I killed my husband. TRIGGER.

[mommytoangel2]

I will try to be brief...I've posted on other topics here before...

Met DH when I was 19, him 20. Been together 11 years, married for 9 with two lovely daughters aged 7 and 2.

First couple of years we put each other through hell. I was jealous, insecure and paranoid and used to accuse him/go on at him over silly things. He was violent at times.

Got married in 2008, we were so happy! Had our first child 2009, I'd had miscarriages which he blamed himself for (he'd given me herpes and I had some scarring, we don't know it was the cause but think it was). Things were great.

2015 we had our second child. He didn't want another, and shocked me by actually writing down his reasons which were mostly that he'd only ever wanted one, and that I wasn't "the same" with him anymore. He agreed in the end and when she was born he fell head over heels.

End of 2015 he found out I'd amassed large amounts of debt. The money didn't bother him as such, it was more the web of lies. He said he felt our marriage had been mostly a lie, things would never be the same, I wasn't the person I used to be etc. He smashed up the house when he found out and the neighbours called the police, who involved social services as the two kids were in bed. SS didn't do anything as they felt the kids were not at risk but it was a very very stressful time.

2016 was up and down - we had some months we weren't together (but living together) and some good months too. I'd told him I wanted a divorce. Reason being is that he was doing nothing with the kids, and since he met his friend (his only friend to be fair), he'd started going out getting drunk and rolling in at all hours.

Jan 2017 I found he was ordering equipment to harm himself (mumsnet says I can't say what or how so I won't). I confronted him, I told him all the things he'd miss (the girls weddings etc) and asked if he'd thought of that. He said he had, but that the kids would get over it and be better off without him. I asked what about me and he said "finally! Took you long enough!" because I'd spent so long going on about the girls. I asked him what would stop him feeling this way and he said "you not being mental". I think at the time I had also said I wanted a divorce and this was a factor.

Shortly after I found him trying to purchase materials again, and again confronted him - I even emailed the place begging them not to serve him.

Late Feb 2017 I left him, took the kids and everything we owned for 2 weeks. During that time he asked to see them, was "I'm not bothered if you come or not" and then completely changed and started telling me he needed me, loved me, needed all his girls etc. I took the kids to see him and I swear to god in 11 years I'd never seen him like that, he had tears, he was desperate for us back. We came back and he was the happiest I'd seen him in ages, he was making a huge effort.

It was stressful in March as we moved house, to a house only in my name. It was a relief to be away from the neighbour (DH never forgave her and we spent our lives avoiding her which was hell) and we'd finally got a nice big house in the area we wanted. I thought life was good.

End of April we fell out, I think the day after DD2's birthday, and he stayed in a hotel as I threw him out. He came back the next day and I told him he could come to her tea party. (He later said he came back to sort it out, but he ignored me the whole time!) He overheard me saying my best friend and her partner were coming. Next thing he storms downstairs, announces "I have to go as she's arranged for me to be beaten up in front of the kids" and left.

Emails went back and forth, insults and accusations. He was gone less than 2 weeks and rented a room (hotels too expensive). He came to see the kids and we agreed he should come home. He said he'd tried to give me time to calm down but I hadn't, which is why he rented a room. By this time it was mid May.

End of May was our wedding anniversary, he spoiled me with gifts and we had a date night.

June was ok, we had ups and downs. We went on holiday the first week of this month (July).

On holiday he drank a lot - something I am hyper sensitive to as even one drink can make him nasty. On one day he refused to eat all day and ended up drinking all day instead then throwing up. He told me there was something wrong with the cocktail and that made him poorly but I didn't believe it. The holiday was hard work as we have a toddler and DD1 was a complete nightmare. We spent no time together in the evenings thanks to her behaviour (I'll explain in a minute) and the whole thing was really really hard work.

DD1's behaviour for over 6 months maybe a year has been dreadful. It has put us under unbelievable stress. She is a whiny brat all day with a disgusting attitude. Doesn't listen, doesn't behave. At night time it could take anything from 1-6 hours to get her to bed and let me leave the room. She would scream "owwwwwwww" "you're hurting me" etc even if nobody there, and if I sent DH she'd scream "get him away from me! he's killing me!" even though he wasn't, just to get rid of him. I admit I was awful to her, I was shouting at her, calling her names, saying awful things to her. I even smacked her a few times (not hard) which I am so ashamed of because up until this year I had never once smacked her.

In hindsight DH was right and I should have just left her to scream, but I was so scared of her waking up DD2 or the neighbours calling the social or something. We used to argue over it, and he blamed me because me going on at her just made it all worse.

Anyhow...

last Thursday (13th) we were watching tv as normal, DD2 was woken up and was with us, cuddling etc. and DD1 started up. For a few hours I went up and yelled, the usual stuff - then DH came up and smacked her. I was so scared I yelled "get off her!" as he smacked her hard. It left a handprint, which faded quickly but still.

DH then called me a vindictive bitch, said I'd yelled at him to make the neighbours call the police, threatened to call them himself. I begged him not to and he didn't. Friday the 14th I stayed in a hotel with the kids and emailed him how illegal/cruel it was to hit DD1 and that I couldn't forgive him, that all holiday I had done EVERYTHING (true) and all he'd done is drink etc. I told him to leave.

Came home Saturday 15th and he was in bed, I told him to leave and went out for the day. Came back and he was still there. I asked him to let me have the bed with DD2 as she was poorly and he just ignored me. He then set his phone up to record him (and the room) which I presumed was some sort of "evidence" against me.

All day Saturday/Sunday he stayed in bed. No food, nothing. I remember going in and he was looking at the ceiling and I thought he was depressed. (In January he did similar behaviour and told me it was so he could distance himself from the kids making it easer to commit suicide). I was angry and thought he was just doing it to gather evidence of me or something.

Monday he went to work, I leave before him so didn't see him. I emailed him saying I'd left a bag in the porch for him and he needed to get it before the landlord came (to fix something). Emails went back and forth and he collected it at 8pm but I didn't see him as I was upstairs.

Tuesday he went to work as normal. Emails were going back and forth, nothing different to any other time, insults and accusations. I did list all his violence and told him he needed to admit it to himself, but he just replied with the laughing emoji and "psychopath! I hope they get to our girls soon" which set me off and I launched an email saying he'd never get custody as he's a violent alcoholic, he could never come to the house, I'd see him in court, all talk to be done legally etc.

Didn't hear back from him til 1.30am Wednesday 19th. I was asleep but something woke me up as I replied at 5.30am. I think it was DD2 screaming "I want daddy!" which freaks me out as that has never happened and I'm sure it was the night he did it...I can't be certain but something definitely woke me for me to be replying to it!

Anyway....

On weds 19th I get a phone call from the police and they admit it's to do with DH but won't say more. I call his work colleague who tells me he wasn't at work that day. I instantly knew.

The police came to tell me he'd been found dead at 6am. Approximately 1 hour away from my home.

The note was brief. It began with my name, and simply said he couldn't go on living in fear of the police, or of my friends/family beating him up. That I'd taken the girls from him but I was the abuser. It's then addressed to whoever finds him and details his money is to go only to his children, and that if they check his phone for emails/messages it will tell them all they need to know. It states the money on him was his escape fund but he wouldn't be needing it. It then ends with a message to the girls which apologises for him not being able to save them from me, and says he loves them now and forever.

There are other notes, I don't know how many, when they were written. Just that they are similar to that note. They aren't letters addressed to anyone, just notes he's made. I assume over a period of days/weeks as there are police log numbers on (he called the police out a couple of months ago, as he wanted to defend himself as he thought I'd called them?!). I know that they allude to me and have similar paranoid things in them. I will be reading them today.

I hold my hands up and I admit many times I threatened him with the police, saying I'd tell them all about his violence and have him sent to prison. I don't recall ever threatening him with people beating him up, but he has heard stories of people I know doing it to other people. I did threaten him with contact centres a lot, but both times we split up he saw the kids with me, at my home or public place. I also told him how I had photos/videos/cctv/witnesses to his abuse which isn't strictly true (he did see photos of bruises but they weren't by him, he just thought I was gathering evidence but it was just because I kept bruising and wanted to show my GP)

I think he was afraid I'd tell the police he hit DD1 and that she'd back it up and then he'd go to prison and/or never see the girls again.

He was always convinced he'd never see the girls again even if he went to court etc. He was convinced I'd make up lies to prevent it. In his mind if we split, he'd never see them (even though he did!)

He always used to say I "made shit up" to have a go at him, and I was always in a mood. I admit I have been in a mood a lot due to lack of sleep and DD1's behaviour along with everyday stress.

In some of his emails he says he wasn't allowed to go out unless it was for work, which is kind of true as I stopped him going out getting drunk and didn't like his friend. But it never bothered him, he said he didn't mind. He didn't have any family (estranged many years ago) or friends, other than one who we will call D. And I took D away from him by not letting him go out.

I've spoken to D a lot as they worked together, and there are things about DH that I never knew which surprised me. A lot of the times I assumed he was out with D, he can't have been, as D says they only went out 4 times in 2 years, and that DH sent a couple of messages saying he was already out asking him to join him. So DH must have been going alone as he knew nobody else.

Me and the girls were DH's world, all he had. He had a good job, good salary, nice house. He was a very private person, hard to get close to and NEVER spoke about things, but then again I would tell him not to tell D all about our marriage so maybe I took that from him too.

I just put myself in DH's shoes - he comes home from work, maybe stressed, DD1 is playing up or arguing with me, I'm in a mood, I then have a go at him etc... every day... he can't escape as he's not allowed to go out drinking, so he's trapped...

It's not your fault he was a grown man.He needed help .He was manipulative discouraging you from having your friends round which is a key sign .You will need professional counseling to talk this through.

You can't make some one depressed for the reasons you listed.

Your options would be put up with violence. Put up with his drinking.
Put up with him doing nothing for the kids.

He refused to sort him self out, he was selfish, and he killed himself to spite you knowing it would hurt his kids. Selfish to the end

You call one of them a whiny brat, admitted you shouted and s eamed at them. They have been through enough
She's on an Internet forum, not talking to her daughter and she's been through and awful lot too

You really need support for you and with your children

You arn't to blame for your husbands suicide but it's obvious you've needed help for years

Please now put your girls first and seek some help

Your mind will be all over the place, so take some deep breaths and seek some help x

This relationship was terrible and must have affected you both awfully. It's a shame you couldn't have separated and co-parented, but obviously hindsight is always 20/20. You really do need proper counselling OP, and so do your children.

You poor poor thing.

I don't know what to say in comfort as there are no comforting words to say at an awful time like this. My husband has been severely depressed for the past few years including attempted suicides and after a lot of counselling I've had to come to it that none of his behaviour is my fault and my first priority is keeping myself sane for my kids sake. Surround yourself in RL support. Just be kind to yourself and don't listen when your head is telling you lies that it's your fault.

Sending you and hugs xxx

I also found that every time I felt under the extreme pressure of an suicide looming in the distance I found myself being a screechy mother that I KNEW was wrong and I hardly recognised myself

Thank you for listening.

Regards to DD1, I have sat and explained to her how wrong I was, that no matter what it shouldn't have happened. Her behaviour has been very very challenging but I am working hard to not react like before. Her school have put some counselling in place for September and I am planning on asking the GP for a referral too. I have a counselling appointment tomorrow.

But it just gets worse... these other notes they were being shifty about telling me it wasn't about anyone/anything in particular? Well I saw them today and they are ALL about me!!

It is basically one note that has a log number on from when he reported me to police for fraud saying I ran up debt in his name (this is feb 2017 when I left him) and a log number from when the police came out that night and I reported him being aggressive etc.

Then there are 2 pages which are notes of how "domestically abusive" I was. Some of it is true, like me not letting him cook/clean (I'm OCD but he was never bothered by this). Some of it is a blatant lie, like him saying I pushed him down the stairs but blamed him (in reality he smashed up the upstairs and neighbours called police). Some is twisted versions of the truth, like saying he couldn't look at women in underwear on the tv (not true, I didn't like him looking at naked women/porn but never said underwear). Some of it is paranoid like him saying I threatened to kill him and his "work colleague" (not true and it's his friend but he refuses to say friend and says colleague to make it sound worse). Some of it is odd, like him saying I sold the house from under him (except he was the one on the phone to solicitors confirming exchange and money etc!!!). There are various headings like physical, sexual, emotional, digital - almost like written from a website, with his examples. He says I monitor his emails (not strictly true, I kept an eye on them after his suicide purchases in January, since then I haven't even had his password) saying I checked his phone all the time (fairly often, but he also checked mine, and not all the time), that I wouldn't let him answer the phone (not true, I just asked him to stop always being on the phone to his mate when we were spending time together, something his mate's girlfriend also did!)

He goes on saying I made up stories about him going out, abuse, drinking - all of which are not made up!! Then some things which are true like me threatening to report him for abuse. It goes on and on.

There are phone numbers on there for male domestic violence helplines and I think refuges or council accommodation - not sure why they are on there? To prove his story if the police check?

It doesn't mention the children other than to say he has no say in their upbringing (truth is he never bothered) and that I control them, forcing DD1 to write letters about how good I am (this is awful, she likes to write me love letters that's all) and how he wasn't allowed to see them if we separated (not true, each time we've split he's seen them!)

Funny thing is, he says I threatened to leave if he didn't cooperate. Which makes me think why not let me leave if I'm so bad?!! Why was he sooo happy to have me back when I came back in february? Just for the kids?

I don't know when all the notes were written but it looks like they were written at the same time. Could have been months ago, weeks ago or on the day. The log number is from february and is written on two notes so could have been as far ago as then.

He also says I forced/pressured him into sex, unsafe sex etc which is hurtful as he always used to moan we never had sex and I didn't enjoy it! Then on holiday a week before he died he was getting excited rubbing sun cream on me and saying how I'm not normally this up for it etc!!

I am really angry with the notes but also deeply hurt. Did he really believe he was a victim? Thinking back to february I did hear him say to action fraud he was in an abusive relationship and had called an advice line, but when I questioned him he said he was lying. Has this been going on all along?

He had enough money in cash to rent somewhere, and over 30k in the bank, why not just leave? Why not go to a refuge or council accommodation then?

There's also a note saying "doctors" which makes no sense and "proof?" which is going round and round in my head.

There's an address of a child law website, what is the point of writing that down? Unless he spoke to someone? If he did, they'd tell him he would get contact with his kids! Not custody but contact. Unless he told them he was worried I'd make him out to be violent in which case they might have said supervised contact which he'd never agree to

Or maybe he was planning on taking the kids and saying I was abusive?

The funeral is tuesday and I'm going to be on my own after as my friend is on holiday and I am in a real mess.

Did he really believe he was a victim? Or was this an act of pure spite? If he really wanted the kids away from me then why not make notes on how I treated them? The coroner officer said it reads as paranoia and a last act of control. Manipulation?

I'm also terrified his mum, who is mega pushy, will read all the notes and blame me!

So angry hurt and upset!!!!! But if I was that much of a monster to the kids and abusive to him, why still be wearing his wedding ring?!

Op

The relationship was highly dysfunctional.

You did not kill him.

Seek urgent help. This is a delicate subject and many posters will not know how best to respond.

As gently as I can put it.

It's not your fault

Stop focusing on him for now, your girls are more important.

Your life seems to have been centered around him and your relationships problems. Sadly he has died, don't spend the rest if your life trying to reassure yourself that you and he were great parents.

You werent. But you can be now.

OP you shouldn't be reading too much into the notes

Focus on there here and now! So glad you've been looking into support and the school are helping your daughters

Have to say i completely agree with joannegrady90

Look after yourself and your girls OP

If the notes are as fictional as you say you need to put them down to paranoia and mental illness. Pouring over something that there is no logic behind will just turn you inside out.
I'm glad you're getting counselling and working to repair the relationship with your dd.

OP well done for turning to professional help straight away, they'll be able to help you more than any of us on here can. Have been thinking about you all day

Hand holding

thank you ladies. I'm seeing the counsellor at 11, hopefully it will help.

The notes weren't purely fiction, there were the odd true thing, and things that were twisted versions of the truth (for example, it's true I didn't let him cook/clean. It's true I didn't let him look at naked women on tv/porn which is a twisted version of him saying "not allowed to look at women in underwear on tv)

This is why I am going mad - did he genuinely believe he was a victim? He must have knowingly altered some truths (like the underwear thing, selling his house from under him etc) and knowingly made up some things (pushing him down the stairs). Was he just trying to set me up? Or did he genuinely believe all of this?

If he believed it, why not leave? If not a refuge, he had plenty of money to rent somewhere. He knew he wouldn't get custody but he would have known he could get contact at least so why not go?

If it isn't true, why write it? Why try to spite/hurt me with it? Why set himself up as a victim?

Hand on heart there's nothing on those notes that would make me suicidal, except maybe the whole "threats to kill me" thing, but even then I'd just try to escape. It literally is just a long list of things that make him a domestic abuse victim.

I'm going insane.

Hi OP, many hugs to you. It's all raw and sounds utterly heartbreaking and bewildering for you. I can only echo PPs in that your DH's suicide was emphatically not your fault. He was an adult, he had choices. He chose to rewrite history so that he became the victim and he chose to end his life. People who end their lives are (not always) often in such a state of mind that reality becomes extremely blurred. It is courageous of you in the extreme to admit the small elements of truth in his letters, but this must be awfully confusing in the middle of so much fabrication.

Have you heard of Survivors of Bereavement By Suicide? They may be worth a call (0300 111 5065). Hope that this link works:

uksobs.org

Take it a day at a time. Tuesday will be a tough day - will be thinking of you.

Maybe he had convinced himself that the things he said we're true. Maybe he has just written them to hurt you and make people think badly of you as a final act of abuse himself. You will never know for sure.
Try to concentrate on taking care of yourself and your kids now. You can't change what's done.

Look, people who have mental health problems and personality issues (he sounds like a manipulative arse) will say ANYTHING to hurt others or to whitewash their own actions. I have a family member who is like this: she just totally reinvents reality all of the time to make herself look good. Victimhood can be a very seductive position to take, because it's essentially an abnegation of all adult responsibility - it says "I'm blameless!" Just because someone portrays themselves in that position, however, does not mean that they really ARE there, however. Very often, reality is greyer and more complicated than all that. You seem to have a good grasp on reality yourself - stay true to that.

You sound like you have been in a codependent relationship for a long time. The thing about this is that it affects your sense of self: you are basically allowing someone else to come in a shit all over your boundaries. Hopefully your counsellor will help you realise you don't have to do this. Think of yourself as a walled castle. You've been urged to have your drawbridge down, and you've had an undermining person wandering all over your ramparts, chucking litter all over you and taking a crap in your bedroom. You need to re-fortify yourself: you can put the views of others firmly outside of your moat, and when they try to chuck litter over it or to spray graffiti on the walls, you can choose not to accept that and just calmly remove it from your well-defended environment.

It sounds like an abusive, or at least unhealthy relationship. Either you don't see it that way or you choose not to. He certainly felt that it was. I believe him.

Someknobend - you believe he was the victim?

The counsellor referred me to another one but she was helpful. My first session is the day after the funeral.

She insisted I wasn't to blame but tbh I think I made him that depressed.

Found my old login hence name change! Phone auto fill lol

You both stayed in a chaotic, highly dramatic relationship. He was not your captive (nor you, his) and he could have walked away and established a stable home on his own, in which he could have had contact with his children. You say he was financially able to live alone? Then it was totally a choice to stay and wallow in the drama and behave in a frankly, abusive way to you and your children.

Suicide is sometimes a tool in the abusers armory and that's not to say he was not mentally unwell and suffering, but it was his choice to do what he did. Even if you had divorced at an earlier time, there's no guarantee that he wouldn't have done this anyway.

Get help and support for yourself and especially your children and burn those notes - he wanted them to torture you, don't prolong the victimisation drama of it any longer than is needed. You know the truth of your relationship, it doesn't matter how or why he wanted to try and frame things or manipulate reality - it's over now. Incinerate and move forward with the realisation that you have some poor relationship patterns that need healing.

Op this is a terrible situation but it is not your fault! The relationship sounds very dysfunctional and it sounds like he was depressed but he could have left at anytime. You did not make him kill himself but it does seem like he has tired to make it look this way. But that does not mean it is true!

I'm glad you have started Counselling and please keep going. You cannot take the blame for this and I know it's hard not to feel to blame because of his notes but honestly his notes were probably written because he knew he was going to do this and he didn't want to take the blame for his own decision! If you look at grief websites when someone dies people always want to blame someone even if the person died of an illness when it is suicide you are more likely to blame. Even the corner told you his notes were manipulative, they deal with cases like this on a daily basis so you really should listen to their advice as they have seen it all before!

Do you have any friends or family to support you?

He sounds like he was mentally ill. I don't just mean depression, which may or may not have been aggravated by your relationship difficulties, I mean paranoid and possibly hearing things he believed to be true. His suicide was not your fault and whether or not he believed it was is neither here nor there to be honest. You are not responsible for someone else's disordered thinking.

I'm worried you are so fixated on this now- like you seemed to be stuck in the destructive cycle of bad relationship- sometimes okay (I'd never say good from what you described to be honest!) - bad again- to play again. Back and forth. Leave and return. And now he is going you're still taking so much mental space trying to figure him out.
You won't. Ever.

Now you need to focus on your children. They are the victims here. They've lived through this turbulent relationship and now their dad is dead and their mum needs to step up.
Get support for you all but please stop obsessing about the ravings of a delusional suicidal and very ill man.

I hear what you're saying but my mind says "he wasn't mentally ill or depressed, I MADE him that way" by putting him down, making him feel unloved/unwanted/not good enough. The depression then made him feel suicidal.

There were good months and years (even good months this year!) and he was a good man in so many ways. Yes he didn't do much with the kids, but he worked hard, and every penny he earned went to us, every thing he did was for us.

In his last email to me - which I feel was also his suicide note - the last paragraph says he gave everything he had, built his life for his family but it wasn't enough and nothing ever was.

People say this was his way of saying he loved me but felt like a failure? In his mind everything he did was to make me happy but nothing ever did, nothing was ever good enough.

I'm so sad that next year was our 10 year wedding anniversary, he knew how much I was looking forward to it, we didn't even make it that far.

Everywhere I go I have good memories of him.

I just really hate this right now, I still feel like he's coming back!

I also feel like he killed himself in a way like "I'll show you! You'll see!" maybe in anger?

He used to say (after researching it and attempting to buy the stuff in January) that knowing he could kill himself whenever he wanted gave him a feeling of relief. I can only hope he felt relieved when he did it, not scared or hurt.

He knew how to do it, all he had to do was buy the stuff and actually go through with it. What tipped him over the edge? Was it me throwing him out the day before?

He couldn't have done it out of anger as it is such a complex and well planned method.

I just wish I knew he loved me, that he didn't mean it, that he was just angry/hurt/stupid and went too far. But this wasn't a cry for help, he KNEW it would work and he didn't try to stop it.

I'm trying so hard to do my best with the girls, but I don't feel like doing anything. I have great friends and family who are helping me through but at the end of the day they all go home to their partners and I have nobody.

It just makes no sense - why blame anyone at all? Why not just say he loves the girls and leave it at that? Why make such an extensive list of so-called domestic abuse? Why blame me? Why not tell me he loves me?