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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

oooooh ! Breastfeeding is SO fucking infuriating, I just doin't get it !!!

35 replies

OnEdge · 17/09/2010 23:15

I have just had my 3rd baby 4 weeks ago and have been expressing and feeding her my milk out of a bottle. I have such problems with latching on and everything that this is right for me.

Today, I thought I would try her on my breast, and she did great, latched on, was swallowing, then she falls asleep. After a while I try to put her down (I have a 3 and a 1 year old to sort out) As soon as I put her down she cries a hungry cry. So I breast feed her again and she goes for it, it goes so well, then flop ! Asleep again. After 10 minutes, i try to put her down and he same thing.

She would have me do this all day. How am I supposed to do anything?

It really drives me mad, why don't they have a feed? She feeds from the bottle ok.

OP posts:
HeadFairy · 17/09/2010 23:19

ds was the same, such a sleepy little boy, feeding him would take in excess of 2 hours. Ok when it's your first but impossible when you've got other children to worry about. Have you tried undressing her a bit so she's a bit more awake? I used to blow on ds's face to wake him up, rub is ear lobes, basically everything I could to get him to stay awake and keep feeding.

Original poster
OnEdge · 17/09/2010 23:22

I'm just tii impatient, will carry on expressing and bottle feeding. It brought back horrid memories of trying and failing last time. Now I know why i decided to do it my way, How many other children do youy have?

OP posts:
Original poster
OnEdge · 17/09/2010 23:23

Oh I remember, you have a little blonde boy, looked at your pics earlier, he looks so happy !

OP posts:
HeadFairy · 17/09/2010 23:28

I have a dd as well as my ds... thankfully she's a speed feeder, always been fast. But ds was a shocker. I do think there's a lot of mind games in bfing too, the more frustrated I got with it, the slower the let down and ds used to fall asleep as soon as the milk flow slowed down. On the recommendation of a very laid back BFC I used to have a glass of wine in the evening and just chill out and feed him all evening to get his fill and it made a huge difference to the way I approached it (I was probably half drunk :o)

Now with dd my let down is very fast, so that's probably why she feeds faster, but she gets so little milk during the day because she's so distracted by ds that I'm still having to get up a couple of times a night to feed her.

One thing I did find though, I used to express for ds and looking back I think that made things worse for me... partly because it affected my milk supply and partly because I think ds got used to the faster supply of milk from a bottle and would just get bored with my slow let down.

WoTmania · 18/09/2010 08:18

maybe it isn't about the milk but a desire to be close to you? Have you tried popping the baby in a sling while you see to the older DC?

WoTmania · 18/09/2010 08:19

or breast compressions to get more milk in, faster if you are sure it's hunger?

LaTristesse · 18/09/2010 08:29

I second the sling suggestion - so handy - you can do pretty much anything while bub feeds at her leisure. We also used breast compression at the start to get my sleepy feeder to take more - it worked a treat.

However if expressing works best for you and your lifestyle keep going with that method - it's great your baby is getting all the benefits of your milk in a way that suits you and your other children!

MoonFaceMama · 18/09/2010 09:09

I third a sling you can feed in. (smile)

jemjabella · 18/09/2010 09:41

How shocking that a newborn baby would hate to be separated from the one thing that has kept it alive for the past 9 months Hmm

I fourth the recommendation of a sling.

organiccarrotcake · 18/09/2010 13:32

Good on you for keeping going with the breastmilk. Expressing takes commitment! If she's latching well now you may find that easier. Many babies don't like to be put down, especially when she's so young and it's sooo hard, especially when you have other kids.

I have a 6 year old an an 11 week old who, like yours, wouldn't be put down. It's not so much the feeding as the need to be near you. She is probably so relaxed at the breast, warm and comforted next to her mummy, she just drifts off then it's a shock when you're suddenly not there. I found undressing mine to his nappy woke him enough for a good feed, but no matter what he wouldn't be put down. About 8-10 weeks in we found he'd be ok for 5-10 minutes and it's slowly built up from there. I carried him in a sling most of the time so I could do things and deal with my older boy. But basically once I accepted that this was the baby I had, and gave myself a break, it was easier. But having two very young children must be really tough.

I suspect that undressing her will help keep her awake while feeding, and it's possible that she's used to a faster "letdown" with the bottle and isn't really waiting for your milk to come through, but practise and keeping going with what you're doing will help. Pop her in a sling after a feed and you can deal with your other kids. Something like a stretchy wrap would be ideal - Kari-me or MAM wraps are great.

I know how tough it is with one older child, and mine is old enough to understand. But it will get better, I promise. Can you rope in your partner or a friend to hold her for a while for you while you focus on the others?

CantSleepWontSleep · 18/09/2010 13:35

It's perfectly normal. Put her in a sling to free you up to deal with the others and you will almost certainly find that she sleeps happily there.

organiccarrotcake · 18/09/2010 13:40

Normal - true - but it doesn't make it easier :(

I think the critical things are to work out ways to manage while it's going on (sling is the very best option) and to keep pushing through as it will get better. In just a few weeks you will look back and realise how much things have improved.

Original poster
OnEdge · 18/09/2010 22:58

jembjebella How shocking that I have two other kids that I need to also care for. Thanks for the unsupportive sarcastic comments. Hope you got your little superiority buzz out of that one HmmHmmHmm

OP posts:
Original poster
OnEdge · 18/09/2010 23:06

I do use a kari me sling, but I can't feed her whilst she is in it because I have large breasts, it is impossible. I use the sling while she sleeps and I go about my day, the only time she is is "put down" is during the night so that i can sleep. The MW said that it is not safe to sleep with her in my bed if i am not actually breast feeding, so I have to place her in the moses basket then, also when i am cooking, i can't have her in the sling, and when I take 1 year old out because he sometimes needs picking up and I can't do it with her in the sling.

I did spend the first 3 weeks with husband off work allowing me to to totally indulge her while he looked after the other two. This allowed us time to bond and establish our little feeding sleeping routine (baby led) Now he has gone back to work and term has started I am adapting to the reality of how it is going to be.

OP posts:
organiccarrotcake · 18/09/2010 23:22

Oh you poor thing :( I don't know how to feed in a wrap sling - can't see how it can be done although in theory it can be. You could try going to a sling meet to see if someone could work it out. I also have large boobies and would love to know how to do it Grin.

I thought you were breastfeeding so don't understand what your MW means. Having her in your bed is safe if you follow the co-sleeping guidelines. Make sure she can't fall out, don't co-sleep if anyone in your house smokes, don't co-sleep if you've been drinking or taking drugs, have you between your husband and your baby, don't use a duvet. BFing mums instinctively protect their babies while sleeping, apparently.

But that's not what you originally posted about. All I can say to you, and it doesn't solve the problem, is that yes, this is reality now but it will improve, and quickly. You're doing an amazing job looking after 3 very young children and it will be hell from time to time (or mostly!) but it will get better, I promise. You sound like you have a supportive hubby which is wonderful :)

You have a lot of support here.

CakeandRoses · 18/09/2010 23:32

I had the same problem during night feeds with DD (now 7 weeks).

The only way I could keep her awake enough was to undress her and do a nappy change (or pretend to) and keep her undressed until after the feed (this was the sage advice from MN!) It worked great. I haven't needed to bother fully undressing her in the last week or so.

Original poster
OnEdge · 19/09/2010 00:38

the MW said its only safe to co sleep if breastfeeding, i'm not sure if what i am doing counts (bottle feeding breast milk)

I am ok doing this, just wonder why they sleep when on the breast but not when having a cuddle skin to skin but drinking from a bottle.

OP posts:
princesslina · 19/09/2010 09:13

The oxytocin (hormone produced to help your milk let down when baby suckles at breast) is probably what makes baby so sleepy! I have seen babies literally zonk off to sleep after several sucks as you describe and then when you take them off the breast after a while they wake up starving!! Put them back on and the same thing happens! I agree with another poster to remove a layer of babies clothes, tickle their feet etc to try and keep them more wakeful.

MumNWLondon · 19/09/2010 09:15

I never managed to feed in a sling (feel asleep and didn't want to say latched on), but my DD was also sleepy feeder.... even though it was november I fed her in a nappy only and stroked jaws/toes/tummy etc to keep her sucking. If she did fall asleep I either changed her nappy or stuck her in her bouncy chair and did something else until she woke up (usually fast as she was only wearing a nappy). I abandoned each feed an hour after I started (ie just let her sleep).

It got easier as she got bigger as she fell asleep less.

jemjabella · 19/09/2010 10:10

I wasn't attempting to be 'superior'.

FWIW Dr James McKenna's safe co-sleeping guidelines make no mention of the requirement of breastfeeding... www.nd.edu/~jmckenn1/lab/pamphlets/BSlpSafeEnglish.pdf

Original poster
OnEdge · 19/09/2010 11:04

I think that it is to do with this

"Breastfeeding moms can't get any deep sleep anyway: Lactation women are hormonally programmed not to have the fourth and deepest sleep cycle, possibly to be able to tune in to the waking cycles of our babies"

She said that if not breast feeding, I would sleep differently so not safe.

She told me on discharge, like it was something she had to tell me such as sleeping on back etc.

OP posts:
mrsgordonfreeman · 19/09/2010 11:17

Oh, silly midwife.

If you were to co sleep you might find that your baby would feed like that, thus making you breastfeed at night!

It might be worth a go, just to see what happens?

DD was the same, infuriatingly slow at feeding (used breast compressions, feet tickling etc.), but she 'got it' at about 8 weeks and suddenly feeds took 10 minutes rather than 2 hours. So it may well improve but I appreciate that it's tough when you have other little ones.

Her cousin feeds beautifully and has from birth Envy

organiccarrotcake · 19/09/2010 11:17

But you are breastfeeding! Even if you are expressing, you are lactating.

How did you get on last night? I was thinking of you at 6.30 last night Hmm because it occured to me that you maybe wanted to feed in the sling. A ring sling may work for you?

WoTmania · 19/09/2010 11:43

Dr James McKenna iirc doesn't recommend cosleeping unless fully BF. So, actually, your MW is right.
It's more to do with the positioning in bed and the orientation of the baby.
Babies who are feeding from the breast tend to be at boob height in the bed and turn to the breast. Bottle-feed baby (whether FF or EBM) tend to be placed higher up, on or near pillows and so are more at risk. as they get older they also tend to crawl around the bed rather than just staying close to the breast as BF babies do. This is a Breastfed/Bottle fed rather than BF/FF issue.
HTH
OnEdge, you havemy aympathies. FWIW I think you are doing a fab job considering the obstacles you've come up against.

WoTmania · 19/09/2010 11:44

also, as a BF mother you lie in such a waway as to 'protect' the baby from moving up or down in the bed.