HOw normal is dreadful behaviour in a nearly 3 year old? At te end ofmy tether

[popsycal]

DS2 is 3 in March and I am finding him harder and harder to cope with.

He can be really obstinate and difficult and rude. He can also be absolutely gorgeous and charming.

Somerecent examples:
Shoe shop. Big tantrum as he did not want to get his feet measured. Shouting at the top of his voice 'No way stinky poo lady. Me no want your shoes'. We left the shop.

Silly walking backwards each day on the school run. Dropping to the floor when walking resulting in 3 hospital visits to pop his bones back in place.

I have stopped taking him to playgroups as he refuses to sit down at juice time,is generally obstinate and runsround like a lunatic doing singing at the end.

Today. Photo session with cousins to get a photo for grandparents for Christmas. Took 15 mins to stop the tantrum. Then the sillybehaviour started. Running around like a lunatic, refusing to do as he was asked. When he eventually sat down, he stuckout his tongue,did the opposite of what he was asked to do and was generally uncooperative.

He is a long term poor sleeper and I am sure that this has something to do with it. But my temper is wearing thin. I am unwell myself. I don't know where to start with disciplining him and also wonder whether there is more to it than normal toddler behaviour.

I'm hoping it's fairly normal. I have a 3yo whose favourite word (in fact at the moment it's pretty much his only word) is NO. And jis 5yo brother, while vastly improved since starting school, responded to having his feet measured recently with "NO!!! NO!!! BIN THEM ALL!!! BIN THEM ALL!!!"

So not very encouraging for you really...

This could be my son. His new one is "pith off fatty".

he also never seems to get enough sleep. I really thought there was more to this behaviour, than just terrible 2/3's.

He started at Nursery in August and he an absolute angel, when there.

I am hoping it is just a stage.

I also stopped taking my son to toddlers as he used to run round the room pushing the painting easel.

I will follow this with interest.

How is your DS eating?

3 way harder than 2 IME. he is still v young though so i think ignoring most of the undesireable behaviour is still the way to go. I try and just use 'discipline' for yje things i know ds should know better about. the rest of the time i try to just ignore it or apply positive encouragement to get him to behave in a more socially acceptable way.

I have a ds who has done some or all of these (though, oddly, shoe shops are a great treat for him for some reason ).

popsycal it is exhausting. People don't give you any credit or sympathy for the sheer physicality of it, never mind any of the psychological effort that goes into worrying about your child's place in this world, pretty much all the time. I've got two muscular injuries now that are not healing, because I have to wrangle a strong ds on a nearly daily basis. If you are unwell as well, you must be exhausted.

The only thing I find that works is the "How to Talk So kids Will Listen" approach, ie not shouting, not punishing. There are times though when I lose it totally.

Sorry, Icon, but I am roffling at 'pith off fatty ...'

If it helps, (and it won't) mine turned three a couple of weeks ago and he's pretty much a full-on nightmare.

Please, dear God let it be a phase.

it is probably a vicious circle. a combination of normal toddler behaviour, excacerbated by lack of sleep and illness.. which makes it harder to be strong ...

i presume you have tried pretty much everything re the sleep, including a sleep clinic?

must be so wearing, day after day.

I keep meaning to dig out that bookagain - it workedwellwith ds1 in the summer.

I am sure that his sleepis at least in part the issue. I amgoing to compose an emailtoday to the consultant who I STILL HAve not had formal feedbackfrom regarding ds2's sleep study in September and tell himthat things are deteriorating. He also has intermittant problems with his hearing....

I am just exhausted and fed up with this and a combination of other things too

roffle at "pith off fatty"

I wouldn't mind but I have gained weight, he knows what to say and where to say it.

It does not help that his brother "teaches" him words to say to us. Thankfully his speech is not quite up to scratch so I can disguise what he says, sometimes.

"Idiot" and "sucking" are another two of his favourites atm but we turn it into "Oh yes you would like a lolly to suck!!"

Anyway, I must go and rescue the cat before DS finally manages to suffocate him - he is in the tv unit [cat and child]!!

They are dreadful from three to four-as in DREADFUL!! You do find coping mechanisms though. My dd started nursery in October (is 4 in March) and gets glowing reports daily, she is so polite, she does exactly what we ask, she is a delight, etc. The second I get her home she starts screaming about how much she hates me in real Damien-esque style voice and "hates" everything, even if it is something she asked for two minutes before, throws her food on the floor, ignores chastisement, naughty step doesn't work, love and cuddles doesn't work, nothing. Then is suddenly sweetness and light again. They are weird at this age, but am currently taking the view that as long as 85% of the time the are brill in public then you have done your job beautifully. It's normal, don't worry!!

Although I have found that if you are in public with then if you are being sweetness and light and sweetness and light with them, the second they do something naughty you bend down with your face to theirs in an instant, and in a quiet, horrid witch hiss voice and with pointed finger you say "don't you EVER let me see you do that again. That was VERY naughty" and then explain to them exactly what they did that was naughty, why it was hurtful to you, and the proper way to get their desired outcome in a normal voice, and then just as quickly turn back into sweetness and light. I have to take my dd to a lot of corporate dinners as I'm a single parent can't always afford babysitters, and it works brilliantly as no one sees you chastising them, it rarely causes a mass tearful scene and yet they don't do it again.

My DS2 is mostly not like this, but I think he has a cold right now, and has been having horrible horrible screaming tantrums. He turned 3 at the end of September.

Yesterday he tantrummed for about half an hour because he didn't get a drink from a water bottle before his brother. This morning he tantrummed for at least half an hour because when he woke, I came to see him, said I needed the loo, offered some options and ran off, so he cried and screamed and shouted on my bedroom floor for forever.

He does seem to have some self-control, if he's losing it, he gets himself out of my arms ASAP so he doesn't end up hitting me. But he's clearly just raging ...

That all sounds very normal to me. Its enough to drive you crazy isn't? I'm really sorry that you are having a rough time This to shall pass.