3 yr old sleep time - cause for divorce!

[Trimum2]

Our toddler has lights out at 8pm after an hour of bath, stories, good night kiss etc.

All fine EXCEPT...

My husband stays with him sitting in the chair until he falls asleep. All fine for him as i think he enjoys spending time with him... but

I STRONGLY believe that after an hour of going to bed it should be night night and lights out.

Last night we had a huge row because DS got out of bed at 8.20 came downstairs and I put him back 3 times (DS getting steadily more naughty each time, last time trying to wake the baby)

As I was putting him back, DH came upstairs into his bedroom and said "Its ok, go downstairs, I will sit with him"

I haven't spoken to DH since. I was so mad. I felt he completely undermined me in front of DS - who straight away said "I want daddy to sit with me" with a smirk on his face. Of course, he prefers nice daddy who sits with him until he goes asleep to bad mummy who carries him back to his bedroom and tells him in a stern tone - its time for bed.

After 13-14 hours of looking after the DS1 and DS2 (who is a baby), I don't feel its unreasonable to want to be able to come downstairs and make my dinner at 8pm.

DH would argue that for the sake of 15-20 mins if you sit with him he goes asleep with no fighting.

I can't argue with that point, but it just seems wrong....

Pls help. Should I cause even more marital discord and stand my ground?????

Hmmm, I actually agree with your dh. It's nice for a child to fall asleep with someone there. Why not let them get on with it?

He can if he wants I guess. its just i don't want to. i guess i have had enough of them all day when i am on my own. maybe i should just lighten up......

Have you both agreed that it should be lights out at 8.00, and DH is backing down for an easy life, or has he always maintained that he would like to sit with DS until he falls asleep?

I think if he is going back on the arrangement and undermining you in front of DS then he is completely wrong and you need to tell him this.

If there was never an arrangement in place and you have fallen into a pattern of you doing it one way and he's doing it another, then it's time to talk about the issues agree on how you want to do bedtime.

Obviously in the long run it will make it easier for you if DS can go to bed on his own and fall asleep. By the age of 3 he will learn to use as many delaying tactics as he can to get you to stay, and while it's only 15 mins now you may find that DH is up there for an hour sometimes if he can't get away!

Whatever you decide you should be backing each other up though.

thanks good advice

wanting the easy life i'm afraid. he agrees it should be 8pm and done. in theory!

i will talk to him tonight. i was so upset at bing made look a fool. a 3 yr old knows it too!

I think your DH is making a rod for his own back. This could get really dragged out. What happens if he wakes in the night? Would your DH be as happy to sit with him then?

I think that a child should learn to fall asleep on their own. There may be a time when your DH works late/out for the evening/away for whatever reason. What would happen then?

I am sahm of 4.4 year old who has just started reception and 17 month old, me & DH take it in turns to put both children to bed, or we are both there for bath time and have one child each to dry and put to bed. Sometimes I am out or my DH is out so there is only one of us in the house. Both children go to bed easily because we persevered.

If you went out for the evening and your DH HAD to sit with your eldest and the baby needed him he would have to go see to the baby.

In the long run I think it would be best to nip this in the bud now. It may seem easy now but this could very easily escalate.

Oh and I am not a harsh mother, I don't believe in controlled crying and my youngest who was ill slept on me in the day till he was almost 1. But the evening is the time for me and DH to be on our own, eating an uninterupted meal, adult conversation etc

Funny you should say that Fizzylemonde - DS1 woke at 5am on Saturday morning and DH sat with him to go back to sleep then too. I think I might remind him of that tonight!

I really agree with you. But I thought maybe I was over reacting. Its not that its a huge issue now, but like u say, its one of those things that can easily get completely out of hand.

i will try to have sensible discussion about it this evening. and get over being upset about being made look like an idiot.

I agree with your dh. I think it's lovely of him that he's okay with sitting with your ds until he falls asleep. Why not use that time on your own to unwind a bit. Let your dh settle him. I don't think it's "making a rod" at all, I think it's making a little boy happy and secure and giving him and his dad some memories to build. I just think it's lovely

Agree with Juuule.

My daughter often needs us around to go to sleep. That's fine.

I don't like going to bed on my own either .

FWIW, as the mother of two older children, both of mine, who had previously been very good sleepers, started to get extremely anxious about going to bed and being in bed alone at ... precisely the age of 3.

I believe it is a developmental stage - they start to become aware of the dark and imagine monsters and have nightmares.

I did the returning to bed thing with both of mine (sitting outside bedroom door and wordlessly putting them back to bed if they got up immediately after I'd left the room) for a few nights. But if they woke up in the middle of the night, I allowed them to come into bed and sleep the rest of the night with me. With my son this lasted for six months, until he was about 3 and a half. He would appear 3 or 4 times a week. Now he is 4 and never gets up and I sort of miss it!!!

I never wanted to have fights in the night and I had faith that it was something he would grow out of. And so it was.

Trimum2 - I stand by what I have previously posted. My friend's friend has just been to a sleep clinic with her 3 1/2 year old as he needed his mum or dad to be with him whilst he fell asleep. This was proving more difficult now that they had a 14 month old baby and they were at the end of their rope with his constant night wakings (previously had been a good sleeper)

The sleep clinic ALWAYS gets you to teach your child to sleep on their own. In their case it was gradual withdrawal, so they sat on a cushion at the side of his bed for however long it took for him to fall asleep, each night they moved it slightly nearer the door.

I think part of the reason your DH wants to be with your son is because he works and he miss him (understandably) I, like you, am a sahm and need a break from the children which for me is night time.

If you are not happy then you need to address this issue but it could escalate and he may end up in there all evening (have you seen House of Tiny Tearaways?) I believe the record set for rapid return was over 150 times in about 4 hours for a 4 year old!!!!

And I stand by what I have previously posted too. The worst possible time to try and start sleep training is at age 3. You should have done it earlier, or leave it til later.

The rapid return to bed thing was hard work, but it did the trick for both of mine AT BEDTIME. Later in the night, my second child would regularly wake up again and come and find me. I chose not to fight against it because he shared a room with his older sister and it would have disturbed her too much to have to-ing and fro-ing and crying in the middle of the night.

He grew out of it within 6 months and was no trouble once he came into my bed to sleep with me. We were all happy and he grew out of it. I was not making a rod for my own back at all. Those 6 months flew by and now I miss sleeping with him from 2am or 3am onwards.

I just think 3 is the worst possible time in a child's life to get tough over sleep training if they have not experienced it before.

At the moment it takes your dh 15-20mins for your ds to settle. It may never get any more than this. If it did become much longer then you could review the situation and I'm sure your dh would then want to. I wouldn't spoil what your dh and ds have together now for fear of what it might turn into when it may never happen that way.
We have had 9 children, some have needed us to be with them while they fall asleep and some haven't. They grow out of it. They get older and then they get more understanding when you talk to them. I, too, am a sahm and understand that you want some time to yourself. Your dh might like this time with ds. Use the 15-20mins for yourself. I can't see any reason to put a stop to it at this point.

I think its good for children to go to sleep on their own and not be dependent on something or someone to get to sleep. To get into this habit whilst it is nice for your ds could make life difficult later on. My dd's 3 and 2 have a bath or shower, brush teeth, up to bed, story lights out that is it, I am lucky that they rarely get out of bed or wake in the night, but I do think this is not all down to luck its down to them having a routine and knowing what it is. Both my dh and I can do this so can grandparents.

I don't think smug replies like Helen's are all that helpful tbh.

To repeat: both my dcs, a girl and a boy, had perfect routines that worked like clockwork until the age of 3. There is something that happens to children at age 3 that is to do with their development, that causes them to be difficult about going to bed.

It was a stage they went through. It is over now for both of them. I decided not to ignore their upset about bed-time or being alone in the dark at night at age 3 because I did not think they were "trying it on" because they had both been good sleepers for the two and a half years previously.

If they are not already able to go to sleep on their own at age 3, then I just think age 3 is the worst possible time to start trying to force them to do so. Sorry but I do.

daphne so sorry you found my reply 'smug' it certainly wasnt intended to be that way, I was saying what I did and what worked for me, no more smug than your post stating what works for you.
All SIX of my children, four older and two young ones have had the same routine and it works. I have had them all wake in the night and be upset at various time but it was not something that suddenly happened at three, it happened at all ages.
As a parent you do what best suits you, I needed a good night routine I had four children under five years old and then two under two. It would not have suited me to have them come into my bed, it suited me to go up to them and reassure them and settle them in bed.

This is a child going to bed on his own, though, who doesn't want to be on his own. And the dad is happy to sit with his ds for the 15-20mins. I think that's nice for both of them and gives Trimum2 a breather.
I have also read that it's a stage of development of a child's imagination between the ages of 3y-5y.

Totally agree with juule. No point addressing it if it's because it 'might' escalate to being worse at some future point. If it's 20 mins now that your DH is happy to do, then fine, no problem, and there's no point in anticipating problems that might not come.

150 times rapid return in one night is not so much sleep training as spirit breaking, in my book. It may be advocated by St Tanya of Byron, who I do think is fantastic, however it's not something I would be at all comfortable with IF the alternative is a calm and loving 20 minute wind down with a parent.

the only issue could be if its only trimums dh who can settle him though, it could potentially make things difficult if he is not around to do it for some reason. If it works for them to have someone sit with him at night until he is asleep thats fine, but it obivously isnt something that the op is happy with

if dh is happy to do it then let him although he should just read him a story and leave him to it

Why just read him a story and leave him to it?
That might take longer than just being with him quietly.

i ment if dh really wanted to spend time with him at night as i dont understand the sitting with him untill he falls asleep think its a bit of a bad habbit to get into my ds loves his room grabs his [boppy] and heads off we put him in his cot with his book he says nite,go and is asleep two minutes later it might be different for us ds is unsociable when tired

oh i do put him in with us if he has a nightmare or is sick but after an hour or so he gets up and tries to climb into his cot he loves it lazy bugger

Thanks guys for all your thoughts and comments. Had a good chat with DH last night. Despite saying previously that he agrees that an hour going to bed routine (Bath, teeth story, kiss etc.) and not sitting with him until he goes asleep is what he wants ... it turns out that behind all that he actually does like sitting with him as he considers it his "special time" with him.

I think we will probably end up with some kind of compromise where he sits with him but leaves before he goes completely asleep. So in theory we get the best of both worlds - they get to spend their special time together and DS feels secure, but not making him dependent on him staying there until he goes asleep. (I know all fine in theory!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

I put DS to bed last night and just before he goes asleep, I get into bed with him for a chat with his teddies and good night hug and then get out of bed after 2 mins explaining that I am starving and I need to have my dinner. He seems to accept it. Well last night he did anyway!

I guess I will just have to keep an eye on how "my nights" on my own are going with my method and try to see if that goes ok. And when DH is around, I will just stay out of it. Then DH can spend his "special time" with him when he puts him to bed. And assuming that the baby is gone asleep I will get my 15-20 mins all to myself

I think the most important hting is that you and your DH have talked about it you are cmoing to a compromise and trying to solve the problem. As long as yu can continue to talk about it and work it out together, you are doing really well. Its half the battle sometimes...

working against each other.. adn children are very canny at this age... they pick up on evrything and are blooming good at using it to their advantage. dont give him anything to use.. work together and be consistent. even if its tha Dh always sits until he is dozy, and you get in to bed for a bit then leave.
YOUr Ds will very soon realize that this is what mummy does, and this is what daddy does.