8yo DTS2 just so unpleasant!

[PennyGreen]

After an awful morning with DTS2 nearly bringing me to tears...

He can be kind, lovely, caring. But around 75% of the time is just deeply unpleasant to me, DP, DTS1 - rude, unhelpful, defiant etc. I'm at my wits' end really as I cannot work out why - even school have noticed it and suggested counselling, which upset him despite me framing it as a positive thing.

Today he picked and picked at DTS1 KNOWING that it would make him explode in rage - no reason, they were both dressed for school and DTS1 was off to get his breakfast, not even looking at DTS2. DTS1 exists on a short fuse anyway and DTS2 pushed his buttons deliberately.

The DTs are our only two DC, I do most mornings as DP usually leaves earlier for work, but even when he's around DTS2 is like this. The DTs do a couple of clubs together and a couple apart, they're also in separate classes at school so it's not like they spend 24/7 together, but DTS2 seems to be unable to stop picking at DTS1 even when told (for example) stop or you'll lose your iPad for X time. And I stick to the punishment, it's not like he knows I don't mean it!

He was such a lovely, placid baby and toddler - DTS1 on the other hand was a nightmare! - and I know has found school/ friendships harder than DTS1, but still, school can't identify anything either that would make him have such big emotions. We spend time with him on his own, I encourage him to talk about his feelings or write them down if he'd prefer, and still we get these massive toddler/ teenage strops.

If anyone has further suggestions they would be gratefully received!!

Has he always been like this? If so, have you considered ADHD? Sounds very very like my 9yo DS with ADHD. He’s not a twin but cannot help himself picking at his younger brother.

Thank you @freespirit333 - I would suspect ADHD for DTS1 as he has many of the typical symptoms (hyperactivity, poor sleep, restricted eating, poor impulse control - and so on!) but DTS2 doesn't really have any that I can think of. The constant fixating on DTS1 is the only one I can think of - he moans that 'everything would be better without DTS1' and so on, but won't leave him alone even when DTS1 is doing something perfectly peacefully without him!

I do think school overwhelms him in some ways but without knowing in what way and how often, there's not a lot I can do - his teacher hasn't noticed anything either. I just think how do people have pleasant mornings where kids don't go for each other?! Mine spend less than an hour together and are already at each other's throats by the end of it!

It’s so tricky. I’ve found this hard to manage as they get older to be honest (9 and 6 now) because the older DS2 gets, the more DS1 seeks him out to wind him up. He clearly thinks he is the most annoying person in the world and sometimes I do sympathise, but other times DS2 is minding his own business and DS1 goes out of his way to wind him up!

On school mornings I take a pretty hard line and if there’s a lot of it, I give one warning to then lose screens after school. Doesn’t always work but at least makes him think twice. I have also been really strict if it’s happening on bikes or scooters and then make DS1 wheel his bike/scooter all the way to school, which does go some way in teaching him a lesson! So I’d be tempted to take a pretty strict stance with your DS if he’s been warned.

Yep, same here @freespirit333 - I think because DTS1 has more friends, DTS2 often tries to join in and then muscle him out - then when it doesn't go well, DTS2 is upset there too!

They had a massive fight after school today, DP was collecting them and rang me in a panic (at which point I did think JUST COPE WITH THEM, IT'S WHAT I HAVE TO DO - but anyway!) and again, DTS2 has completely overreacted over something small and gone for DTS1, leaving him with scratches. He has been told by every adult in his life - parents, grandparents, school etc - to just walk away when he gets annoyed and let an adult deal with it, but no, he has to lash out.

I'm just so bloody fed up with the lot of them, including DP for his lazy parenting - but I am sticking to my guns, DTS2 had his football sticker album removed the other night and desperately wants it back for the last day of term on Friday, but that won't be happening unless I see some spectacular behaviour improvement!

No behaviour improvement from DTS2 in fact he was even worse today - I got so fed up with him completely ignoring me when I asked him to do things like have a shower, brush his teeth etc that I said I'd take his new toy away until he'd got himself ready for bed - well. Utter meltdown. Hitting, shouting, scratching, swearing, the lot. It took a good hour to calm him down and get him to go to bed, which means that no doubt he will be exhausted and snappy tomorrow too