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New to Mumsnet DESPERATELY seeking help with 4 yr DS - out of control..... This is a Loooooong one....!

14 replies

jenthewren · 06/01/2009 12:15

Am mum to 4 kids and a stepson, so 5 in total, the oldest 2 are 11, then there's an 8 then the 4 then a 1 year old, but my 4 yr DS is driving us ALL to distraction! Think should give a bit of background so there's a better understanding of our situation. I had my 11 DD and 8 DS from a previous marriage, met my current DH who had his own 11 DS, so straight away we had 3 kids! Then DS4 came along, and he was spoilt.....! We had concerns about his behaviour/development as he still wasn't crawling or making any 'babbling sounds' at 18mths, he had the most outrageous tantrums where he scream, throw things and headbang (so much that he would make his head bleed) and were referred to consultant. At 2yrs, we found out he was partially deaf, then as if by magic over the next 18 months everything came at once, he almost skipped the 'babbling' and crawling altogether and went straight to talking and walking. Behaviour seemed to settle down for a while, but just recently he's become AWFUL! He's scarred my eldest DD's face with scratching, screams whenever he has to get up in the morning, punches and kicks while I try to get him dressed for school, if he doesn't like something any of us say to him, he'll say shut-up and call us a name, the tantrums I could deal with if they didn't go on for so long. He can honestly keep up a screaming fit NON-STOP for well over an hour. I'm sure he knows that it doesn't matter how long it takes he just has to keep going till one of us gives in...which more often than not is DH.
I used to have better control over him and was very strict about bedtimes, sweets & boundaries in general, but I took very unwell just over a year ago, after DD1 was born and DH had to take 6 mths off work to watch kids - that's when everything went downhill and I've never been able to gain control again since.
It's sooooo embarassing going out with him, several times I've ended up breaking down in tears in the middle of the street, I can't chase after him with buggy in crowded streets and he seems to have no fear of losing me.
We can't get him to stay in bed, he sleeps as and when he wants, where he wants (which is often a case of falling asleep on the sofa at 10pm then waking up at 6am, if not through the night with night-TERRORS which he has often) I spent 5 hours the other night putting him to bed over and over, he eventually fell asleep on the floor after screaming for 5 hours. But later woke up through the night and came straight into our bed, so I get up take him through to his bed, then wake up in the morning and he's there beside us again!!
I know this is awfully long winded, I just don't know how to gain control back, I feel as though I'm doing it on my own, DH always gives in and as long as he's doing that it undermines me, the older kids are always laughing at him when he's being naughty - which doesn't help, and now tha DD1 is up and about he's getting all rough with her and I don't want her copying his behaviour!
Basically HELP!!!!

OP posts:
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bodiddly · 06/01/2009 12:20

Wow, sounds like you are having a rough time. I only have one ds .. and he is just coming up to 4 so I am probably not the right person to talk to. In the first instance though I think that I would sit your husband and older children down and seriously talk to them about what a problem this is becoming and what you want to achieve and that you need their support. Your husband needs to support you 100% and there is no way you can do it if he or the other kids undermine you. He needs to be disciplined in the same way by everyone or things will only get worse.

bodiddly · 06/01/2009 12:24

I then think you need to address each issue individually. He is old enough to understand - I would do a "supernanny" on him and explain to him a new set of rules and that they are to be adhered to with a set of consequences! ie. no hitting, no arguing, a set bed time. Everything that you expect from him. But you have to stick to it 100% every time. My ds has gone through phases of kicking off about various things and I have a total no tolerance policy with him. He will NOT get his own way if he is being bloody minded. It may take a few weeks but if you all pull together I am sure you can get it sorted before your little one starts copying him!

bodiddly · 06/01/2009 12:25

As I say I am by no means an expert but it does sound a lot like many of the typical situations that supernanny sees. Perhaps you could look at her web site or look at some of her old episodes for inspiration. Sorry not to be more help!

jenthewren · 06/01/2009 12:30

Every little helps - thanks!
Didn't realise supernanny had a website - might have a look at that now....!
Yo'd think I'd be a dab hand at this.....but DS4 was DEFINATELY sent ot try me!!

OP posts:
DesperateHousewifeToo · 06/01/2009 14:28

The other thing to thing about is 'praise'.

Trying to find good things to say to him and tell him when he does something/behaves well.

I find it very easy to get into the habit of only telling my two off and often have to think very conciously about praising them. Try to be specific about what he has done well. e.g. '' well done ds4, you are sitting very sensibly at the table''.

Also, I know it must be very hard with 5 children all wanting attention, but how much individual attention does he get from you and dh? Do you think part of his behaviour is to get attention, any attention whether it is good or bad. Of course, when he is being bad, he'll be the centre of attention!

Can you and dh, try to spend time with him on a one to one each day and do something, even if it is to read a book togther, or play a game. It could be his special time.

Hope that might be of some help.

Good luck

claw3 · 06/01/2009 14:35

Jenth - You have hit the nail on the head yourself. He screams until one of you give in!!

Dont give in, i know its hard, anything for a peaceful life an all. At 4 i would put him in his room until he stopped screaming.

jenthewren · 06/01/2009 15:00

I do try not to relent and give in, but I will have to make that an 'ALL-THE-TIME' and not just 'SOME-of-the-time'! I think the praise thing and one-to-one time is the key to this - thank you! It is a busy house and I try to spread my time evenly, but it's not always easy....! I'll try that and see what happens.
Going to sit EVERYONE down tonight and talk through how things are going to change, but how long will this take do you think?
Has anyone out there, experienced a similar situation to this, of setting down new rules and wanting to see a change in behaviour?
I'll do it for as long as it takes, of course, but the sooner the better, for my own sanity!

OP posts:
claw3 · 06/01/2009 15:14

I think you will be surprised how quickly it can work if you stick to your guns.

I have 3 ds's and a stepson at weekends, quite busy here too. When explaining the rules, make sure you explain the consequences of what will happen if the rules are broken too!

Good luck

piscesmoon · 06/01/2009 15:34

I think you have got some good advice. It will be hard to start with because he isn't going to believe that you won't give in. If you are consistent, he will get the message in the end. Perhaps you need earplugs!!

bodiddly · 07/01/2009 13:59

how did it go last night?

jenthewren · 09/01/2009 17:59

Went really well, then on Wednesday we all stuck to what we agreed and found DS4 quite responsive, Thursday however was very VERY trying - but we still stuck at it.
Today he was just average but this is the first time we've ever made it this far without giving in.....so fingers crossed!I'll keep you posted....!

OP posts:
bodiddly · 09/01/2009 18:34

that sounds great! Well done and good luck with keeping to it!

mynewnickname · 09/01/2009 21:48

Well done on trying to make changes.

My thoughts on reading your OP were:

  • never ever give in to whining/ tantrums. None of you should give in. If ds strops I ignore him, explaining before and after that he will not get what he wants by behaving that way. I am very matter of fact.
  • He might be tired given he sleeps so sporadically. Impose a tougher bedtime routine. Most children this age behave better if they are well-rested.
  • Attention might well be an issue. A disproportionate amount of posts on MN about 3 to 5 year olds behaving in challenging ways seem to involve some sort of attention thing e.g. new baby has just turned up or there's a large family, (not saying all kids in that situation play up btw).
Quite often a child of 3 or 4 will tolerate the baby until they start getting mobile and for some reason it seems quite common for them to play up when their younger sibling hits about 1.

Also agree with the praising the good someone else mentioned. And choose your battles.

Good luck.

crissit · 12/01/2009 12:04

I'm new to mumsnet; but definately not, to not being a mum...I have 6. My middle child used to cause these outbursts as yours does and doctors suggested to take him in to this specialist to make sure he wasn't having some sort of seizures that may be causing him to act this way...I had to take him in whenever he would have these outbursts, so they could check him out. They did find that he was and put him on some medication to stop them.

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