Why is 2 and a half week old DD (ebf) doing this? And other bf questions....

[legallyblond]

Hi there

Hoping you can help me with some bf questions, one in particular... (anyone else find the nhs gloriously promotes ebf on demand but offers NO practical advice about it?!) I feel totally clueless!

Generally, so far so good with ebf my lovely newborn (2 weeks and 2 days) DD: latch seems fine I think as my nipples are still intact and DD is gaining weight beautifully (8lb 4 at birth to 8lb 12 in 10 days!).

I think I have a fast let-down - milk literally pours out if its been a while since the last feed and DD occasionally chokes when feeding (although thats getting better). Also, it may be that she's just a snacker, but DD never really feeds for more than 10 mins and often seems to be able to get what she needs in 6 mins. That said, after a short feed, she might be hungrey again say 40 mins later and I give her the other side.

1. My main question is something DD does that I just don't undersatnd. During what I think are cluster feeds in the evening (or else they are just snacks between which DD doesn't want to be put down), she does this thing where she roots and gives all her usual hunger cues and also cires (which she doesn't usually do as I feed her before its gets to that stage). However, when i try to feed, its as if the nipple isn't there - she just get angry and starts pounding and scratching my boob. Sometimes perseverence works - after 2 or 3 mins she does latch on and feeds. Sometimes its distractions - DH will take her and she seems to "forget" she's hungry for a while and then want a feed say 20 mins later. Sometimes she just gives up while there, against the breast, and falls asleep!! What is this? What is she trying to say here? She seems so cross and hungry, but won't feed. It doesn't happen too much (maybe 2 or 3 times in an evening), but any advice? Its really upsetting!

1. Sorry to ask more questions... this is to do with swapping sides... I assume that, as most of DD's feeds are so short and sweet, its fine to just feed from one side. If, after one of her six minute jobs, I offer her the other side when she comes off, she just ignores it!

If I do swap sides (which i do for longer feeds), which side do I start from next? The opposite boob to the one I started on, or the oppostite boob to the one I finished on, IYSWIM?

1. I assume that at 2 and a half weeks, it is still normal for there to be absolutly no routine...? I guess I always imagined a feed every 3 hours or so... but DD just feeds whenever, with seemingly no routine at all! It gets easier though, doesn't it....?

And when should I start to introduce a bedtime bath/feeding routine? I do keep lights off and don't talk to DD while feeding during the night in an attempt to teach her that its nighttime, but not sure she realises yet!

1. Finally, for nighttime feeds, sometimes I am just so tired and DD doesn't fall asleep instantly after the feed, that I sort of slouch so I am half lying doen and drape DD so her head is on my boob and her body across my body to get her to sleep (gravity holds her in place - its like the biological nurturing positions on the LLL leaflets)... but then I fall asleep . I then wake an hour later, which is pointless as its nearly time (usually) for another feed so she won't settle in her moses basket. This is bad, isn't it...? What should I do?

Please excuse such a long post and so many questions - I am a novice at this!

hi.

sorry, am bfing so brief answers, but i am sure others will be along soon.

well done on the new baby!

1. normal newborn fussing. poor things, they don't know what to do with themselves, especially in the evenings. you are handling it really well.

1. sounds a good way to do it, yes. if you have used both, i start with the last ine used, iyswim?

1. normal. it gets WAY easier in time. bathtime routine - whenever, there is no rush. lights off, etc, is all you need to do during the night. their bodies learn night and day from light/dark and that will come too.

1. everyone falls asleep bfing. it is the only way to survive. personally, i'd go with it, rather than spend ages trying to get her into a basket. tiny babies need their parent for survival so it makes sense for them to want to be on you to begin with..

you are doing really well. it is worth sticking out. i love bfing at 5 mths. ffed ds1 and have to say after the first few weeks, bfing is miles easier.

Thanks nicky - my post was also one handed while bf - hence the typos!

you managed capitals though!

Can you bf your dd lying down? Took me a while to get the hang of it, but once I did night feeds were so much easier. Doesn't matter now if I fall asleep before ds finishes feeding.

I was always terrible at remembering which side I fed from last, even now I have to give them a little poke to see which one's fullest.

As for routine, I'd forget it til at least 6-8 weeks. My ds has a feeding routine now (11 weeks) but it's more like 2.5 hourly and is very flexible. Sometimes he's hungry after an hour so I feed him. We started bath and bed around 8 weeks too.

often newborns struggle with fast let down. both mine did.

try catching the initial flow in a muslin or cup, only letting her latch on when flow eases.

also don't swap sides too frequently as this will increase your milk supply and flow rate. let her go back on last boob for next feed until it feels completely empty then offer fuller breast.

it will all settle at about 12 weks.

I have a fast letdown and two of my three as babies were bothered by it, and yep, did the whole head banging, thrashing thing. I agree with nightshades advice, I would also add in making sure you wind your baby during and after feeds as they can take in a lot of air with a fast letdown and also doing evening feeds in a dimly lit room, with no TV on. Both my fussy at the breast babies were generally unsettled and easily oversimulated and needed some peace and quiet of an evening.

Also, they both wanted to comfort suck, but neither could comfort suck at my boob as the milk just kept coming. I am not suggesting that you give a dummy, but sometimes they want to suck so root but then get het up as it was just a comfort suckle they wanted really and not a deluge. Both my ended up as thumb suckers. But again calming and soothing them in other ways as you are doing may be necessary.

well done for staying calm! It's pretty intense at this stage...

first up remember that feeding or not, your baby is happiest right next to you, so that might explain some of what she's telling you.

Please don't worry about bad habits, rids for your back etc etc etc. I think it's all a load of rubbish, as DS has been a joy and I've done lots of the "rod for your own back" stuff. It's called nurturing !

It does get easier.

Feeding lying down might be helpful (as opposed to co-sleeping which is also fine when done safely but I always tried to pop DS back in his cot if I could get away with it and if I woke up before he did...feeding lying down demonstrated here

1. My 18 week old has been doing this all evening. But it did get better for many weeks. In the meantime just go with it. Let her sleep on your breast for as long as she wants and distract her if fussing. Buy some new books and DVDs to while the time away.

1. I still only generally give one side. If I offer the other she gorges herself comfort sucking then chucks it back up.

1. We only really started a proper routine 2 or 3 weeks ago. Now it's all gone to pot (see 1) - trying not to stress. They all get there eventually.

1. I wish someone had told me it was normal to fall asleep breastfeeding. I worried myself senseless about it and ended up giving bottles in the night to avoid it. I have tried feeding lying down but I don't get on with it so I do what you do, ie recline back and let gravity hold her. I also have a bedside cot so I don't need to worry about her falling on the floor. I still prefer not to fall asleep though!

Sounds like you're doing brilliantly! Good for you!

DS did number 1 and eventually we discovered that he would be happy if given a finger to suck. It was like he wanted the comfiort of bf but not the milk. My fingers got sore so I got him a dummy after a couple of nights of this.

I have just realised that often the fussing, head bobbing etc that you mention co-incides with either a poo or a big belch! (it's taken me 7 weeks to work this out!).

I also do the falling asleep - we are supposed to be getting him used to his moses basket, but I keep scuppering that.

Just echoing what the others say really - DD is 5.5 weeks and has been doing the manic head bobbing at some point most evenings for a couple of weeks. Last night we had 8 hours of it . DS also used to do this and I would say it's generally worse on days when they've had a lot of stimulation. I try to keep her on one side as much as possible before swapping over to avoid vomiting/excessive wind. But I agree that it's bloody maddening, rooting constantly then refusing the breast. I often pass her to DP at this stage because she seems to root less with him, presumably she doesn't expect to suck when he has her.

Re routine - you've got aaaaaages before I would bother worrying about that. If you are lucky enough to persuade her into a routine at this stage, chances are she'll totally change her ways in a week or two anyway. Sorry!

My feeling re night feeds is that planned co-sleeping is safer than accidental co-sleeping, so if you're going to regularly fall asleep feeding I would arrange the bed so you can sleep together safely, by feeding lying down on your side. We have a cotbed sidecar arrangement, and although DD doesn't often make it back in there after a feed it means we have extra room to stretch out (given for much of the night I am also sharing my bed with a 3 year old and DP!)

Huge congratulations. This bit is the hard bit. In a few months you'll find things easier :)