how do I get them to grow up and take responsibility?

[ErnestTheBavarian]

I have badly f*d up.

My kids don't do a single bloody thing unless I ask them. Literally. (10, 9 & 6)

They don't have a shower, brush their teeth, eat their breakfast, get dressed, help out around the home, absolutely nothing at all, unless I specifically ask them.

We are supposed to be going away tomorrow. I am rushing round like a blue arsed fly. I need to

1. tidy house
2. pack.
3. make dinner

They arse about/play/read/don't do anything. I loose it. mucho ranting.

If I shout and tell them to do it they do it. If I don't ask they don't do. I explain to them I should not have to micro manage 5 people's lives don to whether they have cut their finger nails or brushed their teeth.

Evening doesn't improve. I send them to bed. They all troop upstairs WITHOUT BRUSHING THEIR TEETH. ARRRGGGGGHHHHHHHHH.

Tell me sombody please, how they, and I get them to grow up and take responsibility.

I even drew up a daily ick list for them on that they had to do - eat breakfast, brush teeth, check bag packed blah blah blah. As soon as I stopped overseeing them filling it in they stop using it, and back we are to square one.

How do I fix this disaster before I send 3 mummy's boys out into the world who can't or won't do a single damned thing.

(ds2 was on laundry duty last week for maltreatment of laundry). He helped me all week with every wash, loading machine, hanging out stuff, putting it away etc etc. But the minute I don't directly tell him, his stuff is again on the floor and he doesn't do anything unless I tell him.

wow!!

emm, i really have no experience of this but i would hazard a guess at just stop doing it all. dont cook or wash or clean or tidy up or help with homework and tell them all that you are doing it and why you are doing it.

tried that. doesn't work. they will happily not bother to shower, wear dirty clothes, leave their rooms a tip, not brush their teeth. They are perfectly happy to not do any of these things.

The going on food strike or not packing, well, if I tell them to pack or to bring me eg 2 pairs of jeans or whatever they will do it. But unless I directly ask/tell them to do it, they don't care and don't do. Ifeel unbelievably frustrated.

Ernest

my children have a very nice life. They have that nice life because they do their job

their job is to keep clean intheir person, keep their rooms tidy and do any other errands I ask.

So if they don't do that they get no treats which is pocket money, toys etc etc the treats are individual to each child,
If once treats stop they still don't do as they should then I start taking their stuff away.

They are doing it because you have made their jobs all about you.
Make them invested in doing their stuff because life becomes less pleasant if they don't.

No wonder you are frustrated. You have created the situtaion where they have no consequence - you do

Just to add

you have no idea how nice it is to look at jobs chart and say
'oh bad luck pag the elder - you didn't do x or x ...so I get to spend your pocket money this week'

You only have to chose the right incentive and ACTUALLY WITHDRAW IT !!!

I have a 16, 13 and 7 year old who all do exactly as they should

ernest - my sympathies - I have 3 like that too (mine are 8 and 7 year old twins - also boys).

They don't care if things don't get done - I don't think they see it, or at least it isn't important enough to waste time doing it until I start to shout - then they suddenly jump to it looking guilty, and I get annoyed for having to shout - vicious circle.

I don't know how to make it work - sanctions make little difference - they are too long term (not immediate enough) and so get forgotten in the heat of doing what they want rather than what they should be doing. The sort of sanctions pag mentions do work - but only for a short tiem before they are forgotten again and the effect wears off.

I feel like I spend my life repeating myself (if I had a pound for each time I have said toilets don't flush themselves I would be seriously rich).

To be fair they are slowly improving - but it is just so slow it drives me mental.

I swear ds3 who is 6 will not wash his hands after going to the toilet. Every time he goes I ask did you wash your hands and he always answers 'oops' and scuttles off to do it. He's been out of nappies for 4 years fgs.

If I don't ask they don't do. I took away all their lego for a month they didn't care.

What do they care about? That's the leverage you have - you have to either reward good behaviour, or punish bad behaviour, or both. The "rewards" means they get nice things when they do what they should, and the punishments mean they don't get the rewards or they get things taken away. You have to find something which does bother them, and connect that to the chores.

So - eg brushing teeth for a week, they get to play on the computer. No tooth-brushing, no computer.

Probably best to start with just one thing - whichever bothers you the most. Once they get the habit of doing it, it shouldn't need you to keep on about it any more.

Hiya,

I have an 11 year old ds and can relate to your post as I'm sure lots of others can...

when we were going on holiday we wrote a list of everything he needed to pack together - so that he had enough clothes, tolitries etc rather than just a pair of jeans and his psp! - and then he packed, ticking things off as he went. I then made the responsibilty his and resisted the urge to check it all and re-pack it! I don't know if you would have time to do this but it might work - you could all sit down and write the lists together?

Does the oldest one do his own lunchbox or does he have school dinners? If he takes a lunchbox and you do it I would advise making that his responsibilty - over a week or so. Perhaps you make the sandwich for a couple of days as he adds the rest and then he does it all?

When you've done some ironing can you get the kids involved in putting their own clothes away - make it a routine so that you don't have to -nag remind them.

In terms of teeth brushing, how about you make an appointment at the dentist and get him to tell them about its importance/ explain about fillings etc. Would that help? He might even show them some photos of the teeth of people that didn't brush them well/ at all.

Let us know how you get on and if you find anything else that works, let me know! It's definately not an easy one. Good luck x

i really feel your pain.

would love to know the answer.

have a feeling you've got to be v tough and like a sergeant major. oh and have a good memory, so you remember what you've banned them from before you see them do it.

also helps if you have no moral aversion to bribery and blackmail.

no moral problems with blackmail etc
Not very good at being sergeant major. I know it's as much my fault as theirs - I have created it.

I either do things they should because I always have, and it's me that hasn't made them start doing it as they've got old enough to be able to iyswim, then I feel like I've missed the boat. Though of course it's never too late, but will take a lot of work retraining me and them.

Must make sure I catch the boat with ds3 & dd.

Or I'm in a hurry or pack or whatever myself while they're at school/in bed so they don't get involved, again, largely my fault, they will help if I ask them

Maybe this is a parental problem that I need to just accept to a certain extent? I remember my mum moaning on that no one would ever help unless they were asked and I really didn't understand why she was moaning, as if she asked we would do do.

Now I sort of understand. Though when I ask, they moan so much, grr.

Thanks for input.

Should I draw up a list of everything they need to do in a day, inc brushing teeth? I tried this and the reward was a stone ( they get 1 euro a week pocket money then a stone in their jar as a reward for anything really. At the end of the week they get an additional 20c. per stone pocket money. So I thought it was an easy way to get an extra stone (ie euro) per week.

But it didn't work as they only filled it out if I nagged, and as ds pointed out, if they forgot one thing at the beginning eg make bed, the whole day (ie bribe) was lost.

SO, is there a better way?

Would love to get this situation improved.

the only thing i can think of is that you do a man to man thing. you know - guys, i can't do this anymore has anyone got any ideas how we can sort it out? put the ball firmly in their court and be honest about how you feel. they might take pity on you. the other thing is to be really specific about what you want them to do and keep it fairly limited, otherwise you all start forgetting what the job list is and it's back to square one again.

eg make your bed in the morning. heavily police this for a fortnight until it becomes habit. once you've got that under your belt, you could tackle something really taxing like putting your dirty clothes in the basket. radical stuff i know. might take a bit longer to master than bed making, but don't attempt anythisng else until you're pretty confident they've at least understood the concept.

the other thing is good ole natural consequences. have to be feeling fairly kickass for this one. basically ask them or remind them once to do something, let's take lunch boxes, and if they don't do it, then well whoops sorry you go hungry. also works well with pe kits. but you do really have to be mentally strong to cope with the flailing and whingeing.

you stick to your guns though. resentment is a nasty nasty feeling. perhaps you could point out in the man to man chat that you would generally feel more loving and generous if you didn't feel like everyone's maid. sort of saps the joy of it all, dealing with other people's dirty undies on a far too regular basis.

hopefully some of the above might work.
really really good luck. rooting for you.

you're right I guess, one job at a time. Like I said, natural consequences don't work so well - they will happily go hungry, dirty, unwashed.

have banned friends coming round unless their rooms are presentable

that's a good one.

do they really go hungry?

I like them to take a snack as they have breakfast at 7.15 but lunch is sometimes as late as 1.30 (varies bwn 11.30 & 1.30, but more often than not later). If I make it they sometimes forget to eat it. If I don't make the snack they won't bother, so yes, they go from 7.15 to 1.30 without food, which is too long imo, 6 1/2 hours or so, but if I don't tell them, they don't do it. Or soemtimes don't do it anyway cos they 'forget' (can't be bothered) so in the case of food or teeth or washing, na. consequences don't work.

I think that they need to earn their treats by doing the tasks you ask of them.

So get that chart out again and make it their responsibility to prove that they've done the tasks to get the pocket money. If their boxes are not ticked before school then no computer after school. If they haven't put their clothes in the wash and ticked the box then no pocket money. You don't check if they've done it and remind them to tick the box. If they want the reward they have to claim it.

You have to be hard so don't give them any responsibilities that you'll feel like you have to check on. Start with a few tasks and work up to more as they get used to it. Do not ever give in. If they haven't done it and claimed it they don't get it. Having said all that, the 6 year old probably deserves a little nudge now and then.