what time of day is best to express?

[ethelina]

for 1 feed for DH to give? Also what feed is it best that he does?

My son is 8 weeks old and feeding very well. Since week 2 DH has really enjoyed the closeness of giving a feed late at night or in the night. I have been expressing a bottle each morning after the 10ish am feed and so far this has been fine.

My HV came today for his check and asked about feeding. She said it might be better if I expressed in the evening instead and that the best feed for DH to give would be first thing in the morning, as my body recalculates the milk supply overnight this would make sure I maintain a good supply.

At present I have a good supply and no issues surrounding feeding, but she said that it might become a problem over the next few weeks as supply starts to settle. I might have problems with supply during the evening and overnight if I continue dropping the 10pm or 3am feed, and keep pumping during the morning, DS would then have difficulty settling due to low milk volume at night.

I am well aware that I wont actually run out of milk but does she have a point? Would evening expressing for a bottle first thing rather than last thing make sense?

I always found I had pints in the morning so expressing was easier then.

Night feeds are important to BF, the HV is right there. Expressing first thing in the morning was always easiest for me but any time is fine. Expressing in the evening (when supply is lower) is generally harder work for most women.

If the bottle is going to be a regular thing then the bedtime feed or dream feed (usually at your bedtime) would probably be best. I wouldn't want to cut out a night feed at 8 weeks on a permanent basis because of potential damage to supply, although an occasional night feed wouldn't be a problem.

I would continue expressing in the morning if it's easy for you and maybe add another expressing session in the evening to see how it goes. Perhaps you could express at 9pm to 'replace' the night feed in your body's rhythm?

I don't think it can be quite right what she's saying about the milk supply though. Plenty of babies go longer at night early on without mother's having problems with supply. It makes no difference which feed you 'drop'. And when DS drops a night feed your supply will take that into account. Milk is produced as you feed, as well as between feeds....

Well yes Frak, thats what I thought too about which feed goes.
I generally do the last feed at night and DH gets up for 2-3am (his choice!) and i feed again at about 5am-ish when boobs are very full.
Fermina DS is starting to stretch his feeds out so the 2-3am feed is getting later, running almost into the 5am feed anyway so i think the middle feed is going to disappear of its own accord. Given that is most often the one i dont do anyway, i cant see any real change in what my boobs expect. Do you think I should encourage the 2-3am feed to stay?

frakkinup - I have to disagre - Prolactin (milk production hormone) levels are highest at night (IIRC between 2 and 5 or some such), night feeds are important. There's a big difference between the baby dropping night feeds and a demanded night feed being replaced with EBM in terms of supply.

x posts. As long as you demand feed at night then baby dropping / moving night feeds isn't an issue for supply.

Xpost Fermina - If i keep the middle feed should DH do 10pm as he would obviously prefer or 5am which the HV thinks is better? And if DS stops asking for one of them, which is best to drop?

Haha 1 fingered typing is so slow...

5am feed for DP because it'll give you significant benefit which the 10pm one wont (unless you go to bed really early).

Any feed your DS drops is fine, regardless of the time, he know best about that!

Babies do stretch out and drop the feeds of their own accord - depending on the rhythm that's been established it doesn't matter whether they decide they don't want to have the 10pm feed or the 3am feed. A few babies I've worked with have established a consistent 3 hourly feed during the day and 4 hourly at night very early on - days old rather than weeks, effectively dropping a feed from a straight 3 hourly cycle. Others cluster feed from say 6-10pm and then drop a 1am feed and go through til 3am. Others just drop a 1am or 3am (depending if usually 3 or 4 hourly) at 6 weeks.

Therefore it wouldn't make sense to me for the HV to assert so strongly that dropping night feeds is a huge issue.

I've always said to feed on demand during the night so if baby is happy to push the 2/3am feed later then let it go IMO. It's establishing a good long sleep period and over time that will get longer and longer.

I'm not a fan of fixing a feed that's done by EBM though but usually night feed on a cycle to let the mother get at least 6 hours uninterrupted sleep most nights nights. So one night BF at 10pm, EBM at 1am, BF at 3am allowing mother to sleep through to first morning feed, the next EBM at 10pm and BFs at 1am and 3am, the next BFs at 10pm and 1am with an EBM at 3am. That's based on 3 hourly but you can see how it works... If the bottle was given at 10pm then I did encourage the mother to add an expressing session before bed. If a feed was fixed then it would be the 10pm one on that basis.

Thank you I will suggest that to him and see his reaction... (He'll do it! He wont like it but he'll do anything if its right with no argument at all!)

Last reply was to Fermina.
Frak I think I will carry on as before but add an express if DS has ebm at 10pm. The 2-3am feed is going I think so I wont worry about it and go with the flow.
Im getting a headache now. .

Best thing to do tbh! Babies know when they want to feed and your body adjusts to that.

You know when expressing is easiest for you so listen to your body.

Each baby is different, which is what made me slightly at your HV being so prescriptive.

between 3am and 5am is the best tim to express.

Not very practical but the hormones that produce milk are most active in the middle of the night.

I've had to do it when ds2 was in scbu and i can confirm you get waaaay more milk in the dead of night.

So although you obviously won't be pumping at this time you really should be feeding your baby at that feed to ensure your supply stays strong so i'd recommend not letting dh give a bottle in the middle of the night. Evenings are important for cluster feeding which also boosts supply so i'd personally let dh feed in the morning while you pump (saves time and keeps the rythm going) or in the early evening (plenty of time for your baby to 'top up' before bed if he hasn't had enough)

Nonononono my mind is exploding! If i asked 50 people i would get 50 replies!!

Thank you Summer I will consider early evening.

Frak I didnt answer her except to smile and nod. Wasnt prepared to start an argument without some facts.

2 Mantras:

Every baby is different.

If it works for your baby and for you then it works and you don't question it!

Honestly, carry on as you're happy with and if any problems do arise then you can identify and deal with them but don't stress yourself out unnecessarily.

50 people will have 50 different experiences based on at least 100 babies (if you're saying that it's 2 each) and probably closer to 150 if you count that some people have had 3 and others have looked after lots

I was taught most of what I know by someone who's now looked after over 1000 babies when she was the maternity nanny if a nanny job I did before I went into maternity nursing. IMO that much experience saying 'every baby is different' and 'do what works even if it's not 'right'' isn't wrong. It's not failed me yet and I'm hoping it won't fail me with my own...

Yes you're right and sensible. i mostly ignore well meaning 'advice' but this one just stuck with me cos i dont want my supply to become a problem.

Good luck with yours when they come along

That'll be April I hope

Then I'll have my maternity nanny guru on speed dial to tell me every baby is different and if it works for your baby and for you then it works and you don't question it

ethelina my baby is 11 weeks old and we di almost exactly the same thing and have done since she was 4 weeks - no problems with supply here. It is now almost always the 10pm feed for 3 reasons - a)DD is sleeping longer so often the night feed is 4am-5am which we thought was too close to DH getting up at 6.45am b) it got to the point where she would happily take the bottle but would need a boob top-up to get back to sleep - not really giving me a rest at all and finally c) DH giving her a bottle between 10pm and 11pm massively cuts down on evening cluster feeding which had been going on til midnight and beyond.

If it works for you, go with it!

Frak

Yes bellygazing thats just exactly it! DH also gets up at 6.15am and the 5am feed isnt really fair. Do you express at 10pm when DD is having bottle as suggested earlier?