Breast milk supply getting lower and DS feeding more at night

[tinylion]

I have a 18 week old DS and a 3 year old DD. I've found my DS hates to be breastfed during the day - he squirms and fidgets when I try to put him in the "across" or "football" bf holds and the only way I can get him to do a decent bfeed is to lie down. How can I get him to enjoy lying across me again? He starts to cry even when I lower him into my lap - he much prefers to be over one shoulder staring at the world.

He's so distractible, so when I'm out and about (often with school runs and play dates) I use formula in a bottle. I give around 2 bottles a day and the rest of the time bfeed.

He's beginning to "reverse cycle" in that he will wake up more in the night to feed as he's having shortened feeds during the day as he will NOT concentrate on his bottle or boob. Even more irritatingly is that when he wakes up in the morning about 7am he's not hungry as he's fed a lot during the night!

Help! I've read KellyMom about the distractible baby - my milk supply is getting lower and I really don't want it to yet. He's only little and I really want to bfeed up to a year.

How can I stop this gradual reduction in bmilk? My right boob is a lot smaller than the left as he much prefers lefty, and sometimes righty only gets a feed once or twice in 24 hours.

I have a very busy toddler and a generally busy life. I know a babymoon period would be excellent but I can't really take a whole day to sit with my DS as my toddler daughter would be sooo jealous and she needs to be out and about.

I need some more of your excellent advice please on how to cope with a terribly distractible baby, how to get him to enjoy his bfeeds again, with the "across" hold, to stop my bmilk reducing and to stop him feeding so much at night! Thank you!

The feeding at night will boost yr supply at least. Knackering as it is

My ds was like this- v distractible and difficult to feed. I got a great deal of help from bf counsellor. Are there any locally/ drop in clinics or support groups you could go along to? I remember finding it helpful to check how I was positioning ds- changing this as he grew was a big help

well.... the more formula you give the less milk you are telling your body to make. so i would at least cut down on that, if not cut it out completely.

try fitting a few daytime feeds in upstairs in a quiet/dark room. or maybe downstairs lying on the sofa with curtains closed. put a dvd or something on for your older child.

otherwise.... just grin and bear it. it does get better!!!

I am having to BF my DS2 lying down as much as possible for similar reasons, although would rather he just had a quick feed that used formula top ups when we are out and about - find that if I do 3 quick feeds within an hour period then he last the same as a full feed. I also find it impossible to fed him with DD or DS1 in the room as they just distract him. We do have a routine which makes it easier to anticipate things although of course it varies day to day.

7am up and BF in bed lying down before i get the older DC up
8.45-9.30 sleep
9.30 feed
11.30 feed lying down, want to make sure he drinks a lot so he sleeps well
12-2 sleep
2pm feed
4pm feed - upright as dc back from school
4-4.45 sleep
6.15pm feed - start off sitting while older DC have their baths, move to lying down while older DC watch DVD before bed
7pm bed
10pm dream feed.

re: righty/lefty - I have found that for me righty produces more, so generally try and start feed on lefty to stimulate it.

in the night, if its after 4.30am he only gets offered one breast, then he has the other at 7.30am. If its before 4.30am will give him both sides.

re: playdates - if had to feed might go into another room, lie on floor if need be. take a towel with?

Hi Tiny Lion,

My ds is exactly the same as you describe only he won't have a bottle.

He's too distracted to eat in day - needs dark, quiet room. He prefers the left boob, I have to twist myself around and trick him into having right one. He feeds every 2 hours at night, these are by far the best feeds. He doesn't nap for longer than 30 mins in day.

My supply is getting lower and let down is very slow, adding to frustration. I am getting so stressed and that doesn't help supply / let down. Also his weight has slowed down falling from 9th centile to near 2nd and health visitor isn't helping by telling me he'll end up in hospital and that I should cold turkey him onto a bottle.

I too have a 3 year old and this is so hard with looking after her too. She isn't getting much mummy time righ now.

Do you think putting him on a bottle would help or will I just end up having to do bottles all night long?

If you want to chat more I'm at [email protected]. Seeing as we're going through this at the same time!

Lx

lucygrace, your HV is wrong! sorry, but she is

a drop from the 9th to 2nd isn't really anyttrhing to worry about.
breastfed babies tend to gain weight quickly and then plateau, which sounds like exactly what your son has done

again, the best way to boost supply is to feed frequently. so do as many feeds as you can in a quiet/dark room if necessary. close curtains, pop older child in front of cbeebies for a bit....

it really does pass, i promise

Don't forget that there's a big sleep regression at 4 months which will be adding to the problem of frequent waking, even if they're eating enough during the day.

More info here, here, here and here.

Your boobs feel lighter because the supply has sorted it self out so less engorgement etc. Not because it's dropped. My midwife told me to watch out for this and she was right. Now, at feeding for nearly a year my boobs feel empty a lot of the time but I can squeeze my nips and milk comes out very easily (sorry if TMI).

What you can do is try and get 3 or 4 good feeds in the day by scheduling them around naps - so catch your little ones just before they wake up and pop them on, perhaps use a muslin over their heads to keep them focussed.

Also they have a growth spurt around 4/5 months hence extra feeding.

As for the weight loss - my DS's weight tailed off and dropped a line but he was and is fine.

Also as your baby gets older, you'll have to change the position you hold them in anyway as they are bigger so the "across" hold doesn't work. DS is pretty tall, so he sort of sits on the opposite leg to the boob he's feeding on.

Hi Lucygrace and MumNW,
Glad you've had responses from mumsnetters. I read up loads of info, easily, fast and avidly about breast feeding which is going ok so far for me with DC 2. I wouldn't like to advise you myself. Odd problems for me have been helped by peer support breast feeding groups or our local helpline. Not everyone has the time to read, or find a group, I know. Before you panic, or listen to HVs who are not the experts at this, perhaps try a helpline or keep reading the posts here. It sounds like you're doing ok though. A lot of formula fed babies are getting solids from 4 months, so it's obviously a hungry time in a baby's life, even the ones that get measured amounts of formula very easily, to reassure their parents they're not going short. Hope I'm making sense. Try National Breastfeeding Helpline 0300 100 0212 or La Leche League 0845 120 2918.

Interesting how this is the 4th/5th topic on reverse cycling in 2 days. I do wonder if the changing light levels play havoc with babies, because I know when it was getting v. light out at night my DD went a bit weird for a while.

Anyway, you've already had good advice so I'll leave it at that :)

my 6month ds is doing the same...hunger strike in the day then feeding frenzy at night! am going to try and focus on feed feed feed over the weekend....

He's not showing any signs of suffering from reflux is he? Just wondered as you say he isn't keen on lying down.

Wondered also if you have a powerful let-down which he's struggling with? The fact that he'll feed when you lie down might point to this as the flow is slower when you lie down. I have that problem and I have to take DD off for 30 seconds as I let-down or so she doesn't choke and splutter (then cry) on the tidal wave!

cake you can try block feeding to help tame your letdown (which will most likely be combined with oversupply). Basically use one boob for a block of time - usually start with one boob per feed. If you do already then same side for two feeds in a row.

I did this as my DS hated my letdown and it helped a lot. I ended up using the same side for three feeds in a row.

Igglybuff - that's great advice thank you. I'll try that. I had noticed it was better on the odd time when I put her back on the same side cos she didn't have much on the last feed.

Did you find your other breast got engorged by the time it was due to be fed from tho?

Also, did your DS get less wind when you did this?

DD gets bad wind and reflux (as did DS) and I think it's due to my let-down and torrential flow (bf would only take 10 mins from day 1.)

oh and i usually only feed from one side per feed so not sure that would be a problem?

sorry for hijacking your thread OP

I was the same - fed using one side. So instead of switching every feed I'd switch every other feed. Also I had to position DS so he was more upright and I meant back. Lying down didn't help me at all!

It does sound like a letdown problem. Can you express? If you can possibly express off 1-2 oz before feeding it would reduce the overflow. You can save the expressed milk for bottle feeds and it will help keep your milk up, too.

Thanks all for your advice and reassurance. I have been reading up on reverse cycling and the distractible baby and it is def my little one! I plan to print out the kelly mum info on it to show hv and doc and hopefully get them off my back re his slow weight gain. I have also been emailing one of my local LLL volunteers who understands (in a way that hv def does not!).

I guess I will just have to get used to the frequent night feedings for now. He has never slept well anyway, we had one great week way back when he woke up only once a night. Hopefully it will be a phase that he will eventually get over. Will solids help at all do you think?

I just can't believe hv lack of knowledge on bf issues. A lot of the stress I've had this week could have been avoided if hv actually understood bf.

"Will solids help at all do you think?" - if they do, someone forgot to tell my DD

I also have a distractible baby that doesn't want to feed during the day. I started feeding him once he's already asleep. That makes it a bit slow but I prefer this rather than him screaming in total hunger after 5-6 hours of refusing to drink.

When we are out and about, I usually carry him in the babybjorn and I already learned to feed him while been carried. He seems to prefer an upright position and the babycarrier seems to help him being comfortable. It also helps me to read better his hunger cues.

I hope it gets better for you. I've found it too stressing to feed him while my 3yo DD is being noisy and naughty.

Igglybuff - thanks millions for your suggestion to try block feeding. it's solved all dd's wind and reflux issues! I think i'm in love with you

(sorry again for jumping on your thread op)