New baby brings LOTS of problems with 2yr old dd

[lecohen]

Hi all,

I recently had another girl (she is coming up to 6 weeks) but unfortunately her arrival has brought about A LOT of problems with dd1 who is 2 yrs and 3 months.

Sleep
Refuses to nap in afternoon even though she is absolutely buzzing with exhaustion...she does eventually crash after a great deal of resistance.

Night time is better but not by much.

Wakes up at the slightest noise and comes to look for us.

Almost daily up 6am even if goes to bed later

It didn't help we had to change cotbed to bed mode (same time as baby's arrival) as she kept climbing out and it became dangerous.

We did stop giving her dummy recently as her teeth were becoming pushed out but she took it really well and instantly forgot about it.

Aggression / Tantrums / Disobedience

She has always been strong and assertive but now she pinches, scratches and bites other kids and dd on a regular basis (particularly on face)

She throws tantrums without provocation all the time - Last saturday she actually woke up with a tantrum and was in a stroppy mood all day - until she went to bed.

She ignores what we say and repeats her bad actions no matter how we tell her not to - nicely and quietly or with a forceful shout and being put in the corner.

She does seem to respond better to our harsher methods.

OK, we understand that she has been going through A GREAT DEAL of changes and we have been very patient with her and giving her more love and time but we can simply no longer tolerate her bad behaviour.

My hub is back at work after taking a nice break to help out and when it's me and her, I feel like I can't cope - I dread what mood she will be in when I pick her up from pre-nursery and what they will tell me that she has done and to whom.

I know a lot of this behaviour is "normal" but when will it stop and please can I have some tips on managing them and keeping sane along the way.

Just to add, I am breastfeeding and getting very little sleep - I am shattered to say the least!

Many thanks in advance

How do you discipline her?

My DS won't do this, oh no he won't.

I only ask because it sounds like she is behaving badly for attention. Other than protecting your DS2 from getting scratched, it might be worth ignoring naughty behaviuor as much as you can but then giving lots of praise when she behaves. Do you include her in looking after her little sister?

Actually, I have just made myself read your post and DS does all this anyway before the new arrival. (In fact, he is possibly worse )

Sorry, meant DD.

If you say she responds better to you being strict than you need to be strict consistently i guess. You can still give her lots of attention and love.

My DS liked to help out with the baby by getting nappies etc.

My son is older but took a few weeks to adjust. Now we have found a new routine and he has accepted the baby into the family.

[joins suwoo in denial corner and chants 'ds will be fine, ds will behave' loudly]

just out of curiosity... how did you prepare her for the baby? was there alot of 'you're the big girl now' and 'you're not the baby now'... because she really is still a baby and i know how impossibly hard it is to remeber that at this stage with a new baby (18 months between my older 2) as the older toddler seems so big and brawny and vocal compared to the new arrival but honestly, when they're 2/2.5 with no younger sibling they really are still a baby in your eyes..... i think of ds at 2yrs6months as being so babyish compared to how i expected dd to behave when he was born and it makes me cringe at how grown up and well behaved we expected her to be

2 is still a baby, she's a bigger baby than your newborn granted but she is still a bbay and exhausting as it is having 2 babies in the house... trying to force her to be more grown up than she's emotionally capable of being will only make the situation more stressful.

spoil her a little and as much as possible try to ignore the bad and praise the good and make sure that she knows she's loved just as much as the baby.

obviously the hitting and biting are serious and you can't ignore them but try not to get too worked up.... make her apologise and tell her each time that it's not nice to hurt others but otherwise try not to get too worked up about it.... it's just a phase, it doesn't mean she's turning into a violant psychopat, just that she's confused and angry and expressing that the only way a child of her age knows how.

good luck, it does get better as they get older, close age gaps are lovely as they get older..... that's what i keep telling myslef anyway as i'll have 3 with 4 years between oldest and youngest next month

honestly... i can spell

can i come and sit in the denial corner?
am worrying about how dd is going to take to our new arrival in march!

i agree with 2-year olds still being babies though....my dd is 2.9 and still likes to be babied...when she is especially tired she demands to be carried 'like a tiny baby'

am just going to try and not expect too much of her when the time comes i think (easier said than done i know...especially when you are knackered with a newborn I'm sure!)

i had exactly 2 and 3 mos between my pfb and baby sister~yikes is all i can say!!!!
accept its a VERY tough age gap becos old enough to be jealous and "dethroned",still very little so is expressed in aggression etc
~be kind and gentle to your fb despite exhaustion
~get friend/childminder for bit of extra help even for baby
~try to be relaxed when you are all 3 together
~explain baby part of family for dd and you to love but fb is mums love etc etc
~check with dr you're not anaemic,i was cos of pg and bfing
~get your dp to do alternate bed times one child each so is fair[mine didn't but should have]
~keep routine going as is reassuring,and stay home for at least half the day for you all to bond and not get too tired.
~Include fb as much as can
huge sympathies,can remember going into bedroom to bf it was so frought at times!!
oh forgot the most important thing,don't blame yourself for this,its not your fault,your fb really lovesyou and her anger is just cos her mums been taken away[in her eyes]she will not grow up with behaviour probs it is temporary expression of her strong feelings

What if baby is your third then?

I have exactly 2 yrs between DD1 and DD2 and went through a VERY similar time to you. Firstly, it DOES get better, I promise. They are now great friends (although they argue lots too, they are utterly adorable together most of the time). I strongly agree with PinkTulips saying remember that your DD is still a baby too. I look back and realise I expected far too much from DD1 when DD2 was born. DD2 is now just on 2 and to me she's still a funny cuddly baby and yet when DD2 was born I somehow saw DD1 (the 2) as so much older and bigger and I know now that my expectations were far too high.

I went through a downward spiral of getting more and more angry with DD1 for her behaviour and her behaviour getting worse and worse. We were getting nowhere so I took some advice (from on here in fact) and changed tack completely. I took extreme deep breaths and did my UTMOST to ignore all bad behaviour for a bit. If she did something truly awful (e.g. biting DD2) I removed her calmly and swiftly without any shouting or anger - a simple 'NO, we don't bite' and left her for 5 mins on her own(say in her room - usually kicking and screaming and tantrumming). i.e. no attention at all for bad behaviour. Lots and lots of praise and attention for good behaviour and loads of cuddles and hugs and stories and attention when DD2 was asleep. This approach was realy hard to start with (DD1 really was being v naughty and it made me v cross, so was hard to ignore), but this approach had very clear results very quickly.

I also made an effort to keep DD2 safe and out of the way (I had a playpen in which I set up a kind of baby nest with a soft fleece and a nice mobile etc - DD1 couldn't get to her so I knew if I had to pop to the loo or cook DD1's tea that DD2 would at least be safe from biting or poking.

DS due in 12 weeks (DD2 will be 2 yrs 2 months), will my adorable, cuddly baby transform into the horendous biting kicking screaming monster DD1 became on DD2's arrival...... help..... I do hope I can manage it all a bit better this time (but I doubt it!!)

Oh gawd, we're going through this and DS is now 3 months. I think the thing is to try and ignore a lot of the bad behaviour unless you just can't. Hitting/hurting DS is an aboslute no no, sit in the hall on her own thing. As is throwing things aggressively. But you just can't pick every battle and fight it. Just try and remember to praise her a lot when she's quietly playing.

PinkTulips - I think you're absolutely right about 2 still being a baby and its so easy to forget this when DD is screaming at me as I'm trying to get DS to nap. Or when she hits him with something when all he's doing is smiling at her!

Going through this now. I am extra sweet to dd1 and call her my baby all the time. I don't blame anything on dd2 (eg, I can't do that, now dd1, I have to feed dd2) and I do what I read here on mumsnet, saying 'What's that dd2? You want to eat (whatever dd's eating)/play with (whatever dd1's playing)? Oh, yes it does look delicious/fun, but I'm sorry, you're too little.' Don't give her a hard time, even if it seems to work better, she's really upset and sad now.

we had the opposite problem with dd when ds was tiny... she was in serious danger of loving him to death! i'd go into the kitchen for 20 seconds to get something with him supposedly safe in his playpen and come back out to find she'd chucked every toy in the room on top of him... even the heavy ones becuase she thought he was bored and wanted to play.

she'd show him a toy by walloping him in the face with it and then be upset when he cried!

like i said, looking back she was a baby herself but i'm embarressed to say i got so frustrated when she hurt him or was badly behaved i simply couldn't comprehend that this huge toddler (in comparison to my precious newborn anyway... in actuality she was a dinky little girl for her age) wasn't doing these things as some sort of campaign of terror against me but simply because she was too little to know better.

when i see the things ds gets away with at 2.5 because 'he's only little' compared to what dd got punished for i really do feel horrible.

i'm hoping this time i'll be more aware of how little he actually is, and she is for that matter, and not expect them to be 'the big kids'

Suwoo, i my 3rd is now 10 months, and there is a 21 month age gap between each of them, DS1 was great when DS2 came along, so it was quite a shock when DS2 found it extremely difficult to tolerate DD.
He has been very aggressive, not in a premeditated way, more like a swipe if he crossed her path, and has been having big tantrums, honestly I have found it extremely difficult to manage, and the only way I have found that has any effect is to be really consequent with him, (I don't think it necessarily matters what your consequences are) he knows now that I will follow things through even if the circumstances are difficult.
The other thing of course that has made a huge difference is his language skills developing.
Sorry, know this is really badly written, hope it makes sense to somebody.

I had exactly the same age gap and it was hell

I'm not sure if I can give any constructive advice, because I don't think I handled it particularly well. But now dd1 is 3.11 and dd2 is 19 months and they get on absolutely brilliantly. There is still a fair amount of hitting and fighting over toys but 98 per cent of the time it's a joy to watch them together. I think all you can do is emphasise how much you love dc1, remember they are littler than you think, make a huge deal of the baby responding positively in any way to dc1 and grit your teeth and bear it . The time will honestly pass in a flash but you have all my sympathy. Good luck.

wow, thank you all for your responses and experiences. I think you are all right in that I prob expect a more mature behaviour from a 'baby'.

This afternoon I took her upstairs to nap and she began the "don't want to sleep" routine so I lay on the beanbag on her floor and actually fell asleep myself. She asked to lie in my arms and half an hour later I awoke again to find her sleeping soundly in my arms - the joy! She has NEVER been one to sleep in the arms.

I will take all your advise and try to chill as much as possible (although that was my original strategy). It's just the aggression towards dd2 and others that I find hard to cope with because almost always it was not expected and she gets this possessed look in her eyes when she does it

Any more advice greatly appreciated

I think it's very hard to chill when your firstborn is attacking your baby, all your mother's instincts come to the fore.

I feel my blood pressure soar and - according to my dh - I look quite crazed with rage when dealing with such incidents . So please just breeeathe. Remember also that jealousy is the most base and most common human emotion. People kill for it, so it's hardly surprising your dd1 looks a bit nutty, but it doesn't mean she's going to grow into a serial killer, just her little world has been thrown off orbit and she has no other way of displaying this to you.

And as I said, if you keep up the "you two are such good friends" patter it will eventually improve. Apart from anything the younger one will get more robust and eventually will be able to hit/pinch/bite back. Part of the advantage of siblings is you learn how to jostle for position in the world, v valuable experience imo.

BTW, for those of you expecting - You can do all you like to prepare your first dc, but imw it doesn't really help. Some children are either too old or too young to react badly but if the baby comes at the "wrong" time for them psychologically you just have to put up with it.

good post dbc

yeah sounds great
i used to put dvd on after luch for ds2 instead of nap and am firm believer in hourly or so fruit and toast when they're teeny!