Not doing very well at being a mum-of-two...help me please!

[traceface]

OK, here's where I'm at:
DD1 - 5.5 yrs
dd2 - 12 months
Me - failing to meet everyone's needs!
My dd1 is so emotional at the moment, crying at the slightest little thing (eg. dropping something, not being able to put her pants the right way round, being asked to do anything...). She is getting so upset all the time and also being quite naughty, refusing to do as she's told. She is constantly wanting my attention and won't get on with an activity on her own (wants me to colour with her, cuddle her all the time, play hide and seek, play whatever...). She seems very tired and pale, so much that I took her to the GP and she had some blood tests to check everything was normal - which it is.
My dd2 is a happy delight and is crawling at lightening speed. Whatever I give her to play with, all she really wants to do is be with her sister! If dd1 is playing with something on the floor, dd2 goes and grabs it, even if I'm there with them and trying to stop that happening. Then dd1 moves and does a table activity, and dd2 just crawls over, pulls herself up on dd1's chair and stands grabbing her clothes, saying "aaaah" and wanting to be picked up so she can join in. She is also quite demanding in a normal-for-her-age kind of way, mainly wanting me and no-one else will do, crying when I leave the room or put her down so I can concentrate on dd1, then beaming when I pick her back up.
So - from the moment I wake (or more accurately am woken!) I am being pulled in every direction and usually have dd1 in tears within minutes of being awake because I am busy getting breakfast for us all, changing d2's nappy, rather than sitting down with her 1-1. When dd2 naps we try to have dd1 time, where we do things with little bits that we can't do with dd2 around, but I also need that time to do other stuff that needs doing (washer on, going to the loo!). DD2 doesn't sleep through so I guess I'm running on low batteries, and am not sure where to go with this. Also (prob not relevant) I had pretty severe PND after dd1 and again mildly with dd2 and am still on my meds.
I've spoken to my HV who said I might benefit from a parenting group. She was going to look into what was available and get back to me within a few days - that was over a month ago!So... How much do I give 1-1 time with one child and let the other one cry? How much should I try to find joint activities? How much of this is normal? I'd love to get some practical tips - and tell me where I'm going wrong (or going right if I am at all!).
If you've ploughed through this - thank you!

It sounds like hell. All I can think is you are very busy meeting everyone elses needs except your own. Maybe just now.you need some recuperation.a day or half a day off doing only what would make you feel human and cared for.a bubble bath with wine and candles?.a magazine in bed. a good walk on your own.whatever it takes to give you back the strength to cope with what is a difficult scenario.two young kids. I've two of a similar age. I get a childmainder to take one or both kids from time to time just to even up the balance of attention and give me some air. Any family that can help you?

what I forgot to say is that both girls are very loving and dd1 is often telling me she loves me and showering me with kisses - it's not all bad!

Yes, you need some "me" time.

Your daughters will be fine!

This is a very tricky situation. I've been there with three year old and twins. My advice from my experience is not to expect too much of the five year old. (My seven year olds are still pretty rubbish at getting dressed!) Give her LOTS of love. Tell her how much you love her often.

Be patient especially after school when she is tired and cranky. Always meet her with a snack. If she feels more secure I think her behaviour may get a bit easier.

Also - just tell yourself this is really hard time. Everyone would struggle with it. It will get easier as your kids get a bit older.

this isn't the same but I have a 3.5yr old, a just 2 yr old and a 6mo old and struggle to give 1-1 to each.
Do you have OH around to help? we enrolled ds1 into evening (6.30pm) swimming lessons and one of us takes him, he thinks thats great 1-1.

I also lowed my expectation of quality 1-1, I try and do activities with ds1 but most of the time I'm too knackered by 1pm when other 2 go for naps and have been reassured by HV that sitting on sofa together watching and talking about cbeebies programme does = quality time

ds2 gets loads of time with me when ds1 is at preschool in mornings - is dd1 at school? I find I can get rid of some of the guilt by doing something with ds2 and 3 in the morning or even having quiet morning at home and doing some jobs before ds1 gets home - I find he is the one who demands more of my attention/is high maintenance, if I start an activity with ds1 I try and just do that with him.

I also 'baby' the boys sometimes, the older two have to take their coats, shoes and hats off and put them away but most other things I help them with (usually for speed). I have to constantly remind myself to be positive when they do something good, it seems to have a positive affect on ds1 and he has become more helpful, getting nappies for ds3 and taking plates from the table.

Not sure what else helps, being very clear about what you are doing and the order of things - ie I just need to cahnge nappy and then I will get you juice and sticking to it, same way with sticking to threatened punishment to combat naughtiness

Best 1-1 is bedtime for us, can you get dd2 to bed a bit earily and read stories with dd1? sometimes can be a nice end to crap day and leaves her going to sleep feeling reassured and secure? (imo sometimes very hard to do when you just want to throw them in bed and get on with all the jobs so you can go to bed but I think worth 'acting' for and doing)

I def agree that me time will help, fwiw I had PND with ds1 and have been lucky not to with other 2, its tough and makes the guilt much worse, surround yourself with people who can support you and know (and hopefully) tell you what a great job you are doing, know when its all getting too much and take time out

i have exactly the same age gap between my two dcs (apologies for lack of punctuation duff keyboard) ds is six and a half and dd just coming up to two

in my case ds is a very loving little boy but still needs his mummy time and dd is demanding in the way only toddlers can be

one thing i always try to remind myself is that this will get better as they get older but for the time being practical tips are to make sure your dd1 has allocated mummy/daddy time it's hard for us as we both work full time but in the evening dd goes to bed an hour before ds so that is his time when we read play games etc and at the weekend when dd has her nap this is also his time He knows when it is and always knows that he will get his time I really think this helps

time for yourself is another key thing Again this is easier said than done but when dd2 has her nap have you got an oh who can give dd1 'her time' while you have a bath, read a book etc. Also, have you got anyone who could help out by having dc's for a couple of hours here or there once in a while so that you can have some time to recharge your batteries. That really helps.

HTH. I know how tough it is juggling but dd2 is at her most demanding stage right now and it will get better

Presumably your 5.5 is at school during the day (not today I realise?)

Make sure DD1 gets small bits of undivided attention and pop the baby in a playpen with toys/jolly jumper or similar if needs be to keep them away for a bit. The older child does need to feel special and have some alone time with you as well. I felt like I was always saying to the older one 'Just a minute when I've sorted out DD2' over and over again. Don't keep asking DD1 to help you get things etc

Have a joint tea/bed/bath routine but put the baby to bed earlier and have some time with your older child reading stories together.

I made some time for myself when the baby was having a long sleep 12.30 - 2.30, I did not do housework and instead read a book or magazine and put my feet up. It was mummys lunch hour. Or you could go for a long walk whatever you would get the most benefit from.

Hi - thanks for the replies. Sorry i couldn't get on-line yesterday.
Yes my dd1 is at school full time, and I work part time, so I have some days on my own with dd2 and then weekends and after school time all together. I guess having a 2 week holiday all together has just amplified how thing have been heading over the past few months.
Yes i have a DH who is fab with the girls and also very helpful round the house, and we're both finding we have the same 'issues' with the girls and how to entertain them both. Apart from having a child 'each' IYSWIM.
After most school days there is an hour between dd1 and I coming home and DH bringing dd2 home from nursery, so we do have 1-1 time then. Also DD2 goes to bed 6pm and dd1 between 6.30 and 7pm, so again she gets nice parent time with cuddles/tv and story and prayers before bed.
I guess really I just don't know how to handle the 2 of them together or whether I'm expecting too much that they would be able to play together at their ages. I really can't leave the room with them both in it.
The playpen suggestion is helpful. We have a travel cot which could work as a playpen - it would cause immense frustration for my active little bean but at least I would know she's safe.
I think the thing that's hardest is dd1's mood and emotions - so much crying! I'm sure her peers don't cry so much. It took 45 mins to get her socks and shoes on to go out yesterday (couldn't compromise as we were going for a snowy walk - which she wanted to do!) just because she wasn't comfy so she has a total meltdown and was hysterical.
Thanks for the tips and encouragement More advice gratefully accepted!

trace - no real advice, but just wanted to say, I'm sure you are doing its fantastic job - its just a hard one, but you do brilliantly! I think we all assume once you get past the baby toddler stage everything gets easy, but 5 year olds have increasingly complicated emotional needs.

Reading your OP this was me five years ago! I have 2 DDs, 5 years apart, and I also suffered with PND with both (to a lesser extent with DD2). I'm so sorry you're feeling so stressed - are you quite an uptight person generally (I know I am) and keep pushing yourself to meet everybody else's needs and feeling that you're just not good enough? I think a lot of it is down to our personality - another more laid-back mom would not be so upset, but it doesn't make you less of a mother.

I do still get stressed now but it tends to be about other issues to do with the children - problems change along with their age - but I do remember having very similar issues with my two when they were very young, in fact, I had a constant guilt-trip about not giving DD1 enough attention.

You can only do your best and I would second what other posters have said - is there any way you can get practical support from family or friends just to get you out of the situation for a couple of hours on a regular basis?

As a consolation I feel things are generally easier now my two are older (they are 11 and 6) and they are very loving towards each other and great company. It's worth the hard work in the long term - they'll be sisters (and hopefully friends) for life!

Good luck.

oh you lovely ladies, now you've made me cry .
yes rth that's me! thank you for the encouragement. glad to hear there's light at the end of the tunnel

Hi there
Just wanted to say that I work PT and have a 3.5 year old and now 12 month old. 3.5 year old DS is quite an emotional highly strung child who is still quite clingy to me and I find some days now DD is coming up to one I don't know which way to turn. On my days "off" DS is at pre-school for the morning so i get one on one time with DD - when DS gets home from pre-school I get DD off to bed and then we have our lunch together and chat about pre-school or other stuff. He then watches some tv whilst we wait for DD to nap and get up - sometimes I sit with him (with laptop !) and pass comment on the goings on on the telly. Afternoons are either with friends or out and about .

I use the travel cot a lot - I put DD in there with some toys and even though she might moan and whinge to start with she gets used to it - it's a godsend even if I need just 10 mins to do something with DS (like maybe a puzzle or something) or if I need to do something in the kitchen and know she's safe or if I come in from the car and need to get stuff out without her following me out the door !....I don't feel guilty as it is the best and safest place for her at certain times - she's a nifty crawler now.

I also try to put dd to bed 10/15 mins earlier than DS even if I then leave her in her cot to settle down with the light on for a few mins. I can then bathe DS on his own and he can play with his toys and chat. We also get a story together. Once DD gets a bit older and she's not trying to nick the book rather than listen to the story then we can all do storytime together but for now, this is the best way. I find DS a bit tricky sometimes at bedtime as he's tired and this is always a flashpoint for tears and strops so I find if I am calm it makes life easier.

Do you have willing family nearby? I was off for most of christmas but had a shed load of chores to do - my lovely mum had the kids for a few hours one day and I got lots of stuff done and felt so much better. Like another poster I also try to do something for me at lunchtime whilst DD is in bed and DS is watching TV sometimes I watch something I want to on the iplayer or read my book - I make a pact with myself to do chores for part and me time for the rest.

Sorry this is long ! but hope you find something to make life a bit easier

Loads of good, practical advice on here from people who know, but just wanted to offer sympathy really and say that ANYBODY would find all that challenging (and with work as well) and I am worrying that I would encounter the same difficulties if I had another DC. Also, Trace, if I may say so, I think you set yourself amazingly high standards and should be a bit kinder to yourself. I bet your DH and your girls think you are fantastic (which you are).

I just posted exactly the same age gap problem in another thread.
It just is hard I think when you are so. Tired. Which makes it harder to feel up and creative in getting round it. Having said that, we dance a lot! Tag with dd1 whilst carring dd2 works, if tiring. I got some lightweight skittles for dd2 and we all take turns with the ball. Well. Dd2 runs through them and we laugh at her but it passes the time.
Im glad its not just me who feels rubbish and a bit beaten!
Good luck. Tomorrow another day.

Hello, sounds like v hard work. I have had similar feelings in diff curcumstances (2.5 yr gap) and it does sound like you are doing a fab job so don't get down!
One outsider observation is that perhaps your eldest is aware if your depleted energy/patience/ enjoyment and this is making her teary. My DS keeps asking me if i'm happy as I think I'm so knackered I forget to smile! I think it you can relax a little then perhaps it will all fix.
Also... I sometimes feel guilty for having two as if having DD took something from DS. I'm trying to reprogram myself into thinking more positively and rather than bending over backwards for DS I've started to expect him to share me more now as this IS normal and surely the main thing kids learn from being a sibling. So be happy, kind but strong about boundaries and some time of neglect ! (easier said than done- I'm trying to do the same on a daily basis!!).

I think if you can find a way/ activity that all would do together you'd have an epihany as sounds like you needs some team of three activities to enjoy!
Duplo, with a five year old theme!?
Big floor painting? (body parts painting and rolling / funny and both would like if u can bear the mess?!)
Cooking with eldest in charge and toddler stirring/washing up??!!!
Maybe someone else would have better ideas !

Dancing!!!

My two girls are coming up 6 and 4 so I have different issues but wanted to reassure you that my 5 yr old is an emotional nightmare at the moment. I too suffered PND (off meds now so VERY SHOUTY AGAIN!!)...maybe our daughters are just too much like us? .

Reckon we are doing a decent job really and I try to look back on the day and remember the nice bits...you will find some...think hard!

My DP is stuck up in Scotland with our car that died up there on hols...I came back on the train (14 hours!!) with the girls to start school and the bloody school has never opened. All of a sudden I am a single, carless, snowed in f/t mother of two.

It'll all be fine once they leave home.