Aggressive/angry black woman

[HmmmmmmInteresting]

I've just been accused of being rude and aggressive in a situation where I was nowhere near rude or aggressive. I actually had three people look at the situation to check I wasn't going mad. It was from a person I never in a million years would have said was racist.

My question is how did this angry black woman stereotype come to be and how do they the words to use? I'm really in shock. I really think if I was Becky with blonde hair there is no way I would have been called aggressive for politely stating my case. I wish I could post the interaction. I literally was polite.

*know the words to use

*First a disclaimer

Just in case this thread pops up in “Active”. This is a contribution to the Black Mumsnetters board which was established to be a safe space for black women and allies to discuss issues of interest black women, from racism to African history, from black hair care to culture-specific issues in relationships. If you feel triggered, nothing here is an attack on you. I would hate for a thread centering black experience to be hijacked so that it ends about centering those who may have hurt feelings because this discussion may be uncomfortable for them. Thank you!*

Thanks for the disclaimer @RedMarauder

BUMP

Hi OP. I don't want to hijack (I'm white), but noticed you hadn't had any replies and I did a bit of work on stereotypes of black women for my MA thesis and thought I might be able to add a little something.

The angry black woman stereotype has some of its roots in an older stereotype/movie character often known as the Sapphire Caricature. It was a portrayal of black women which was thought to be a way to subdue black women's voices by making it seem that if they pushed against the status quo, fought injustice or voiced their frustration then they were 'irrational' and outrageous.

This is an good/interesting link of you wanted to read more about it: www.ferris.edu/HTMLS/news/jimcrow/antiblack/sapphire.htm

:) Hope it wasn't rude to comment when I saw your post.

Really hope this is ok - Im white, and was reading in the aftermath of blm was reading lots. I noticed the angry black woman sterotype mentioned a lot and I dont know what it is either.

Im still a woman and have often been called rude for politely challenging, happened more when I was young. So I guess you got that with racism thrown into the mix. Which is unfortunate and unfair and Im really sorry you had to deal with that x

Sorry I left before I actually posted what I was going to say.

There are several ideas of where the stereotype comes from like this one - www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45476500

I had a look at it when I was doing one of my degrees, but it really comes up in the public domain when it impacts black women like Serena Williams and Oprah Winfrey.

It doesn't matter how famous, rich and skilled you are. It doesn't matter how polite, calm and quiet you are as it is a form of misogynoir, and the aim is to shut you up.

You will suffer it repeatedly and when you calmly show that you are not overreacting the perpetrators will either change their game e.g. pretend to be the victim instead or go completely silent.

@CorianderBee

Hi OP. I don't want to hijack (I'm white), but noticed you hadn't had any replies and I did a bit of work on stereotypes of black women for my MA thesis and thought I might be able to add a little something.

The angry black woman stereotype has some of its roots in an older stereotype/movie character often known as the Sapphire Caricature. It was a portrayal of black women which was thought to be a way to subdue black women's voices by making it seem that if they pushed against the status quo, fought injustice or voiced their frustration then they were 'irrational' and outrageous.

This is an good/interesting link of you wanted to read more about it: www.ferris.edu/HTMLS/news/jimcrow/antiblack/sapphire.htm

:) Hope it wasn't rude to comment when I saw your post.

Thank you @CorianderBee Of course it's not rude to comment and I really appreciate your input. I did some googling and came across the sapphire caricature. I will look at your link.

@StrictlyAFemaleFemale

Really hope this is ok - Im white, and was reading in the aftermath of blm was reading lots. I noticed the angry black woman sterotype mentioned a lot and I dont know what it is either.

Im still a woman and have often been called rude for politely challenging, happened more when I was young. So I guess you got that with racism thrown into the mix. Which is unfortunate and unfair and Im really sorry you had to deal with that x

@StrictlyAFemaleFemale Before I read to the end of your post I wondered if you had experienced this because you were middle aged. Then I saw you said it was when you were young. That's really interesting and useful. Thank you.

OP, I think some people may be more disturbed that you could calmly and politely assert yourself in the situation rather than resort to stereotype but ironically they’ve still applied the trope. That’s what racists do.

I am very aware of the possible underlying intention if someone says that I’m being aggressive. I will usually counter such suggestions and point out that I was being “firm” or “robust” or whatever other positive term is used to describe the same behaviour when exercised by other groups of people.

Without having to express it they’ll know that you’re calling them out on that trope.

@RedMarauder

Sorry I left before I actually posted what I was going to say.

There are several ideas of where the stereotype comes from like this one - www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-45476500

I had a look at it when I was doing one of my degrees, but it really comes up in the public domain when it impacts black women like Serena Williams and Oprah Winfrey.

It doesn't matter how famous, rich and skilled you are. It doesn't matter how polite, calm and quiet you are as it is a form of misogynoir, and the aim is to shut you up.

You will suffer it repeatedly and when you calmly show that you are not overreacting the perpetrators will either change their game e.g. pretend to be the victim instead or go completely silent.

I've been a shy person all my life. Never ever been aggressive. Interesting.

@Maggiethecat

OP, I think some people may be more disturbed that you could calmly and politely assert yourself in the situation rather than resort to stereotype but ironically they’ve still applied the trope. That’s what racists do.

I am very aware of the possible underlying intention if someone says that I’m being aggressive. I will usually counter such suggestions and point out that I was being “firm” or “robust” or whatever other positive term is used to describe the same behaviour when exercised by other groups of people.

Without having to express it they’ll know that you’re calling them out on that trope.

I just said to the person ' I'm sorry you took it that way but I've not said anything to you rude or aggressive'

It soooo annoying because I literally said something like 'thats not true and I can prove it because xyz'. So nothing anybody could ever frame as being rude or aggressive. It's really annoyed me and now I feel like I'm not allowed to be annoyed because that's aggression 🙄

I didn’t ever start off as aggressive but I always had to shout louder to be heard

Sometimes even being the loudest I still felt like nobody listened

Maybe anger at the injustice of it all and trying to have a voice has made me seem aggressive. So now I’m judged for that too. Can’t really get it right. So frustrating just feels like we are labelled already then unwittingly collect more labels as navigating through life 😞

@questionsaboutConsent

I didn’t ever start off as aggressive but I always had to shout louder to be heard

Sometimes even being the loudest I still felt like nobody listened

Maybe anger at the injustice of it all and trying to have a voice has made me seem aggressive. So now I’m judged for that too. Can’t really get it right. So frustrating just feels like we are labelled already then unwittingly collect more labels as navigating through life 😞

I hear you!

I never used to stand up for myself but now will not ever let a situation pass where I should stand up for myself. I don't think I'm ever rude and definitely not aggressive. I am a professional so know the difference.

I agree with you that the injustice of it all may make us more emotional. But I really have never been agressive. It's super-annoying. It's got to the stage where I think expressing annoyance will be perceived as aggression 🙄🤔 Seriously thought twice about posting this lest I'd be accused of being aggressive.

Yes , Easier to label us as aggressive and/or rude than actually listen I’ve found. Which ironically does make me angry so then I fit the description 😞
Just a way to keep us in our place and that’s the problem at the root of it all

@questionsaboutConsent when you get angry you need to learn to speak calmer, speak slightly slower, be more polite and not increase the volume of your voice.

The person making the claims will still claim you are aggressive and rude but those witnessing it will see that the person's claims are baseless.

[quote RedMarauder]@questionsaboutConsent when you get angry you need to learn to speak calmer, speak slightly slower, be more polite and not increase the volume of your voice.

The person making the claims will still claim you are aggressive and rude but those witnessing it will see that the person's claims are baseless.[/quote]
It's sad that we have to do this, though

'Angry' because society unconsciously acknowledges that it is serving an injustice by mistreating black people and women especially. Black women have to support the whole family when men step out/ are forced out/ are withheld. Black women have to continue to be strong, and level headed, and responsible and love those children of the white community they may look after. They're expected to give, empty, exhaust themselves for others, for the good of society (e.g. as nurses and for research), and uphold their modesty (for God, or for their husbands), while no one is giving back to them on the same level.

'Black' because it is dark, mysterious, unfathomable, energetic (black body in physics), uncontrollable (physics), the antithesis of white. Strength is often shown in colour of black (weights, labour animals, heavy use vehicles, the solar system - again another physics fact). Black female strength is on a par with black male strength due to equal work on the plantations during slavery. There is an element of lack of control by the white patriarchy embodied by the black body, and that imbibes fear.

When you are called an ABW, just repeat it to them and be assured that there is fear behind their statement.

It's their quite logical presumption that we must be angry and aggression would follow - if we were like them, that is.

It's judging us by their standards.

I can only imagine the first British murdering raping colonisers were angry when they ran ashore in Africa: look at everything we had! Sunshine, food, resources, civilisation, organisation, family, all the riches. And then they think back to berry picking in Anglesey, brothers and sisters waging war over the sea between England and France, dying over the border between England and Scotland, imprisoning their tiny nephews in a tower, killimg women who were using herbs to cure people, and whatever else they were up to...They got angry. Their aggression overwhelmed us.

Now they expect that back. But we were always better than that.

We can do both, but we are focused, as you might be. Anger abd aggression are important drivers when targeted properly.

I think it is just an easy phrase to use; it links closely to the superiority and entitlement felt by those using the phrase.

A senior colleague one day openly described all Caribbean parents specifically as 'sassy'. This colleague was swiftly informed that was her perception and not fact. So busy was she observing the attitudes / behaviours of 'all the Caribbean parents/carers' that she did not see herself - a passive aggressive, antagonistic, pot stirrer. As an individual she demonstrated those traits in abundance. Fact.

The entire community of Caribbean parents were stereotyped by her.
Whether it is sassy, angry, aggressive... it's all uncalled for because the yardstick being used to measure others is crooked.