Hand flapping in dd....

[tackyChristmastreedelivery]

.....I think I know that dd is too young for this to be an interesting trait that might point to a ASD type thing. But if I can't wonder out loud here where can I ?

DD is only 11 months, and flaps her arms when excited. SHe clenches and unclenches her fists too.

She also pats her head, left side only, and hits it with hard things. She especially like wolloping her left side with knives and forks.
So - normal stuff in this age group? or worth watching? I don't remember anything like this with dd1, but then I am rubbish at that sort of thing.

Hi Tacky, your posts are refreshing to read Its lovely to hear that you are observent and come what may it would not be the end of the world, amen to that!

Thought I would tell you a little about my DS who is 4.5. I had my suspicions that "something wasn't quite right" about a year ago. He has mild ASD traits that mainly show up in his speech, imaginative play and social interactions. None of them stand out to most people, but I can see them clearly. Paed said she agreed he was probably somewhere on the spectrum but that his outlook was excellent and that it was highly unlikely to require intervention but I am keeping an open opinion on that if I see he is struggling when he starts school. He is a lovely happy little boy and his little 'quirks' are what make him an individual

As the others have said, stay vigilant and most of all let her be herself. She sounds an absolute delight

Thanks Barmymummy, I am very very open minded about these things. Who knows what is rounf the corner. Although that said I have never been tested really, none of us really know how we would react I suppose. I'm glad your ds is a happy little man, all that matters really.
I think if we sat and look at nearly everyone on the planet they would have a 'little something'.

mimsum - he sounds a star!

You are absolutely right Can see some 'special' qualities in my DH & dad lol! Fab blokes both of 'em

Hello troublewithtalk.

She is begining to make meaningful sounds, she copies us when we 'Oh-Oh' in a singsong voice. V cute. She is quite cheerfull and smiley overall. Very very early days like you say. No lining up or anything, but she is just begining to play really.

Will mention it all to HV next wed. See what they say - I'm sure she'll say it's ear;y days really.

Hello there again tree!

Just thought I'd join in and mention what you I think know already, that my dd1 handflaps and always has done. It's always been a sign of excitement and happiness. She used to dance from foot to foot when she was younger, too. It is very sweet, but as she is now 5 I do wish she would stop purely because none of her friends do it and I don't think it is going to be socially helpful.

I think she is dyspraxic, but we haven't got a diagnosis as yet - just going through the hoops with the OT at the moment. But if she is dyspraxic, it only affects quite specific things I think - large motor skills really, and perhaps a bit of fine motor stuff but her teacher thinks her handwriting is great. She's not keen on colouring etc though, so I wonder if it's because she finds it hard work.

Anyway, thus far I don't think it affects much else - her language is pretty amazing (makes up wonderful poems and stories), she is full of empathy (to the point of being tearfully oversensitive sometimes), very imaginative (perhaps a bit too much so) and she is pretty good at puzzles and working out patterns etc.

She didn't walk till 17 months, which I think perhaps should have been a clue, but really I didn't start to think anything was wrong till she was about three and a half. But then I didn't know there was any potential issue related to the flapping and dancing.

It doesn't sound as though your dd2 is autistic spectrum really, does it? From what I've read, children with no issues do sometimes flap, as well as dyspraxics and children on the spectrum.

Hello dear!

I hadn't realised it was as far along as OT and what have you. Are you hoping for somesort of diagnosis or decision as a result of the meetings? What might that lead too, it doesn't sound like she needs help in school - although I may have that totally wrong. I guess the more info and heads up we have for them the better.
Your dd sounds like such an artist. I think if I were an artist and had creative imagination, colouring would be a totally boring PITA. Who wants to stay in lines anyway, when there are swirls and curls to be achieved.
I know what you mean about the social side of things, as we know school is tough. We all worry about anything that might make them likely to be singled out. Yet the way mimsum described her little boy, he sounds so happy and part of that must be from whatever need flapping meets.If that makes any sense at all!

I think that's what made me look with interest at dd2. She just looks so happy when she is sat having a flap Really in to it.

I agree on the whole, I think my dd is just flapping because she can. Interesting though, we'll see.

OMG it's like a foreign language! This is why I would need early warning on these things, to get to grips with what the bejaysus a sensory modulation is

So the crux is that development milestones don't always offer insight into what is going on troublewithtalk? That a child could walk and meet other significant milestones, but still need input in other areas?

Is it true that children with spectrum things can loose skills they had? Sorry to buttonhole you . I'm interested for dd's sake, but also because it is an interesting world, especially when you have zero experience of it.
My uncle is SN, but I don't see him much. He lives in residential care in another part of the country to me, his mental age is considered about 10 I think. He's the youngest looking man of his age I know [late 40's, you'd guess early 30's]. Slightly off topic there!

Ah yes the MMR. Between this flapping, and the dairy intolernace I have to say I think we will hold off. She will have it a little later I think.
They say though that alot of the clues and delays become apparent around mmr time don't they. Maybe a red herring? I still think we'll leave it for a while though. Mahoosive worry.

Bless him feeling under pressure. I guess we the parents find the microsocope welcome as it gives us the information we need to parent, but they might find it intense.

So much to think about! I think I'll feel wuite relieved when I mention it on Wedensday. Although I guess the HVs might not have a clinic given the time of year.

I know of two four year olds and a 14 moth old who developed "typically" and then "regressed" to 16 months and 12 month developmentally.

Troublewithtalk have you ever read, 'Raising a Sensory Smart child". I really loved that book and it helped me get a grip on understanding sensory issues from a child's perspective.

I can't really decide what I'm trying to achieve, tree. She is apparently doing well at school (whatever that means at this stage!), though I'm not sure whether she's managing to make proper friends. She isn't great in a large group and tends to want one intense friendship or else retreats to play on her own with invisible friends. I may be overanalysing everything, I can't tell!

You're right, she can be a bit of an artist, but I have to say she is one with a rather dark side. Her creations are a bit stark, and she's not one for colours or glitter.

Other mothers tell me she is obviously v bright and I shouldn't worry about her as she is just fine... but I do worry dreadfully about her as although she is fab in lots of ways she is a bit of a curious and complicated character and I can't help being anxious about her and whether she will manage her school friendships OK.

She definitely has some sensory issues and gets frightened by the movement of a swing or roundabout or similar.

I keep being told that if there are gross motor problems there will almost certainly be fine motor issues too, so I am working on the assumption that getting a diagnosis and an action plan at an early stage will help prevent any of the possible problems that dyspraxics may have at school. If indeed it is dyspraxia. I worry like mad, partly because I can't tell whether her individual quirks are just her being her, or have something to do with her inability to skip and her flapping iyswim.

Possibly coincidentally, she was dreadfully constipated as a baby and toddler, and still tends that way now.

I think, in my total lack of experience simplistic way, that with any disorder [is that the right word?] of this sort, the quirks and the condition will be inseperable. Which means we are all on the spectrum, we all have quirks. That to me makes sense. I have quirks, and indeed some of them do affect my life. However, society would never really notice them and they do not stop me performing my work. Which seems to be the major way we are judged in the west. Lucky us

I guess with dyspraxia, autism, and all these spectrum thingies, they are almost defined by what we consider a good working amount of quirks. When do our quirks tip over into something that is beyond our management. Something that means we cannot do things that are normal for our age and lifestyle.
Well, that is going to depend on who you are, how you live, what you plan to do with your life I guess.

My uncle has quirks coming at you from all directions. He enjoys listening to music [but to the nth degree], collecting retro music centres [but to the nth degree], he works in a sheltered environment making garden stuff. His quirks are no more an issue than mine really. So we all see him as nothing special now, really. He has no special needs to us anymore, his lifestyle is his special need - and as it is entirely built to suit him, he fits it. It doesn't look wrong, or like he is different or special in the least anymore. He absolutely could not go and be a high court judge or a surgeon. Of this I am certain. He hasn't the coordination, or the attention span. That doesn't really matter to him though.

If I were his parent, it would take some getting used to though. I fully imagine my dd's will be entirely able to become artists, scientists, Nobel prize winners, brilliant muscians - whilst dancing at the Royal Ballet at the weekends. Slightly unrealistic, but then I dunno. They seem pretty amazing to me If dd2 has a thingie, or either of them aquire a something, that will be hard. Changing the silly daydreams to reflect reality.

I have no idea how these ramblings are supposed to answer your post Aranea but they do help me. To seperate what I want for my girls, from what I want for myself from my girls. If that makes sense. Which I doubt

I think that your worry must be insane and intense, because I have it for dd1 [and maybe dd2 too], but that your dd will be ok. As will mine. You will be sick with worry, but your hard work and behind the scenes work and planning and thinking will mean she feels really at home in her world. Thats normal parenting isn't it? We do that stuff all the time. If she is dyspraxic you will need some help with it all, but you will do it.
I have a dd1 who is an odd ball, just isn't cast in the same mould as the other girls going about with glitter and barbies and best friends and so on. Mine is more likely to be sat on her own making a house for a pretend snail made from loo roll. Worries me to tears. She is constipated too.

What is with these girls? Anyone know of studies looking at bowel habits and the spectrum disorders?

Disclaimer: I do not expect anyone to read that post . I think I resorted to a diary entry there!

Thanks for that link troublewithtalk. Makes me also realise how really early dd2 is to assess for autism at anyrate.

There is also a reseach tril in middlesborough I think. I'll try find the site. I spoke to the lead when we found out about dd2's dairy intolerance. I have some concerns about the MMR and gut permeability, as do they, for a very select few children. Trouble is knowing if you have one of the select few children.

Was your ds constipated troublewithtalk? I'm sorry to hear he had birth trauma and had to have resusitation. How awful for you too.