What does Black mean to you?

[Sugarintheplum]

I've seen some comments about blackness on here that bring up this question for me time and again. I've seen echoes of it on this board, too. Most obviously regarding mixed race people who have said they feel included or not included, about whether Rochelle Humes is black enough or not to represent black women in that documentary, about some posters who say very condemning and frankly racist things about black men and women on this page, but who say they are black.

For me, black is a way of life that can be lived by people who identify as black and who have brown skin and/or a parent who identifies as black. That is the basis for eligibility, as I've heard it said elsewhere. For me, it is not enough though. There are plenty of people who fit that criterion who actively discriminate against other people who also fit that criterion. I do not consider them black. So, for me, there is a political element. You do not need to dedicate your life to anti-racist activism, but you do need to not be part of the problem.

It is also cultural. It is willingness to recognise and/or enter into a shared understanding, or to not disavow that for others. For example, when what's his name...... the blurred lines rumpshaker dude, hold on I refuse to look it up I will overcome this baby brain....Pharrell Williams (!) talking about being the 'New Black'. Yuk. That's not black to me. You're better than other black people? You're out of the circle pal.

Mixed race people. If that person does to identify as black, then as far a i am concerned, they are not black. If they identify as black, then they are. If a person with two parents from Uganda with dark brown skin sys they are not black, then they too, are not black. Black is a social construct that is flexible, it is not a point of reality with rigid lines.

However, for me, if you have white-skinned parents who identify as white and your skin is also white, then to me, you are not black. It is not my place to tell you whether you are something else, but I do believe I can opine on whether you are black, and in my mind you are not. No matter how you might 'feel'. I do not believe in 'trans-raceness' (I'm making up words now, aren't I?!).

I have two white lesbian friends who have a mixed race child. They are agonising over how to connect their child with her 'blackness'. My friend asks me, and I want to give her something, but I do get stuck because I wonder whether she can do it at all, black to me is so experiential. I told her it's about life, your parent's life, your family life. She wanted to ensure her child was accepted as black, she doesn't want a child who goes about saying she is not black or people not thinking she is black (can't control that part). I ended up saying some stuff which included its about language, and willingness to connect to and be around black people and to reach out to make that connection, and I just talked myself around in circles. I know my children are black, I have no idea how to make your children black. Is that it? Is blackness something that cannot be 'made', yet it is constructed everyday, by us?

I have more thoughts but wonder about what other people think.

At risk of sounding even more garbled(!!!), I have been engaging my efforts to be less 'terf-y' this weekend (I hate that term too, it is a slur, but I use it because it makes a concise point). I do struggle with trans gender matters. I believe all trans men and women should have protections within law, and the same freedoms and rights as people who are not trans, though I do struggle with the idea that trans women ARE women, and should share women's spaces etc. Anyway, I always start thinking about white people who identify as black (trans racial people?) like Rachel Dolezal. I can't get around that if you can have one, you can have the other?

What are your thoughts?

Again,

DISCLAIMER

I'd love to hear from black people on this on their comments, much like any type of survey of fielding for answers where we are interested in the thoughts of a certain demographic of person. If you are white and reading this, please just read. Please do not comment. If you are white and want to comment, you are free to start your own thread. The more the better.

In the simplest way. Black is skin colour. What we see when we approach a person.

Once people see you as black, it's the isms out of that which creates black experiences. This becomes black culture based on shared experiences at the same time, it's still remains relative becuase of class and nationality and sex. No one black experience is the same. However, the collective root problem is race-ism and how it manifests itself in society on a structural level.
How we behave comes out of that structure.

Loaded post, not in a bad way. It just has a lot. I could not work out where to start.

To me, the meaning has sort of evolved. 'Black' is a "race" and like other race terms, is used to group people who share common physical attributes and ancestry - in this case, mainly people with a range of brown or dark skin complexion and afro to curly natural hair. Some Black people have pale skin and/or straight(er) hair. They or their ancestors are typically from an African country but not everyone with African ancestry is 'Black'. Some people who are 'mixed' (one Black parent or grandparent) also identify as 'Black'.

I don't see Black as a culture because there are many Black cultures based on background, nationality and ethnic group. I think when most people talk about 'Black culture', they're usually talking about Black American or Black British culture, which is one of the many cultures among 'Black people'.

Do Black people in general have some things in common? Yes, some to a larger extent than others.

I also think Black shouldn't be used politically because it implies only Black people who think along the same lines are Black and other Black people are , therefore not Black. It's like saying only Tory or Labour voters are British and others aren't.

So to me, if you're Black, you're Black. Your personality or views, whether considered good or bad, shouldn't change that.

If someone doesn't consider themselves Black for their own reasons, then fair enough. That's their prerogative. However, others shouldn't decide if a Black person is Black or not just because of their way of thinking.

Also, I see mixed race people as mixed race people but if a mixed race person only identifies as Black or White or Asian, it's their prerogative as well.

I see being Black as a fact based on your race. It’s not political, because we don’t all have the same views, backgrounds etc, although we may share cultural aspects. The discrimination and racism we may experience is based on our race and it isn’t as if you can identify out of your skin colour, even if you actually wanted to. It’s what people see and make in some cases stupid assumptions about you. I also think mixed race people can identify as black if they have a black parent. If they choose not to, it’s up to them.