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Help me sort out dd's pooing issues!

36 replies

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 14:17

Dd has always had some sort of issue with pooing.

When she was first dry in the day, just before she was three, she wouldn't go anywhere near the toilet to poo - she would only ever poo in a nappy, at the same time every day, and in one particular spot (as far away from the loo as she could get, natch). She was terrified of using the toilet to poo and would become completely hysterical - so we stopped trying to force the issue and allowed her to have a nappy. This went on until she was four and a half when she finally began (reluctantly) to use the toilet.

She's coming up for seven now, and still has issues. She will only poo at home, which means she ignores the urge to go when she gets it, and then she then finds it difficult to go when she gets home. She's not constipated as such because the poo is soft, but because she hangs onto it, it compacts and she struggles to pass it.

Even when she's at home she ignores the urge to go - we have to make her sit on the toilet every night before her bath and try for a poo, and every night we get the screaming abdabs because she reckons she doesn't need to go. But if she was left to her own devices she would never go at all, so we have to make her try once a day at least.

We started to get somewhere over the Summer holidays last year - she was just about starting to take herself off to the toilet when she needed to. But once she was back at school she soon stopped that because she won't use the school toilets, and we were back to square one again.

She won't wipe her own bottom either (I've taught her how so she knows how to do it - she just prefers not to). Because she's always at home when she poos, she calls us to wipe her and because of the problems she's had it's always been easier to do it for her. But if we ask her to try, she gets upset because it's horrid and dirty and she can't do it.

She's been seeing a paed for urinary tract problems, and the paed thought that part of the problem was the fact she withholds poo. She asked us to give her Lactulose, which she said would make it hard for dd to withold, and she's been taking 5 teaspoons a night for well over a year ... it hasn't made the blindest bit of difference.

I don't want to resort to laxatives, because she really doesn't need them - her problem isn't constipation, it's a behavioural thing. But I don't know what to do. The GP just says to keep shovelling the Lactulose in, but it's really not helping crack the behavioural problem.

Any thoughts? Anyone been in a similar situation and have any bright ideas?

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Twiglett · 27/02/2008 14:20

sorry haven't been there.

Is she NT?

I don't know if it will help but have you tried doing some biology work? In terms of food going in mouth and this is what happens in the body .. stomach, intestines (goodness taken out etc) leaves waste and comes out as poo

understanding the physical process might help

also has she seen you poo?

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 14:24

Yep, she's NT.

We've read books about pooing, we've had chats about how it all works, and she finds it all very interesting - asks loads of questions - but it doesn't make any difference.

She used to come into the toilet with me so she's seen me poo but a long while ago - not sure she'd want to do it these days though!

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Twiglett · 27/02/2008 14:27

sorry, out of the realms of my experience so bumping for you

choccypig · 27/02/2008 14:29

You are not alone. My DS is very similar, and when he needs to go his behaviour gets terrible. Thought I'd cracked it by bribery (computer time only if he goes without being reminded) over half term, but back to the same performance last night. Usually, he finally admits he needs to go at bedtime.. so gets to bed late. He has no issues with poo as such, and is not constipated, it just seems to be a habit.

choccypig · 27/02/2008 14:29

You are not alone. My DS is very similar, and when he needs to go his behaviour gets terrible. Thought I'd cracked it by bribery (computer time only if he goes without being reminded) over half term, but back to the same performance last night. Usually, he finally admits he needs to go at bedtime.. so gets to bed late. He has no issues with poo as such, and is not constipated, it just seems to be a habit.

choccypig · 27/02/2008 14:29

You are not alone. My DS is very similar, and when he needs to go his behaviour gets terrible. Thought I'd cracked it by bribery (computer time only if he goes without being reminded) over half term, but back to the same performance last night. Usually, he finally admits he needs to go at bedtime.. so gets to bed late. He has no issues with poo as such, and is not constipated, it just seems to be a habit.

choccypig · 27/02/2008 14:29

You are not alone. My DS is very similar, and when he needs to go his behaviour gets terrible. Thought I'd cracked it by bribery (computer time only if he goes without being reminded) over half term, but back to the same performance last night. Usually, he finally admits he needs to go at bedtime.. so gets to bed late. He has no issues with poo as such, and is not constipated, it just seems to be a habit.

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 14:29

Thanks, Twig

Normally I'd tend to be relaxed about these things and let them happen when they do, but I have the feeling that if I do that, things are never going to change.

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choccypig · 27/02/2008 14:30

O sh*t he's not that bad. Is there a way of removing superfluous posts?

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 14:31

Ah, choccypig - bribery doesn't work when they're so determined, does it!

We tried bribing her once with a big jar of chocolate lollipops - which she adores. They all sat there and went past their sell-by.

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julesrose · 27/02/2008 14:48

Sounds tough for you both every night. How about a total change of tack. Have a chat with her to start new chapter... you're 7 now and pooing is something you can be in control of, you know it's important for your body etc and it's hard for both of us to have to fight about it every night... Give her loads of opportunities to be in control over other stuff to do with her - clothes, food, going places etc and make sure she's drinking enough water to not get constipated. Perhaps dried apricots as well. Leave subject well alone for a good few weeks and see if there's any change. Good luck.

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 15:11

Thanks, Jools.

She drinks plenty and is reasonably good about eating fruit - heaven only knows how much worse it would be if she wasn't!

We try to allow her plenty of choice in the things she does, wears and so on, and she's pretty happy with the amount of say she has in our lives (she's an only child, so no siblings to fight with over that!).

Will try having another chat with her but I am really loathe to leave her to her own devices - she will simply not go, so she'll end up unable to go, so it will hurt her, so she'll hang onto it again ... it really is a deep-seated thing.

Will try though ...

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WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 15:12

Jules, not Jools - sorry

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Desiderata · 27/02/2008 15:19

She's obviously frightened of the whole process, which is why she needs to do in at the same time and in the same place. It's the only thing that makes her feel secure.

I've just come out of some major pooh issues with ds (admittedly he's only three), which started when he developed a tummy bug a little while ago. It turned out that he was withholding his poo (having never done so before) because he literally thought he had a bug in his stomach .. a spider, and that it would come out and bite him if he poohed.

I'm not suggesting this is what ails your dd, but if you go along the 'Can you try to explain to me what it is you're frightened of' route, she might give you some clues.

I feel for you, WWW. It must be really stressful for you.

Desiderata · 27/02/2008 15:20
WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 15:31

Oh, Desi - your poor little ds!

Dd was certainly frightened when she was younger - hence the hysteria. And I know she's frightened of the school toilets ... there are three sets of toilets at school, but she will only use one cubicle out of the whole lot because she's scared of the other ones. I haven't had the feeling that she's scared of it when she goes at home but you might be right.

My instinct is just to relax and let her get on with it, which has always been my philosophy, but at nearly 7 I think she's likely to become so fixed in her ways that if I leave it any longer it will be even tougher to crack.

They are such complex creatures!

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phlossie · 27/02/2008 15:32

That's what it sounds like to me - a fear. My sis wouldn't use the loo when she was little because she thought there was an owl down there that would peck her bottom!
Can you ask your GP to refer you to someone who can deal with this sort of thing? Maybe your dd's school could help? I'm sure that child pyschologists/behavioural therapists could get to the bottom of her problems, and have tried and tested tactics of helping children overcome these kinds of fears.
Good luck.

phlossie · 27/02/2008 15:33

'get to the bottom of her problems...' Sorry about the appalling pun - completely unintended.

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 15:38

Puns are OK. So are superfluous aitches

Am smiling at the idea of an owl being down the loo waiting to peck her ... I remember having similar thoughts myself, now that you mention it (I think mine was a crocodile though).

The GP just keeps telling me to increase the dose of Lactulose. I guess it's time to push for something more though.

Thanks all

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Poledra · 27/02/2008 15:41

My 4-yo dd has had problems with constipation, which have also led to her holding it in (as it hurts to poo) and has given her urinary infections. We di do the lactulose thing, and that worked for a while. She's now on Movicol, with is another bulking and softening agent, so not an irritant laxative (which I would disagree with giving to a child). We also have glycerine suppositories to use if she gets to more htan 5 days without a poo. We have only had to use these once, as now I say to her 'If you don't poo today, Mummy will have to put the slippy medicine in your bottom' and strangely enough, she always manages to poo then. I suppose what I am saying is that it might be worthwhile seeing the GP again (or maybe another GP at the practice?) and see what else you can try.

Desiderata · 27/02/2008 15:52

Yes, I must say that the GP sounds about as helpful as a brolly in a sandstorm.

Time to push for something else, as you say (and again, pardon the pun)!!

Sparkletastic · 27/02/2008 15:53

Wanted to sympathise as have had a similar issue with DD1 but nowhere near as bad - she did the whole withholding poo - only doing it in a nappy 'in secret' thing up until she was 4. Lactulose helped as she couldn't avoid having a daily poo and so got more used to it. A sticker chart with rewards and lots of books on pooing seemed to finally do the trick. She made us wipe her bum up until recently until I just refused and now she's okay as long as there are weeeeeeeeeet wiiiiiiiiiiipes (her constant cry) to hand!! It is kind of faecal OCD behaviour. Would a nice doctor or nurse talk the whole thing through with her so it isn't a war of nerves with you?

WigWamBam · 27/02/2008 16:00

Oh yes - we have to have the wet wipes! She won't even begin to consider dry paper.

I'm not sure Movicol would help, really - it's not a constipation issue and never gets to the point of not having been for five days because nasty old Mummy packs her off to the toilet and makes her try (and if I do that before a bath, the warm water from the bath is very often enough to tip her over the edge and get her running to the toilet!)

Have thought about having a chat with the school nurse next time she's in ... but it's an open session with lots of parents in the same room, and I'm not sure I want other mums earwigging.

Might ask to see one of the student GPs at the surgery - they might be a bit more open to other avenues than Lactulose.

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Sparkletastic · 27/02/2008 16:17

Good idea WWB - it is as you rightly say a psychological issue at root not constipation so she really needs kiddy 'therapy' rather than medicine.

stleger · 27/02/2008 16:19

My ds had major problems... even when they were solved he would sometimes worry about going. We used a little vaseline to 'help it slip out' - would that help? (I think it was called magic potion, we also had visits at night from a toilet elf who checked the star chart...) Is it the toilet itself, would the potty be easier - I know she is big in relation to a potty! Just the position, suatting, might help? And try something more 'extreme' than lactulose if you want, it did nothing for ds. MIL who has issues swears by linseed!