Would you live in America?

[HideItClear]

?? Like relocate there from the UK forever. I’m looking for answers from black Mumsnetters with black children only

My job pays way more over there, I could earn more than double the salary I earn here. I feel like there are greater job opportunities there for black people and the racial conversation there seems more advanced because black Americans have been there longer than us black Brits have lived here.
There’s greater progression for black people, Ketanji Jackson was just named SCOTUS for example. There are LOTS of black men and women in top positions so this could provide positive role models for black children there.

The main disadvantage of moving there for me is the fact that I’d have no “community” there and might feel very lonely. African-Americans won’t relate to me because we don’t share the same history and I’m not from there. I won’t really have a defined community the way I do here and I’m worried that my children won’t have that community either. My main concern is them feeling left out and not being able to really fit in anywhere, kind of like how I felt growing up here in the UK.

Can’t tell if the pros outweigh the cons yet. Interested in what other black mums think.

Bumping for you.

No, I wouldn't. For many many reasons. Particularly as although I only have one dc - a girl, I'd be terrified of having to raise a son out there.

I wouldn't.
My family have been in the UK for generations.
Moving to the USA is not for us, for the same reasons you both give.

For me, I could, depending on the state. But although north America has always appealed to us for higher earning potential I like living in the UK so wouldn't seriously consider it.

OP - what's your line of employment?

I'm not keen on the way areas where people live are so segregated in the US (white, Black, Hispanic etc) plus the overt racism. I have one of each DC, so for me it would be a hard no.

Which industry and do you know where in the US you might settle?

For me "No" even though I have extended family and friends in the states I could in theory live near.

If you have ever been "fortunate" enough to work/study in another European country you know how difficult it is to get by day to day for about the first year. Then asap having to find a decent school for a child on top and making sure you live in a good neighbourhood, so you don't screw them up and their life chances on top would be even more stressful if you aren't super rich.

Thinking about it the only black adults I've known who have moved to from UK to the US have been childless. The first person I remember was a teacher when I was 13 and she was early 30s and married. Since then I think everyone has been in their 20s, single and childless.

Now I do know black people who have moved to Canada with their children and it appears to be OK even though Canada is backwards...

Btw I wasn't going to answer this as in my child isn't black. However due to the shit a couple of my black friends have recieved as they aren't 'black enough" according to some white people but the same shade as my child, and the fact every single individual will be regarded as black in the US I have.

I know a few under 35s who have moved. Most cited better pay and they were tired of being passed over on promotion. Another young relative studying engineering wants to move there after graduation becuase of better job prospects and pay. Personally, sometimes I have considered it then they have horrible events happen and it makes you rethink

OP, if I were considering it I would look very hard at the numbers to check out the cost of living, rent/mortgages, healthcare benefits/costs etc as the greater earning power may be eroded by greater living costs depending on your circumstances.

University fees in the US are huge - would your kids have option of going to uni here paying UK national fees rather than overseas student fees? Would they have to be living here again for a few years before being eligible?

The US is a country of immigrants and depending on the state you’ll find black people from around the world who are recently settled. It won’t be the same as being here but you’ll find your community and your kids will too (more or less depending on their age) but it will depend a lot on where you go.

@HideItClear

?? Like relocate there from the UK forever. I’m looking for answers from black Mumsnetters with black children only

My job pays way more over there, I could earn more than double the salary I earn here. I feel like there are greater job opportunities there for black people and the racial conversation there seems more advanced because black Americans have been there longer than us black Brits have lived here.
There’s greater progression for black people, Ketanji Jackson was just named SCOTUS for example. There are LOTS of black men and women in top positions so this could provide positive role models for black children there.

The main disadvantage of moving there for me is the fact that I’d have no “community” there and might feel very lonely. African-Americans won’t relate to me because we don’t share the same history and I’m not from there. I won’t really have a defined community the way I do here and I’m worried that my children won’t have that community either. My main concern is them feeling left out and not being able to really fit in anywhere, kind of like how I felt growing up here in the UK.

Can’t tell if the pros outweigh the cons yet. Interested in what other black mums think.

I can give you a unique perspective as my grandma and other relatives moved to America around the time my parents moved to the UK . For me I've spent many summers with family in New York and Ontario and some who moved to Arkansas.

I'd 100% move to America, not only because I have family there, but because of so many other reasons.

America has an established middle and upper class, you don't get to see them or hear about them much in the UK, but you can attend black universities, work in all black law firms, dentist practices, doctor surgeries , even black investment firms .

Secondly a Black British person, as much as I hate to admit it, is more welcomed by non-blacks than a black American, and the black Americans in turn are very welcome in a way I'm sure black British people look up to black Americans. Black Americans are broad church, so you'll have black Americans whose parents have been slaves or free workers since the 1700's, black Americans whose parents are from the Caribbean like British ones, or Africa like British ones. They are much much more comfortable coming together as black Americans , than say we are as Black British.

For a black British person, America represents massive opportunities

Sorry, that should have read...Black Americans are broad church, so you'll have black Americans whose great great great grandparents have been slaves or free workers since the 1700's,

you can attend black universities, work in all black law firms, dentist practices, doctor surgeries, even black investment firms.

I have tried and tried over decades but, as a second generation (multi-continent) British person I just cannot get my head around what you describe. I can’t imagine it in a multiracial country.

But that’s only one of the reasons why - even with countless extended family members living there - I absolutely could not consider living in the US. Great to visit, and for career purposes - but it wouldn’t work with my personal values.

@CountryCousin

you can attend black universities, work in all black law firms, dentist practices, doctor surgeries, even black investment firms.

I have tried and tried over decades but, as a second generation (multi-continent) British person I just cannot get my head around what you describe. I can’t imagine it in a multiracial country.

But that’s only one of the reasons why - even with countless extended family members living there - I absolutely could not consider living in the US. Great to visit, and for career purposes - but it wouldn’t work with my personal values.

As opposed to what we have in Europe, where in the Ukraine refugees are welcomed in unlimited numbers but black people who have been here since they were children are illegally deported.

I know very few black people that even feel comfortable calling themselves British.

Those things are constantly at the forefront of my mind, cheekyduck.

But I just have a different idea of an ideal society.

I have tried and tried over decades but, as a second generation (multi-continent) British person I just cannot get my head around what you describe. I can’t imagine it in a multiracial country.

Have you considered looking into the reasons why?

Black Americans weren’t freed until 1865. Before that, it was illegal to teach them to read and write. Once slavery was over, segregation was still an issue until the late 1960s so there was a need for those things and they have continued today. Today, Black Americans have a choice. I chose to go to a diverse school and my sister chose to go to an HBC because that’s what she wanted.

How is that different from Jews or Muslims having their own businesses and practices?
Or people choosing doctors that they are more comfortable with? The U.K. considers itself multiracial but the segregation here is no better.

Yes … I’ve considered all possible reasons. And I’m completely and painfully aware of US history. (Both academically and in terms of real life; if either of my parents had emigrated from their home countries to the US at the time they did, they would have had to sit at the back of the bus.)

I don’t argue that it is in any way different to other communities who do the same - and I certainly wouldn’t claim that anything is perfect in the UK. I guess the thing is that I’ve had a lifetime to acclimatise to the specific navigations required here - and those have always been in situations that reflect, on a micro-leve, the realities of this being a majority white country. School, university, professional training, work, domestic life.

I’m fortunate in having relatively strong connections with my parents’ home countries - so I have never looked to the UK to replicate the experience of living only amongst my own ethnicity. (Which would be impossible anyway as my background is so mixed.) I don’t say the US model is wrong - just very different to my own life and not something I would aspire to here.

@CountryCousin

Those things are constantly at the forefront of my mind, cheekyduck.

But I just have a different idea of an ideal society.

An ideal society is integrated, but we have a long way to go before whites put down their ideal of supremacy over the non-white- as played out by the entire western media and populations over Ukraine.

In the real world, we need these 'safe havens' for our mental health- for a rest bite against the gaslighting. America has that -

I just think where we are as a people, I'd rather be in America.

It's very telling that Meghan was hounded by the UK press and large parts of society and took back to America, where two billionaire black people (Opra and Tyler) take her under her wing.

American society is far from perfect and its one built on race rather than class and feudal Lords like the UK, but there's no denying it can offer a better quality of life than the UK, millions of black people are thriving in America, from Atlanta to New York to Florida -

Yes … I’ve considered all possible reasons. And I’m completely and painfully aware of US history. (Both academically and in terms of real life; if either of my parents had emigrated from their home countries to the US at the time they did, they would have had to sit at the back of the bus.)

And mines actually did. My parents didn’t have equal rights when they were born. I don’t think the USA is something to aspire to and have never said or thought that, but I also think the U.K. isn’t either.

I’ve been here almost a decade and have experienced more racism here and some xenophobia than I ever did growing up and living in the US. What annoys me about the U.K. is that so many Brits assume they are so much better than the States (not saying you’re saying that) when despite how old the U.K. is they aren’t that much better with race relations and are in some instances worse.

I often feel you don't realise how racially charged and xenophobic the UK really is until you leave London/other bug cuties for the suburbs. Its shocking in places.

No. I would not.

Have you checked the company benefits and annual leave because I know annual leave a d things like mat leave is horrendous in some parts of America. My family members of another family member have family that have lived on ATL for quite a long time now.