Can I ask you all to post all you tips for dealing with toddlers hitting and tantrums

[SilveryMoon]

If you have a few minutes, can you please post your tips on how I can deal with my 2.7 year old when he hits/pushes other children and throws tantrums in public.

Atm, I try not to shout at him but I am near to my wits end over it. I know it is normal behaviour for his age, but I'd like to see how all of you deal/dealt with it.
What is reasonable? What worked for you?

SilveryMoon I hadn't intended to go to the softplay part of the restaurant but my friend's friend had already got the table in that area for us arriving so we ended up sitting there for lunch. DS doesn't normally go to soft play, usually only playparks where he plays with other children.

Normally DS eats his lunch in the main part of the restaurant then we got to the outdoor area for him to play. I find he's better outdoors. But do agree with others, if you take them out at certain times of the day when they are v tired then yes, there's going to be tantrums and high likelihood of them hitting out at others. I know this well enough by now but sometimes you can't avoid it if you are meeting a friend for lunch. Most days I would avoid these situations if possible but do have to get out the house, like you OP. I'd go crazy staying indoors!!

I said that is how your post came across, like that is how you intended me to feel. And then you said "you obviously feel you are not being strong enough" which is why I asked you not to assume you know how I am feeling.
Now this back and forth over an initial post that I feel was rude and patronising is not helping my current issue, so lets just move on please.

I havent read all the msgs so sorry if i repeat someone elses advice...

For about 5mins after the incident u ignore the child that did the hitting and give ur full attention to the victim, lots of hugs and 'poor u, u must be hurt'...' u must be feeling sad'...and see what the other kid does...it will teach him that u wont give him attention for that behaviour and empathy for the victim, then when things have calmed down u have a little chat and ask why did he do it? Why was it wrong? What could he do next time (instead of hitting)? and maybe even role play a positive next time it and then end the whole situation with a hug...

My DS2 was 2 a fortnight ago and is on the more aggresive side of normal. We've had problems with biting which have (touch wood) stopped, but been replaced with hiting and pushing. Mainly to his brother (3.5) but also to other children in arguments over toys etc.

We have a time out chair in the hall. We go down the Supernanny route - 1 warning (i.e., do not hit or you will go on the chair) and if it is repeated he is removed. (the chair can also be any chair at the playgroup or the buggy) This is usually for 1 minute. He is always made to apologise for hitting.

To be honest, the main thing I have found is clear and precise warnings which are always followed through, a definate no and why and time out if needed work well for us. It takes patience but perservere and it will work - DS1 is 3.5 and mostly out of it all now.

Yes, I only really do things in the morning. I do like to be at home for lunch and then he can have a nap if it's been a busy morning or just some quiet time.
Today, for example, he was up at 7ish, we have quite relaxed mornings but are normally out by 9:30, went to group at 10:30-12:30 after a trip round the supermarket (him in trolley) and although he wasn't as bad as what he can be, it's still hard work and then at home with the 13 month old was a nightmare. In the end I put ds1 into bed at about 2pm. He laid down quite happily, I pulled the door too and he spent the next hour calling for me in between singing row-row-row the boat. He did not sleep.

Eva yes, I could do that. Will give it a try. Thank you.
smokinaces I have done the supernanny naughty spot for over a year. It is not working for him. He has a warning, I tell him if he hits again he will have to sit in the naughty corner etc.
We are at the stage now where ds1 will hit and then take himself to the naughty chair!

very normal. dd didn't til she was 2.5 but ds does it now (16 months). I think it happens when for whatever reason the emothions they are feeling are bigger than their ability to communicate them in words or gentle actions. Hence ds can't talk - so his emotions are often bigger. dd did it when she was putting up with a very tired and grumpy pregnant mother and when her db born. Ability to communicate generally fine - but very big emotions. It might not be normal to tolerate it and I think it goes away or diminishes (albeit imperceptibly slowly sometimes!)if you give a consequence to the child like removing them from the play if they do it. At very least that seems fairer to the child who's being pushed or hit (and have had dd on the other end too. I never think the child is horrible or badly parented if hitting or whatever. I do feel a bit frustrated when not dealt with at all. I also think it's scary for a child who is very cross not to have an adult del with it somehow, you're their buffer when it all gets too much.

lbl That makes sense. So if my ds1 is experiencing some big emotions that he does not understand, it would not help if I was to shout "stop that now. Go and sit in the naughty corner for pushing x" or whatever I say.
Ds1 has also been on the other end of it, and that is fine, but like you, i do get frustrated when another child isn't dealt with in any manner.
I was at a group last week with a friend. Her ds1 pushed her ds2 over. She wasn't watching, so I told her what happened and she just shrugged

My DD (3.5yo) has never (as far as I am aware!) hit someone in public IYSWIM, but she does tend to hit her brother (12mo) when she gets tired and frustrated.

I know she is doing it because tiredness has caused her patience to run out, but I still make it clear that it is totally unacceptable. She is told to apologise to DS, and is then sent to her bedroom for five minutes (she even sends herself there sometimes !). I then loudly give DS lots of attention and sympathy.

It does seem to be working, but is a tough process, and I sometimes think that the hitting is almost involuntary when they get really frustrated.

However, if DD did this in public, she would get one warning and if she did it again we would go home. I'm not sure it is as common as you suggest though OP, as I very rarely see kids hitting at M&T groups (although plenty of snatching and tantrums!). Unluckily for DS, but luckily for her public image!, DD seems to reserve her bad behaviour for us!

SM, by you saying this has been happening over a year - do you think its related to his sibling coming along? Kind of an attention thing - any attention, even bad for a child is attention.

Do you have anyone to help out? We've found that my mum being able to help out 2 days a week a godsend - one of those days is one on one time for me and DS1 (or DS2 the following week) I also remember when DS1 was 2.5 begging for early nursery time (DS1 was about 12m) and those 2 afternoon sessions a week were a godsend. He would go Tues and Thurs 1-4 and it was wonderful for me, DS1 and DS2. Could you do any nursery sessions before his 3yr allowance?

Glad to see that you are getting some constructive advice Silverymoon but I actually think you need to get a grip of yourself and stop being so touchy with regards to Rasputin. She offered some constructive advice and for you to repeatedly call her patronising and instruct her on her tone is bloody rude when she has taken the time to try and help you.

Thanks Undercova I do see a lot of it tbh and do not know anyone in RL who hasn't been through this with their dc's at some point.
There is alot of stuff in the archieves about it too, so it is kind of common.

I apologise if i'm sounding like I'm jumping down your neck, but there is a part of me that feels I need to defend my 2 year old who is clearly struggling with what is right and what is wrong.

I don't take him home because it can be harder to deal with him on my own than when I have my friends around me (apart from the one I mentioned in PP)

i fink if they take themselves to their time out place it must be working, they are taking responsibility for their actions...plus they may need the time out.(I fink i would be a little proud of that moment) Hope my earleir advice works, consistancy is key but must be super frustrating when other parents contradict it in public...

smokin can't really afford nursery before it's free tbh and my family aren't near to us.

Casmama Maybe I am being touchy, but the reason i am repeatedly calling her patronising is because she is repeadly patronising me.
I am grateful to anyone and everyone who takes the time to offer me advice, of course I am, but I also think I should be able to express my thoughts and feelings on replies. If someone doesn't want to help, or doesn't have anything constructive to say, then i think they shouldn't say anything (including yourself)
I am not a rude person by nature, but as you may be able to imagine, if i feel someone is attacking me personally, my family or my parenting skills, I will get quite upset.
My run-in with rasputin was between us and I don't see how you involving yourself helps anyone really

Thank you Eva, had not thought of it like that

We managed to find a really good one which did 3hour sessions for £10 each - and managed to get it part funded by the SureStart near us. Maybe ring your HV and ask if they do anything similar?

I have had a toddler who has done the hitting thing. It is exhausting and a nightmare, so I really feel for you. My two children are so different, one was a very "easy toddler", one a very challenging child. Every child is different.

Anyway - tips. Just cry to be consistent as you can (which I know is hard on a tired day or when you are with other mums or in a difficult situation). Also, try to remember it is a phase and he is really little. He will grow out of it if you just keep having negative consequences.

I do time out at home with no warnings, time out when we are out and then if he continues we go home after the second time. Pushchair works for time out. I also try to pay as much attention as I can on the victim.

p.s I don't agree with Rasputin.
Hope this helps a bit.

Ok smokin Will do. I am very lucky and my HV is actually really nice.
We wouldn't think we'd qualify for any funding though, but worth asking definitly.

I didnt think I would qualify either, as both me (and exDH as we were together at the time) were working (me part time) but it went on postcode as opposed to being means tested - and on need more than anything.

The other thing I did was find a group which had a creche - like a writing course or something where they had a creche for 2 hours. Gave me time to breathe (and learn something new!) whilst someone else entertained the children! Did Breastfeeding Peer Support training and Health Trainer stuff like this - all free through the Childrens Centre too.

Clare Thank you. I like the typo there 'Just cry to be consistent'
It does help lots. As of tomorrow, I will be bringing him straight home if he hits twice. I will give the first one as a warning (and a telling off obviously) and then we will leave and we will see what happens.
Also, I know there is no over-night cure, so I will stick with it.
I have been thinking of stopping the time out, but maybe I should continue with that too. Maybe as Eva says, that's his way of showing responsibility for his actions

smokin I do that too I signed up for every course going at my local children's centre because of the free creche, I do something every day!
They will not let me state on course evaluation forms that I signed up for the free creche

My DD is nearly 2 and has been hitting, throwing and generally upsetting her older brother who is 4 more and more for a few weeks now.

I could see she wanted his attention and i dealt with the behaviour using the naughty step and warnings consistently.

It didn't really work and she would happily taker herself there, say sorry, and hit him again 2 minutes later. DS is very gentle and she hasn't learned it from him, he never hit her until she started it out of attention seeking and it only happens from him occasionally.

It got to the point where i felt the neighbours must think i just tell them off all the time, and DD went off me for a bit because i was doing a lot of disciplining.

I had a long think about it and realised that if she was trying to get DS's attention, maybe she had tried to get mine positively and failed, so was just going for bad attention. (not necessarily your situation but i hadn't really looked at things from DDs point of view. When i did i felt really bad. She can't understand why i'm washing up etc instead of playing.)

Over the last couple of weeks I have made a big effort to praise her when she does things well, like someone else said it's easy to leave them alone when they're not causing trouble and i have definitely been guilty of that (not saying you have at all!) We all clap her if she walks somewhere nicely, helps me or puts her shoes on etc (DS gets the same positive attention). It has made a massive difference. I have continued with the same consitency over naughty step etc but it has been used less often.

I have also found that giving them a clearer routine has helped. Sounds like you already have that and so do we in some ways, but they didn't really know what it was - now we have posters with pictures of what's going to happen in order e.g. bedtimes, and that has helped both of them so much - they are more in control of what they do.

This may or not be relevant to your situation, but after a few weeks of slipping into a situation where i was angry with them fighting and DDs hitting etc, i have found we have been able to come out of it in a positive way and i feel much better.

You have my sympathy, you must be exhausted after dealing with it for so long! It is totally normal!

Thanks doodle We do have routines, or at least I'm pretty sure we do! Everything just kind of blends together tbh, but the idea of posters up is great. It would be a good activity to do with him too.

My DS loved it too - he was getting quite whiney and he really felt grown up helping to colour in and choose where to put them. And explaining them to DD - she really adores him.

Our biggest success is the "whose turn is it to choose the video in the morning" poster - days of the week with a photo of whoever's turn it is next to the day. They love it and get so excited about seeing whose turn it is they don't mind if it's not theirs (i really don't understand the excitement after several weeks but they're happy with it!)