I don't know what to do - I really don't

[boythengirl]

I have two DC - one is 4 a boy and a girl who is 2.

I am at my wits end about my DS' behaviour. I could write a book about it but I shall try and keep it short. He is grumpy, self centred and very diffcult to be around, deal with. He has been like this for a long time - several years. There are days but they are infrequent where he is a nice boy to be around but in general it is hard work from the moment he gets up. His sister, although capable of having her 'moments' is a happy fun loving joy to be around.

My DS just brings us all down in mood. He is very negative most of the time and very negative towards his siter...won't sit beside her at mealtimes or booktime and won't play with her. He whinges all day, has mini tantrums about the smallest things. He also expects me to be with him 24/7. If I try to make a cup of tea and sit down for 5 mins he gets very upset. He is constantly nagging me for the next game etc.

I have been seeing a HV as the situation is making me very miserable (which does not help either). She thinks perhaps he is emotionally immature and it's just going to take time. Today is another bad day and I have just said to my DH that I am seriously thinking about going back to work as I cannot cope with the situation and I am not able to help him.

If anyone has any ideas of what might help or what might be causing it I would really be grateful!

I have at times had very similar situation with my eldest ds. Like your ds, he is generally much harder to be around, and I have to work much harder at our relationship. He is 8 now and I know there are no sn issues, he just has a more challenging personality.

The way we approached it was like so: We would find that we fell into a really negative spiral. ds would behave badly, we would tell him off, but between ourselves think that bad behaviour was only to be expected from him. So he would behave badly again, and we wouldn't be surprised, but would get cross. Then we quickly began to expect bad behaviour, adn guess what!, he fulfilled our expectations.

We would often find that we would try one strategy then another in quick succession and so probably muddled him, and certainly didn't improve the behaviour.

The real turning point for us, and we have to re-visit this when we feel things have slipped a bit, is to consciously focus on the good behaviour and have a clear calm strategy for the bad. We, too do the 'love bombing' thing, although I didn't know it had a technical term! and couple it with very calm consistent discipline - usually saying something like "you may not say xxxxx to me. That is rude. You need to apologise", then if he doesn't apologise he has to go out of the room until he is ready to join in nicely again.

But if you are having to do quite a lot of disciplining, even if in a calm way, your ds will need extra reassuring that he is loved, wanted and needed in the family. That is where the love bombing comes in. Children have short working memories so if your ds was foul on the way home from pre-school you may still be reeling from the experience several hours later and feel slightly resentful towards him still (I know I do) and not want to give him loads of cuddles and kisses and tell him how special he is etc. But he will have moved on from the bad behaviour and simply feel rejected if you are still a bit 'off' with him later on. That may well lead to further bad behaviour from him, and the spiral continues.

It can be really hard to break the chain of bad behaviour, but, with consistency and a plan, it can be done. Our family is much much happier since we tackled ds1's negative dominance of the family, and if things slip, it's reasonably straightforward to reinstate the plan and within a day or two things are back on track again.

Like others, I would strongly recommend you read How to Talk so kids will listen

Hi there, I'm really glad I came across this post as I was starting to think that there was something 'wrong' with my dd. She is the eldest of two - my ds is 18 months. Like the op, my dd is really demanding and, dare I say, hard work (sorry - 'challenging'!), while my ds is, by comparison, the easiest child in the world (of course he has his moments but it is nothing like dd). DD is 3.9 years so similar age to your ds. It is also the negativity and 'attitude' that gets me down and makes me wonder why she seems to be so angry. But then she has moments of brilliance and is off in her imaginary world. But A LOT of the time, she is whinging and crying about things...she has just always been like this. I don't see other children her age though whinging so much which made me wonder why she is like it. It is reassuring though to see that others have experiences similar things and maybe we've just got the personality types that are harder work?! My dd at the moment, will not do anything I ask without saying 'No, no, I don't want to...' and battling with me first. I don't let her get her own way though and hoped it was a phase...but if it is, it's a bloody long one!! I do think with my dd, although she seems to really love her brother (which is lovely), a lot of the brhaviour is attnetion seeking and now that ds is more into everything and learning to talk etc, obviously he gets praise for new words etc. I really try not to overdo the attention I give him (which, poor boy is far less attention than dd gets anyway!) but I do find getting that balance right is really difficuly. Anyway, good luck with it all.

good post kitkats.

thank you jamieandhismagictorch

'Thank you i'll def have a look at the triad. Don't know if it's a case of me burying my head in the sand as don't know if i could cope with a dx for DS after all we go through with DD (does that sound awful?)

No

I ahve two with autism: DS3 is far more severe- teacher told us that he will be too much for us to care with as an adult (he is verbal but much of it is useless if that makes sense?) and he has been referred to neurology just this week for probable epilepsy

When he satrted nursery (not long after he regressed) ds1 had just been diagnosed: DS1 has AS but is the extreme end of that diagnosis and needs a statement, probably snu at 11 etc.

I am afraid to say we completely balnked ds3's needs to the extent that we barely noticed. Despite being somewhat aware of AS to say the elast, it took a kindly nursery teacher to pull us aside and say this isn't right to get us to even speak to anyone. At that age he was 3+ (pre school yera), non verbal and in nappies.

So I quite understand yes. BUt tbh the earlier your ds gets help if it is AS the better the outcome long term, and that has to be a bonus for you all.

There's some good advice on this thread. Not exactly the same problem but I think quite reassuring. You will get through this and come out the other side with a well-adjusted happy ds.

Thank you all....this has been really helpful and also has made me feel a bit better. Because I do blame myself for where we are i.e. was it because of my parenting skills or lack of them.

Bizarrely we actually had an alright afternoon and surprise he was nice to his sister for a short while. He does get a lot of 1:1 from me as his sister still has a nap in the middle of the day and she goes to nursery 1/2 times a week. Can't think of any reason why he was nice this afternoon (i.e. what might have triggered it).

I do have concerns about some of his behaviour:

he will/not does not play by himself...i.e. he demands that I play with him 24/7 or else he starts whinging/crying

he has in the past been obsessive about 1/2 types of play to the point where he spent all day doing it

in general he does not play with 'toys'

At preschool he is described as solitary....the teacher said that he just ends up annoying the other boys and girls when he tries to play with them. He has not made any friends there

So all of the above in addition to the moods/negativity/grumpiness makes me very sad. It is just so hard to deal with...he continually says no to everything I ask him to do which inevitbaly ends up with me having to take a toy away etc.. I know there are times when I don't help the situation as I get a bit too cross or should ignore a bit more but his behaviour maskes me angry.

It does not help that I am with him all day every day (except when at nursery) and I recognise myself that I need a break to help me cope with his beahaviour. But that is difficult as we do not leave near family etc. who could help out

boythengirl Do you think you'll try and get an assessment? I really think that if you suspect he has SN then this could really help you. What you say about him could be cause for concern or it might well not be, but it sounds like you need some answers, and support

Glad you had a good afternoon with him, i feel so much better and calmer when i get a temporary relief from the behaviour.

Do you have a child health GP at your surgery? If so, i would raise your concerns with them (if nursery have raised any issues i would tell the GP that also). The GP would be able to refer you to a community paediatrician for assessment and/or CAMHS (who also consider whether there may be a condition responsible for his behaviour.)

My DS can also not play with toys and is unable to play by himself but needs either DD or myself to "entertain" him. I think part of this may be that he gets bored easily as he is quite bright. He will, however, spend quite some in the garden making magic potions with mud leaves etc or wanting to produce copy experiments from "Back-yard Science". He also had few friends at pre-school and was very quiet.

However, since starting school he has had no problems making and playing with friends. (I think he was bored beforehand.) He loves school.

Following advice from others on this thread i have looked at the triad, spoken to a close friend and neighbour (who is a paed at GOS) and spoken to someone i know whose child is on the spectrum. They have told me that they don't believe DS has aspergers, although i am still open to CAMHS opinion on this.

My DS, now 5.4, has stated that he wants to see a doctor for a sit down so he doesn't get angry or hurt us. He has also in the last couple of weeks requested a "calm down area" and made it himself last night (with my help) - just a blanket on the floor in the playroom with some books and his pirate ship (chosen a bit randomly as he's never been particularly interested in them before) but i think it makes him feel secure.

Re the time out - do you have a good childminder locally? My DS used to go to a lovely one when i worked - some of the other children would just go for a few hours a couple of times a week so the mums could have some time out.

The other thing that my son likes to do is help me - laying table, dusting, helping me hoover (it's bit slow and only do a couple of paths across the room bit seems to improve his self esteem slightly.)

Just wanted to ask how your DS is when he has time with you when DD asleep. I and other friends have noticed that my DS's behaviour completely different when DD around. Partly why i'm not sure re my son having SN, but more inclined to think attention seeking. For example, all shopping trips used to be a nightmare. Now he's a bit older supermarket with just DS is completely different experience than with both DD and DS.

Like you, my DS does get lots of 1:1 attention but as soon as this stops the behaviour starts.

Hope you get some answers and bit of time out soon.

Oops! Forgot to say, although not the OP, a big, big thank you to all those who have posted on here. I will be getting the book and looking at the other thread.

That's good newfor; do remember many kids vcan have bits of an AS personality- known as traits of- and that it's still soemtimes worth trying ASD type ideas: tehre's a book which ahs soem fabby ideas in that work well with demanding NT kids as well- maybe it would help you and boythen? Boythen have you got anyone you can speak to about your ds?

here you go: I know it says AS in teh title, but really they mean parenting a child who is a bit off centre

Thank you and so sorry- forgot to say (read your post and had to dash off) - i am really sorry to hear re your DS3's referral for epilepsy- best of luck with this.

Sanctimoanyarse - Thanks I am seeing a type of HV at the moment. She has been to see me twice - on the last occasion she
also met DS and of course when she was there he played nicely with toys (that he usually does not touch). She is coming to see me again next week. I know she is being helpful and without sounding ungrateful she does say/suggest the obvious things but we will see......

newlife4us - I am glad although not for you/us that you incur some of these issues as sometomes it feels like your child is the only one in the whole world that is 'challenging'

I wonder if my DS gets bored too... He is by no means easy even when 1:1 with me. But today we have had a good day and I have love bombed him (as per previous posts). I laughed out loud when you said your DS
helps you as my DS would do that all day rather than play with toys. Loves loves hoovering and his latest is brushing the patio. Also if my DH does any DIY type jobs he is straight in there...glad to hear it's not just him!

Had a fantastic weekend with DS - he was amazingly well behaved. Had several outings including the science museum yesterday - no tantrums, no absconding, patiently waiting his turn. Loads of love bombing.

Woke up today and back to square one! Think partly as he's worried about DD. Had a call back to docs on friday - her lfts were highly abnormal so we've got to take her to GOS for liver scan. We explained to her yesterday what was going to happen. He didn't say anything at the time, but ended up sleeping in our bed and then was asking me about it this morning.

Was back to kicking, punching, refusing to sit at the table to eat his porridge. Had thought we'd made some progress!

DS loves DIY with DH too. Washed the patio windows for me the other week (when our house was on the market - we've sold now) with his water pistols and muddy hands. It was an absolute mess but he'd thought he'd done something special. Took me out to admire his handywork and said anyone coming to view would say "i must buy this house with the beautiful window". Praised him for his effort s and had to laugh at his comment but was secretly cursing the fact that i had to re-wash the window!

Promised him he could make a fruit salad tonight, but it'll go one of two ways - either we'll have some nice time together or i'll have strawberries and bananas thrown at the walls - wish me luck!