OK, what would you have done? - very long, sorry

[jessia]

Was picking my DD2 (almost 3) up from nursery yesterday and saw her little friend in the cloakroom with older woman (grandmother?) and older boy 7 ish? (maybe cousin - I know she doesn't have a DB).

[bit of background] We know the family slightly - my DH works with both parents and we occasionally meet at work family bonding dos. The mother is a bit volatile (to say the least) has an odd, confrontational parenting style (I am being very generous here), imagine she has some depression-/other coping-related problems. Involves screaming at the girls (10 and 3) e.g. if they don't want to eat as much as she thinks they should eat, even in public, among work colleagues (happened last weekend, witnessed it).

ANYWAY: as I walked into cloakroom, said little girl was having bunch pulled out by said boy. DGM? gave boy a sharp telling-off and then proceeded to lay into little girl as she yanked her poor little head around putting bunch back in. Needless to say little girl was sobbing by this time, so she got told off more and planted roughly onto bench (she's a skinny little thing, so imagine this must have hurt) for DGM to yank (not pull) socks up and put shoes on.
All the time this DGM was going on and on at her for being a "bad girl", insubordinate etc (not English, we live abroad but I am bilingual so am not misinterpreting, only the language used to children here is not quite the same).

I was just standing there, literally open-mouthed, was so gobsmacked I hadn't even rung for my LO. I said hello to the little girl and called her by name and said a few nice things to her so DGM would realise I knew her and perhaps ease off a bit. But no, she just carried on.

So I rang for DD and started getting her changed, all the while this is going on behind me. Then as they were going out, DGM did the classic: pointed at my DD (who was as shellshocked as I was, kept saying: that's my friend X, she's crying) and said to poor little girl: "Shame on you X, look at that good little girl sitting there and being good. And you're carrying on like this, you're impossible"... cue yadayadayada more slagging poor kid off.

SO I couldn't contain myself any longer and I said to her: "Well, if I spoke to my DD the way I've heard you speaking to X she would be howling too. I've never heard anything like it." She stared at me as if I was coming from Mars and said: "But she's so bad, she's impossible." And just went.

I took DD out into the car park and burst into tears on DH's shoulder. We discussed it and he has said he will speak to little girl's DF at work today. THing is, we don't know which DGM it was (his DM or hers) though judging by grandparenting style probably hers.

Do you think I should mention it to nursery staff?

Sorry just had to get this off my chest, was so upset. Thought of more things I could/should have said to DGM afterwards but judging by her response it probably wouldn't have done any good.
I just feel so sad, they must be such an unhappy family (though fairly well off) and they are replicating problems from one generation to the next.

Unfortunately I think this is how a lot of children are treated. If she did this in front of you, I think this is probably normal for her. I don't think its much you can do.

Its very sad to witness though. I have been in similar situation and known people like this and they see it as normal. They are just "disciplining" their children

Really? That's so sad. Am I that naive? I mean, I lose it occasionally, but for specific things, and if I shout (yes, it happens ) I shout about that particular thing. And never for having had soemthing unpleasant done to them. I mean, what happened to the cuddle?
And I have never ever seen it in the cloakroom... People are usually so pleased to see their kids again and vice versa that there are hugs everywhere

Good for you to speak up but unfortunately, whilst her parenting style is absolutely shocking the grandmother/ mother is not doing anything utterly wrong (like hitting, slapping, using excessive force, swearing). Provided the child doesn't seem obviously physically or emotionally hurt, I guess it's just the way it goes.

Of course, to play devil's advocate, they may simply think that you're just too soft on DD and let her get away with murder and that she'll grow up to be a hooligan drinking on street corners at eleven years old. (Of course she's wrong but she may think that all the same!)

not a very nice thing to witness at all as parenting style is so different to what you would or how you would treat your children

i dont think much can be said as sounds like this is how they treat dc all the time

if mother does it maybe she herself was raised that way probably by the woman treating little girl that way

and they probably see nothing wrong it is very sad whan dc is being told they are naughty and hard work when they have done nothing wrong but in all honesty doubt they will change how they aprent at all

all you can do is show little girl kindess and praise her when you see her and she can get some knowledge that she is not that bad

but she will be the one probably to grow up with an attitude as will rebel i guess with no kind words given

makes me sad to think of poor child just so sad not knowing what they have done lets hope at home it isnt always this way

But you see I think slamming an already crying 3-yr-old on a bench is using excessive force. But maybe I'm over-sensitive

And TBH I have never ever seen that child smile. And I see her every day at nursery and have been away on 2 or 3 weekends with them. The elder girl seems impervious to it all, water off a duck's back type thing, but the little one is always grimacing, crying, grumpy. I know some kids are like that but after having seen the Dm at the weekend and the DGM yesterday I begin to wonder.

try not to think too much about it some people dont know how to cope with kids not everyone treats thema s if made of china

some people think some force of plonking them down is ok maybe the fact that child was already upset has made this worse for you

but although she may have had force and bit of telling off it is normal for child of this age to become upset they can cry over anything

just see that parenting styles differ we dont all see things the same way but no real harm was done to little girl

i think you have taken this little girl into your heart and cans ee you dont like the way she is being parented but nothing im afraid can be done about it

i would be shocked and upset but i wouldnt get involved unless child had been harmed in some way

I think it sounds like emotional abuse tbh.

Slaging a child off for no reason and making her feel bad about herself is a classic example.

Yes, I agree it is emotional abuse and totally ignorant parenting/grand-parenting.

I agree abusive too. I hate it that mostly we don't feel able to challenge people's treatment of children except in the most extreme circumstances. You did well to tell the woman she was out of line. Do you think your DH will speak to the father? Perhaps it would be helpful??

He said he would, have to wait and see till he gets home. Sometimes the father is out of the office and I don't think talking to the mother would be a good idea

Good on my wonderful DH.
He did speak to the father - and it turns out it was his mother (i.e. paternal grandmother). He said he had no idea she was like that, but that he had always wondered why the little girl didn't like her grandmother Well now he knows.
Think we did the right thing, Thanx girls for support.

Well done. You obviously did the right thing!!

Good for you J. So many people see things like this and do/say nothing - it sounds like the child is being singled out and punished and dare I say bullied within the family. It also sounds like this may have been passed down a generation if it is the Maternal GM. Poor poor little girl she must feel miserable.