Separation Anxiety and refusal to sleep - surely no time for controlled crying?

[EugenieM]

Thoughts needed!

My almost 8 month old is absolutely fighting sleep - keeps opening eyes to check that I'm there. Tonight (after an hour and a half) he finally went to sleep only after I sat with him and patted and sshhh'ed and held his hand.

I should also add that he's teething at the moment but despite initial confusion I really think its sep. anxiety that's mucking up his sleep patterns.

Up until now, he's always been fairly easy to get to sleep and happy to drift off himself most nights.

Am I wimping out by not doing controlled crying?

How does controlled crying work when kids are miserable teething/going through this anxious phase.

It just seems a bit counter productive to play hard ball until he's over this hurdle.

First child so slightly in the dark and usually a very happy sociable trouble free little boy!

Thanks!

CC is a tres' flammable topic as you know. IMO, it's never a good thing and I would never do it. However, each their own.
Think you answered your own question though
:"It just seems a bit counter productive to play hard ball until he's over this hurdle."

My DS2 went through a phase of seperation anxiety at just over 2yrs. Wouldn't let me leave the room, needed me there to sleep etc... I tried to be tough for one night and it was awful. I've just been patient, re-assured him and slowly after 3 months, he's so much better and I can leave him to go to sleep himself. I know there is a bit of an age difference between our DS's but if you think its sep anxiety I think it time to make him feel safe - it will pass.

DS is always really clingy at night especially, when he's poorly and we just go with it and sleep in his room if we have to. He then sleeps normally again once he's better. He's 18 months.

no, you aren't wimping out.
your son is going through a normal developmental stage. he NEEDS you there for him and IMO controlled crying will just teach him that you don't come, when he needs you most.
trust your instincts, i don't ever agree with controlled crying, but if i were to do it it certainly wouldn't be when they wre poorly/in the throes of separation anxiety.

a good friend once said to me something along the lines of
"a need that is met will cease to be a need, but a need that is not met will continue to be a need"

which i think is very true. sometimes, by not meeting our child's needs because we think we know best we can change their behaviour, but it jsut means that that need manifests itself in a different way.

here here thisis

Thisisyesterday is right on, IMO. Well said.

thisisyesterday is right. You don't do a thing like CC (which I also hate) when they're ill or needy or feeling vulnerable.

Yep - another vote here against doing CC full stop - it isn't something that you HAVE to do - there are alternatives.
Mothers instinct is always right - as others have said you've answered your own Q

Thank you all so much for your help. Thisis I think you (and your quoted friend) have hit the nail on the head re' an unmet need.
Funny how the things that we would consider doing with a baby (cc) are sometimes not things that we would do in our adult relationships - ie teach leave a loved one who was feeling upset that the way we love them is to come back at 5 minute intervals!

I suppose the thing with controlled crying is that you do tend to hear so much about how it works (and never about when it doesn't) by its proponents and never hear very much from those who have remedied the crying with other (less draconian) methods.

Another post I read says that 8 months for the first phase of separation anxiety is pretty common so I guess I'll be shhhhing and patting for a few more nights to come.

Also I guess every child is different and I've been hearing a lot from friends and relatives who have children who are sleeping through with nary a murmur!

Thanks again.

There will always be ups and dowsn with sleep eugenie - for every child... even those great sleepers will have their phases. Follow your instinct, make your child feels safe and loved and dont compare to other peoples kids - and then really you can't go wrong!

Excellent advice from chooster! Don't compare. I have friend's who have sworn to me their child was sleeping through at 5 days old and only years later have confessed they didn't sleep through for 3 years etc. Myd ds went through a really bad patch from 9 months til 13 months of getting up, not wanting to g to sleep etc but it passed and I never could bring myself to leave him to cry. He just grew out of it. They're all different and you need to do what you feel is right.

Well done Thisis, was dreading having to argue the case but you have done it so well! OP that's great - though in addition to shhing and patting I would also advocate picking up and cuddling

Worked for us, anyway.

chooster is right, all children have ups and downs with sleep. just as adults do.

my almost 5 year old slept beautifully from day one, waking 4 hourly on the dot for feeds- 10pm, 2am, 6am.
he slept through at around 5 months.

now he is going through a rough patch. he comes into our bed most nights, and wakes frequently crying or just talking rubbish in his sleep.

i was saying to a friend the other day that there seems to be this real grey area with sleep. people expect a newborn to wake frequently, and they are happy to feed/cuddle etc. then you get this patchy area from around 6months to maybe 2 years where we just expect them to be able to sleep all night.
and then once they're older if they wake in the night we once again tend to them- perhaps ebcause they'r emore able to tell us what the matter is?

my point is (if you've got this far) that we'll happily tend to a newborn, or to an older child, but for that middle stage we expect sleep sleep sleep.
it's really quite bizarre!

I admire all you people who can keep sane enough to cuddle to sleep and not do the cc thing (which i also hate) but what on earth do you do when the cuddling to sleep thing becomes a habit and they're waking up for a cuddle constantly? My 9 mo has got to the point where he will not go down in his cot at all or even in my bed! I have to cuddle him all night, otherwise he seems to panic and become really distressed. He seems to have been going thru seperation anxiety for a couple of months which i know should eventually pass but even before that he wouldn't really go in his cot. Any tips anyone? there's vague talk of other strategies but i've tried sitting patting him and he just stands up in his cot and screams and eventually gets a second wind and starts to grin at me etc then cries again etc etc

i don't always have patience believe me! there are times when i have shouted at one or other of the children because i'm at the end of my tether and absolutely shattered.

please don't think any of us are supermums or anything like that. Personally I think there are very real risks to a child from being left to cry, and so even when I am at the end of my tether it is something I'm thinking about, and I certainly couldn't leave any of them to cry repeatedly over several days.

I HAVE left them to cry, when I have been so over-wrought that it's the safest thing to do. And I have left them being comforted by Daddy while I go and have a cup of tea and a calm down and then can return to the feeding to sleep thing anew!

re not being able to let go, I had this badly with ds2 who was a really high-needs baby. I had a technique that I used for quite a while to "escape" from him, if you will!
first I would lay us both down on the bed and feed him to sleep. Then I'd wait. I'd wait for a good 5-10 minutes at least because it takes them that long to get into a deep sleep- if you rty and leave/move them before they're in a deep sleep they will wake, and it all starts over.
so, anyway, you've left it plenty long enough, you can move their super-floppy arms and legs without them waking. deep sleep.
next, you grab a nearby cushion/pillow/rolled up pyjamas (good to have your smell on them)
then you gradually, gradually, very slowly start to roll away from baby. as you roll away (so slowly!) you replace your body with the cushion/pillow/whatever.
basically try and get off the bed however it takes that means you make minimal disturbance/movement to baby.
if the baby stirs during any of this then shush and pat and stay very still!!!

eventually you should be able to get away!
I also had a copy of the no-cry sleep solution that I got when he was around 9 months old, and we did introduce a comforter and a dummy. using these meant I cut the night feeds down from hourly to just 2 or 3 a night. he still woke frequently, but I could normally get him back to sleep with the dummy

he sleeps just fine now!

It is fairly easy if you are co sleeping and feeding to sleep, that's what I'm doing and unless he's been teething badly or otherwise in distress, he;s always slept really well...I've just laid next to him and he's gone back to sleep with boob.

It's been a bit annoying at times but much easier than getting him to sleep any other way as I don't have to stand up or leave the bed

This is the lazy way
I am definitely not a supermum.

occasionally he's been hungry as well, I mean wanted something like a biscuit etc, if he's just sitting around on the bed at 2am grinning at you saying 'wake up mummy'

sometimes something solid to eat helps.

i semi-co-sleep lol
started off out of necessity with ds2, although i never slept that well because i was all squished up on one side. but it was better than having him crying all night

nowadays I am so knackered that ds3 starts off in the cot, then i feed him in bed for his first feed of the night and I usually fall asleep feeding him lol

Thanks for advice. Sorry for delay in answering, its not that i wasn't bothered, just have felt too knackered to get on computer before going to bed which is when i normally find time to do it! thisisyesterday - how old was your ds when you did the rolling away thing? mine is 9 months and i'm scared to leave him on the bed asleep , even with a bed guard on, in case he wakes up and crawls over the edge!might work in the middle of the night tho when I'm in bed wanting my arm back ! might try feeding him in eveing with rolled up pjs so he can cuddle into them and hopefully lower him into the cot with them all snuggly next to him. must admit ds won't take a dummy(cos he's got me!) but maybe i need to persevere. will keep you posted
flight attendant- i do what you do but i'm finding it really uncomfortable and long to go to sleep without my constant attachment, much as i love him! also, does your LO go to bed at the same time as you? either me or hubby has to hold/cuddle ds all evening which is a bind especially if one of us needs to be out. would be sooo handy if i could get ds to go to sleep in cot in the evening even if he ended up in bed with me later in the night!! sorry to moan everyone, just finding it hard at the mo!!

was definitely still doing it at 9 months, which is when i got my copy ofd ncss lol

i wasn't too worried as we had his cot pushed up against the side of the bed anyway so he couldn't go far.
plus, he used to wake with a heart-rending scream lol, so we'd just rush up and get him

I agree with the others.
I still lie down with my ds for him to go to sleep. Have always done this and will continue for the foreseeable future as I do not think of it in a negative way.
It takes 10 mins now max and I can creep downstairs by 7.30-7.45pm ish at the latest.

It did take longer when he was 9-18 months and I did get frustrated at times when I wanted to relax downstairs on sofa.
He is 2.9 now and we have got a good system now, once he stopped napping at about 2 it got much easier as he was genuinely tired and wanted to sleep.

Trust your own instincts.

This thread has made me feel so much better about the fact that I am having to sit and hold my DD's hand each night until she goes to sleep. It usually only takes 5-10 mins so I feel v unjustified being annoyed by it now I read what some of you are having to do. She is 2.5yrs and only started this on my return to work following maternity leave with DS. Is this a kind of separation anxiety? She openly says that she doesnt want me to go to work and wants me to stay with her all night. If she wakes she will cry out and come into our bed, usually around 5am but has been earlier on occasions. She shares a room with DS (10 mo) so havent even considered cc an option although have used it in the past. Most people I have asked for advice make me feel like I am being too soft giving in to her and making a rod for my own back by not being tougher so this is v refreshing. I am hoping that it will pass as she gets used to the changes. I considering making up a bed on the floor next to hers so that I can lie next to her when she wakes in the night and hold her had rather than let her into our bed. I have tried getting in to her bed with her but it is a toddler bed and v uncomfortable!!! Maybe i should stop beating myself up about it and just go with it for a bit longer to see if she gets better on her own.