HV/MW over 'is DS feeding well' relook at the Jack Newman videos of good feeding to compare. Also think 'suck, suck, suck, pause, suck, suck, suck, pause'. Every pause is a swallow of a mouthful of milk.

If you feel like there is fluttery suckling with no swallowing happening - that is generally a baby signalling the end of a feed and time to try the other side.

Aww shucks

He's definitely got the hang of the left boob. He has a looooong pause between each triple suck but the general rhythm is as per the videos.

Thanks for the ruby ball hold suggestion, I hadn't thought of that so we'll have a bash at that at the next feed.

Really it's my DS who's the star - he's complaining a bit, but if I get enough milk into him via spoon before we start he seems quite game to have a suck.

The main thing I'm worried about with one-sided feeding is that I'm lopsided anyway and he's decided to favour my bigger boob. I don't want to end up a 36DD on one side and stay my usual 36B on the other. Would I need to keep pumping the other side to even myself up?

Re the PIL, we'd be going to them, but as I still have a huge bruise on my bum I'm not keen even if we weren't trying the bf. And they are naturists so no, they wouldn't mind a half-naked DIL haha :)

Sounds like you are doing great!

Whereabouts in france are you? If anywhere near Orange, there's a great bf counsellor I can recommend there.

Keeping expressing on your right side would help keep you even-ish and you would have a ready made freezer stash for all night partying or for mixing with solids when you start (bm can keep for up to 6 months in a -18C freezer especially if it's not your day-to-day freezer but your overflow/long term storage freezer).

BUT if you wanted to wind down pumping gradually (to avoid mastitis- last thing you need!) there's nothing that says you have to lactate on both sides equally. Personally I'd not stop just yet as DS may well surprise you and start feeding from it. As well as rugby ball hold you could try when he's sleepy or seems fairly content on just left side.

Just keep an eye on the wet and pooey nappies. 6-8 wet nappies a day and at least one poo a day (not to worry if he skips a day IF he's doing lots of wet nappies) more poos is also normal - some babies go after every feed

Again, lots of luck and don't forget tomorrow you will have THREE servants to cook, clean and look after you Keep us posted.

Thanks again for the support and the suggestions. I'm currently pumping after our first successful feed without having spoon fed before to get him to calm down. Bit of a struggle (and DH got shouted at, oops) but here's hoping we're on the up.

Thanks for the offer ib but I'm in the South-West. Have you any experience of the PMI puericultrices? The letter they sent me says they can help with bf problems but I don't know if they have any special training.

My double pump only works if both sides are hooked up so I'm still pumping both for the moment (and that freezer stash sounds good!). Since 48 hours I've been pumping enough to give him only breast milk and since then he's indeed pooing at every feed!

I've definitely not given up on the other side yet but I think I'm going to need more help with it as the rugby ball hold didn't fool him and he's not at all interested in that boob - crying fit if I try to start him off on it, snoring if I try to tempt him after the first one.

Thanks again truth

Fenouille - Glad to hear DS has had his first full bf, that's fantastic progress. The loads of poo is really promising news for you to be able to bf exclusively off one side - though I know both sides is what would be easiest sometimes we take what we can get with babies, don't we?

What pump do you have? Some pumps have little flaps to cover one of the output points so you can pump one sided or you could just hook up both pumps and only use one.

Was DS a ventouse or forceps delivery? Sometimes babies can get twisted in the womb as well and lying/feeding on one side can hurt them so they refuse to feed on that side. It sounds a bit 'alternative' but are there any chiropractors or oesteopaths in your local area?

DD1 had a twisted neck/torso from a ventouse delivery and whilst it didn't effect her feeding she seemed happier after it was manipulated out (I stopped going to the chiro though after the receptionist told me they could cure her asthma so I'd only recommend going for bone/muscle related reasons not woo related reasons!)

Re the pump, I'm going to have to see if I can find a plug to stopper the other side (it's a Kittet and judging by the name - this stupid French thing of abbreviating proper words, in this case Qui Tête - it's probably not commonly used outside of the hexagon and is possibly a bit crap).

DS was a forceps delivery and we already have a rdv with a child specialist cranial osteopath. It's THE big thing here - even recommended by the hospital - so we thought it wouldn't hurt to get him looked over as I was also wondering if the birth might have had something to do with the preference. OTOH he might just be able to tell that I'm more comfortable holding him this way than on the other side.

But LOL at yours telling you he could cure asthma. I'm pretty sure noone would bat an eyelid at that here. My friend got given exercises by hers to do to help the baby cope with her (friend's) grief after someone she knew died shortly after her son was born. 'Scuse me while I go and roll my eyes for a bit...

We've now done two exclusive bf, but it's taking me upwards of half-an-hour each time to get him latched on. I hope we're going to get quicker as I'm starting to get a pretty strong let down which not only is quite uncomfortable until he starts sucking, but also ends up with me leaking all over him. I'm going to try hand expressing a small amount before latching next time to see if that helps.

No, I don't - I got my bfc's from a LLL woman - I called one of their English speaking supporters and she put me in touch. Maybe worth getting in touch?

here

Thanks for the link ib. All the LLL ladies are German around here for some reason. I've already spent an evening with one of the local coordinators but I have to admit I didn't feel all that comfortable with her, don't know why particularly. I think I'll wait to see who I can get hold of tomorrow before calling LLL again.

Down to a 10 minute latch but I waited until he as really grumbling with hunger.

Hi Fenouille,

Hang in there. I had all these probs when relactating. Up to half an hour at a time to latch definately. It's so frustrating, I just took one feed at a time.

My DS would also only latch one side at first. After 2 weeks he eventually started on the other, but continued with a preference for sometime after. Everything evened itself out in the end just keep offering both sides. I didn't always express the other side, which is naughty but once you've spent half an hour latching, then half an hour feeding and you only have an hour tops before you start again - it's tricky :)

I used to feed him alot when he was sleepy, just before or after a nap and never waited until he was really hungry as he was more cooperative. I basically never let him go more than 2 hours without offering a bf, even if he just latches for a few minutes and has a drink or sucks for comfort it all helps.

Hope all goes well today :)

Thanks for sharing your experience pombal it makes me feel a lot more normal! :)

OK, now I know long latch times and one sided feeding are "normal" I'll stop worrying quite so much. DS won't latch at all if he's not good and ready (i.e. hungry) but as soon as he starts waking I pick him up and keep my boobs close so hopefully he'll speed up soon.

At least he's only waking every 2.5 - 3 hours so I can pump in peace and still have a little time for myself. I guess that will change at some point too.

DH told PIL we wouldn't be coming for lunch (just as well as DS fed right over midday) and FIL apparently considers that we really should be able to cope with going out by now grrr. They have been over almost every day since his birth and called every morning at 9am and we cancel one lunch and we're the unreasonable ones? /rant

I love them really but they're a bit smothering. And DS is their first GC on this continent so I guess they're just a bit over excited. I'd better have some more chocolate and relax :)

How's it going today? Still going ok?

Hi truth It's been a busy week but thanks for thinking of us.

We spent one and a half hours with my midwife today discussing bf as DS's weight has stagnated since last week. We checked position and latch and she got us going on the 'other' boob. He fed for over an hour so now I'm feeling bad as I've been practically starving him since last week when we started bf after 10 days of bottles. He never complained after feeding but it seems like I could have been getting a lot more down him.

Anyway, midwife was very supportive and I'm going back next week to check on progress. Going to keep pumping to stimulate supply and top him up with expressed milk via syringe for the next few days to give him a bit of a boost.

DS enjoyed his visit to the osteopath but don't really think it did all that much.

Thanks again for all the support. It kept us going last week and even if there was some improvement needed it was great to make sure we started in the right direction.

PS for any one who may be reading this in France: the PMI is a waste of time, find yourself a good sage-femme libérale and pediatrician instead :)